It doesn't take 40 years to walk 100km!!

Mujadaddy

Geheim Grammar Polizei
Joined
Oct 19, 2005
Messages
1,082
Hasn't that always been the biggest immersion-factor breaker with Civ?

Now, with teh magik of XML, I can finally fix it!! Here's the basic idea---

Modify the proper variables to give a more "realistic" progression for EVERYTHING.

...and the inner workings---

A. The first thing I'm going to modify is the "time length" of the turns:
  • 4000 B.C. to "0 A.D." --- 10 years per turn --- 400 turns
  • "0 A.D." to 1500 A.D. --- 3 years per turn --- 500 turns
  • 1500 A.D. to 1900 A.D. -- 1 year per turn --- 400 turns
  • 1900 A.D. to 2050 A.D. -- 3 months per turn -- 600 turns
This, to me, gives a much more realistic feel to how far the units are traveling as well as how long things take to build or improve.

B. Obviously, the <iWhateverPercents> all need to be adjusted, primarily so that technology discoveries happen at a historical pace, if not necessarily order ;) ... to that end, I think that ...
These need to be SLOWED down by a factor of FOUR:
  1. iGrowthPercent (Town growth)
  2. iCreatePercent (Project completion)
  3. iResearchPercent (Research :p )
  4. iImprovementPercent (Cottage -> Hamlet)
  5. iGreatPeoplePercent
  6. iCulturePercent
  7. iAnarchyPercent (makes you value Spiritual ;) )
  8. iUnitDiscoverPercent (Great Engineer Beaker Bonus)
  9. iGoldenAgePercent
{These need to be SPEEDED up by a factor of FOUR: <---EDIT: Jaynus has brought to my attention that this would produce Modern Inflation levels in the Ancient Era...so this needs to be experimented with.... first, I'll try keeping the Percents the same and SLOWING the Rate...}
These I'm not sure about because I don't know the actual game-effects:
  1. iHurryPercent (rate at which buildings can be rushed by gold and pop.)
  2. iHurryConscriptAngerPercent (How long the unhapiness lasts)
  3. iInflationOffset (How long before upkeep increases)
But these should probably stay the same:
  1. iTrainPercent (unit construction INCLUDING settlers!)
  2. iConstructPercent (building construction)
  3. iBuildPercent (worker improvements)
  4. iFeatureProductionPercent (hammers from Forest clearing)
  5. iUnitGreatWorkPercent (Great Artist Culture Bomb--makes it important!)
  6. iInflationPercent (rate at which upkeep increases)
  7. iBarbPercent (They're coming!!)
C. I think that this will do a few things:
  1. Keep the "yearly" march of scientific achievement semi-accurate
  2. Produce LARGE, ANCIENT armies and Empires because there's nothing else for the AI to do
  3. Produce VICIOUS, DECIDING wars when resources are revealed
  4. Give the player LOTS of time to play Civ4! :goodjob:
D. Is there anything I'm forgetting or not considering, ramifications-wise? I ask those who have playtested lots of "timing" mods... I'm probably not aware of any kind of Diplomatic relations duration "slider" ... anyone know where that is? I don't want to get super-good relations after only a few years of peace... Advice?
 
Just a quick thing I noticed giving this a brief read over (The mod im working on is practically doing the exact same thing, along with alot of unit additions for realism as well; email me jaynus@gmail.com if you want to compare notes).

But, heres an issue I ran into -
In the ancient/classical eras, there is practically 0 gold production; With a slower game, you go through alot longer without being able to make gold, obviously. Inflation in the game is literally just a gold upkeep you pay every single turn. I ran into *major* economic issues in the first 2 era's because obviously I had the ability to expand (part of the goal, ancient empires, classical greece, etc.), but I had *no* money to pay the upkeep on these ancient cities. The fix I came up for it was dropping inflation *significantly*, because its practically just a maintenance cost.

Just filling you in :) Sorry its so long. buuut...fast inflation will leave a civilization flat broke and doing no (10-0%) research in the early game, getting you stuck in ancient technologies and unable to progress.

I could be wrong, thats just the issue and workaround I came up with for it :)

EDIT: I forgot to mention of course it could be compensated for some other way hehe, just giving you a heads up it gets rough without some sort of compensation for it.
 
Jaynus:

Glad to see you found me ;) ... I'd like to compare notes as to how it all "comes together" if you will...

