Is destroying the same as destrucion?

[Stiel]

Well this is my first time so i'll hope you find it an interesting subject.

Problem: It is clear that nationality is a mayor part of the game. This means that french people remain french during the game.

But what will happen with the french people if you manage to occupy all french cities. Will they remain french and have the oppertunity to revolt against you. Or will they all obey your rules which will mean that there are no french people left.

What do you guys think?

 

[DaEezT]

Interesting question.
Maybe it depends on the rules. In Civ2 u could select that dead civs are not allowed to restart. Maybe when that rule is enabled, the french(in your case) will become ppl of your nationality and when that rules is disabled(= Civs are allowed to restart) those ppl keep their nationality till the end of the game.

 

[PROMETHEUS_TS]

I hope that the french will be able to be assimilated by the new conqueror's culture little by little but if in the mainwhile the all french cities will have been conquered ........well it would be nice if they could revolt if not yet assimilated !!!

 

[Scout]

This aspect of the game hasn't received a lot of attention, but I think it's really interesting... but these kinds of details will determine whether it really works out to be a plus.

 

[GhostMutt]

My guess would be no. Wasn't there a reference to the populations dying, as well as being assimilated? Along those lines, in 100 or so years, assuming you kept all the captured cities of the conquered civ content, the population would be assimilated based on your culture ratings, and the last old farts kicking the bucket. "when I was your age, we were a great people..."

 

[RallyK]

I say no also. After a civ is destroyed all population is assimilated.

Think about it the other way. If your civ is destroyed, will you have to wait for the outside chance that your people will revolt and give you another city? That doesn't sound right at all.

 

[Robespierre]

Realistically: yes they should be able to overthrow you, even if you've conquered their entire civilization. The Polish didn't overthrow the Germans and the Russians in their lands until after over a hundred years of occupation, and France certainly didn't cease to exist when the Germans conquered it in WW2.

Gameplay-wise: probably not. Once you conquer all of a civ, the nationals will probably still resist you, but they won't recreate the vanquished nation because there just wouldn't be any logistical way to incorporate that into gameplay. For example, if you get all your civilization conquered, what do you do? Do you keep waiting over the years as a passive observer to see if your citizens overthrow their oppressors and recreate your nation? There's just no way it would work.

 

[Stiel]

My proposal:

When a civ is being destroyed the people must keep their original nationality. This has to be lowered with an x ammount each turn. Or in x turns....

This has to continue until all people of the original civ are transformed to your own civ.

Example: I destroy the German civ. They stay this for a number of turns. Untill they are all transformed to my civ they have the oppurtunity to revolt.

 

[Robespierre]

That would certainly give a greater incentive for destroying those last few cities of a conquered civ to make sure they are totally vanquished and begin to assimilate. Also, if you got conquered you could still stay on for x number of turns to see if your people revolted and regained their independence, and after x turns were over you will have lost for good because your civilization will have assimilated into the conquerors'.

 

[Heffalump]

I don't think citizenry should ever "transform" to other nationalities, even over time, although that may well be the case with the game.

We do know that new population points will be of the nationality of the conquering power. So if you conquer a city in the early days it won't really matter before too long because citizens of your nationality will soon exceed those of the old nationality. The difficulty would come in conquering large (size 12+) cities of another nationality.

Also note, I read in one of the reviews that Firaxis allows you to pick the nationality of your worker or settler when you create one. So it seems to me that you could use this as a means of diluting the nationality of an occupied city.

 

[Monte Pyton]

the whole aspect of nationality and culture resistence does of course add lot to running your empire. if i'm following the conversation right: Is it true that after conquering a foreign city, that city be opposed to your occupation and refuse to work for you; but with time, the city will settle down and not be a problem?

is this correct?

...and how much do these cities resist you after your conquest?

 

[Sparrowhawk]

What I'm wondering is this:

Once you have either captured (enslaved) an enemy settler, or captured an enemy city and created a settler out of a citizen of enemy nationality, what happens when you use the settler to make a new city? I would expect that it makes a city of your nationality, but if you think about it logically, it shouldn't. The new city should be of the same nationality as the people that made up the settler were!

 

[Monte Pyton]

of course i could be (and probably am) wrong about this but i believe i heard that even captured settlers often refuse to work. i also think ( i dont know why ) that when you do build a city with that settler, it does produce a city for your civ but with the foreigners nationality

like i said earlier though, i'm sure this doesn't sound right though---anybody else?

 

[slothman]

Let's say that the French people could revolt after the French cities have been taken over. They may wait 1000 years to return the captured Paris to the French. But if YOU are the French the you would be sitting at your computer for 1000 years (game time) with the off chance that you might get do start playing again. Of course most of your people would have converted to the enemies culture by then, but hey you never know.

 

[PinkyGen]

If anyone ever played BOTF, you know that there was a moral of your people. When you suceeded, morale went up, when you failed, morale went down. (Slightly differed per empire.) When you conquered an enemy planet, their morale was quite low. You could declare martial law to keep them in line for a while, and build some improvements to improve morale.
However, victory elsewhere raised the morale of all cities, including the conquered ones. Thus a huge victory would make the city less likely to result. However a huge defeat would give them hope, and make them more likely to revolt.

This won't be how it is in Civ III (never got to export population) but I think it was a fair system. (Except in BOTF the Fed's could never control the population, but that's another problem.)

 

[Robespierre]

The nationality feature will add lots of intricacy to the game. Take this situation for instance - you are the French and your city, Paris, gets captured by the Germans. Your French citizens resist the Germans and you eventually retake Paris (because you get it handed back to you by the British and Americans, of course) but meanwhile the population there has grown by 3 and all three of those new citizens are now German nationals. They grew up under the German system and believe themselves in heart to be Germans, even though they are really Frenchmen. Now you have two opposing nationality groups in the city - the pro-French and the pro-Germans - and the city will be plagued forever by some sort of strife, because no matter whether the mother civilization (France) or the aggressor (Germany) controls it there will always be foreign nationals in the city. That's assuming, of course, that one of the civilizations doesn't gain so much of a cultural superiority that the foreigners just get assimilated, and if a third civilization comes to conquer Paris and holds on to it for a little while, the nationality situation will become even more intricate.