As far as inflation.... I wasn't aware of all the variables-over-time... it certainly bears experimentation... My thinking on that was that by having the villages & towns (and City Growth) expand SLOWLY, then that would make "perfect cities" the goal, not "many cities..." Perhaps we keep the AMOUNT the same but slow down the RATE, but only by a factor of 2 or 3, not four... That would keep the inflation amounts more under control, and would make Banking & Economics VERY important, without choking off the research rate...

I'm very interested in this time-scale modification scenario, and I believe that in my files I will refer to it as "Arch" or "Epochal" :)

(you might want to take down your email address---beware teh spam :lol: )
 
:lol: It's only around four times as long :crazyeye:

Who doesn't want to play MORE Civ? :D
 
Suggestion.
Call the speed "Legend," "The Ages," or "History" =)

I'll be experimenting with this as well.
 
Good ideas.

I'd love to see streched out eras + more unit building
 
Jecrell said:
Suggestion.
Call the speed "Legend," "The Ages," or "History" =)

I'll be experimenting with this as well.
You don't like "ARCH" or "EPOCHAL" ? :p :lol:

Note to everyone: I'm ONLY interested (at this stage) in INCREASING the number of turns. In the scientific method, you ONLY change ONE thing at a time... When I get the increased number of turns right, THEN I'll consider looking at the other mods the community has made...
 
Mujadaddy said:
You don't like "ARCH" or "EPOCHAL" ? :p :lol:

Note to everyone: I'm ONLY interested (at this stage) in INCREASING the number of turns. In the scientific method, you ONLY change ONE thing at a time... When I get the increased number of turns right, THEN I'll consider looking at the other mods the community has made...
Muja, fyi -- I have no idea at this point how to convert the time from years to months during the state of the game. Otherwise this can be fairly easy to implement.

To get started there's two files you're gonna need under...

/XML/GameInfo/
CIV4GameSpeedInfo.xml
CIV4CultureLevelInfo.xml

Under, CIV4GameSpeedInfo.xml
You can pretty much create your own speed setting with its own custom names and interval lists. Feel free to remove and add as many as you like. But there's a catch to this.

Under CIV4CultureLevelInfo.xml
If you define a new speed setting, you must also reference it in here or else you're gonna have LEGENDARY CULTURE for every city in the game the moment they're made.

That's all you need to modify the speed as far as I am aware of.
As for Arch and Epochal -- we agree to disagree. :)
 
Jecrell said:
Muja, fyi -- I have no idea at this point how to convert the time from years to months during the state of the game. Otherwise this can be fairly easy to implement.That's all you need to modify the speed as far as I am aware of.

As for Arch and Epochal -- we agree to disagree. :)
Thanks for the reminder about the Culture variable Info folder...

I saw that someone had found how to change it to months and whatnot...I'll find it again and post the link here...as well as update the OP when I've experimented a bit...

"Arch" is sortof a joke .... like "arch-villain" and "arch-angel" ;)
 
Mujadaddy said:
Thanks for the reminder about the Culture variable Info folder...

I saw that someone had found how to change it to months and whatnot...I'll find it again and post the link here...as well as update the OP when I've experimented a bit...

"Arch" is sortof a joke .... like "arch-villain" and "arch-angel" ;)
You can use the WBS to force the turns into month time, but I'm not sure if it's possible to -- during the course of a game -- go from years into months. If you get my meaning.

Just making sure.

If it's possible during the game to go from years into months -- that'd be wicked awesome. =)
 
Yeah, after I read it about 5 times, I got your meaning ;) .... You might be right...but I might just have to start it in Months, just jumping 120 months at a time, ya dig? The reason I thought it would be possible is that it did something like that in Civ2 & Civ3, as I recall...
 
It appears that since I want my LAST time increment to be Seasonal, I have to start with "Seasonal" as the calender type...

No problem--all I need to do is start after the first primeval thaw, in "Spring 4000 BC" ... then increment by 40 Seasonal_increments, to "Spring 3990 BC"

... then after 400 increments, change it to 12 Seasonal_increments, so it goes from "Spring 0 AD" to "Spring 3 AD"

...then after 500 increments, change it to 4 Seasonal_increments, so it goes from "Spring 1500 AD to Spring 1501 AD"

...then after 400 increments, the seasons progress 1 at a time.... Spring 1900, Summer 1900, Fall 1900, Winter 1900, Spring 1901

...no problemo :D
 
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