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Just noticed +5% beakers needed per city

Discussion in 'Civ5 - General Discussions' started by gamemaster3000, Jun 8, 2014.

  1. gamemaster3000

    gamemaster3000 Warlord

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    Is this new in Brave New World, and is it only on deity?

    Any thoughts on how the math typically works out, how many beakers a new city has to produce to be of value?

    Also, does razing a city send the number back down?
     
  2. TheMarshmallowBear

    TheMarshmallowBear Benelovent Chieftain of the BearKingdom

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    To clarify it's +5% increase (and that depends on map size only) on all dificulties, it is an increase in tech cost.
     
  3. Matthew.

    Matthew. Deity

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    Math varies quite a bit depending on several factors. But the basic summary is that putting a half-assed effort into developing each of your cities will let you break even or still get further ahead in science.

    Basically:

    1. Curb runaways and the snowball effect, which is notorious in these types of games.

    2. Prevent ICS strategies that are based upon excessive quantity over quality.

    It isn't a mechanic where you need to bust out a calculator each time you play and (in most cases) shouldn't even notice it.
     
  4. Loucypher

    Loucypher King

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    Of note is that on larger sizes, this penalty is less (Huge it's 2%).
    Generally speaking, a size 6 city with a library is already paying for itself. It's really not THAT big a leap.
     
  5. Matthew.

    Matthew. Deity

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    In the early game, yes. I've worked with the numbers before, but since then forgotten the exact outcome, but in the late-game you may need a library + university, or even a library + uni + school. Basically the further developed your core cities are, the further developed the new city needs to be before breaking even.

    But that late in the game it isn't exactly difficult to rush-purchase a library and university. It can slow tech in domination games where you are taking a lot of cities (puppets still increase the tech cost). But if you've made it to at least bombers, you could have zero science and still finish the game with ease, so even in those situations it isn't something to get too worried about.

    Edit: That is a lot of but's in one post. Sure sign I need sleep :)
     
  6. Matthew.

    Matthew. Deity

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    Oh, and on that note I've actually found myself annexing cities more often in BNW than in G&K. The new Ideology tenets give a ton of happiness and there are a couple that aid in getting courthouses up quicker. Annexing also allows either buying those science buildings or switching the city out of gold focus and building them likely MUCH sooner than a puppet would get around to doing so.
     
  7. Loucypher

    Loucypher King

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    Well, here's some very basic math, to show just how little impact it has.
    Let's say your next tech costs 1000 beakers, and you're producing 100. So in 10 turns, you'll have that tech done.
    You now found a new city. Suddenly, that tech costs 1050 beakers instead. In order to still get to that tech at the same pace, your new city only needs to produce a grand total of 5 beakers, so your beaker count is up to 105. Anything above that, and the city is improving your tech rate.
     
  8. Princeofnigeria

    Princeofnigeria The illustrious

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    Wait, is the increased cost linear or compound? Would a tech that normally costs 1000 be 1200 with 4 cities, or 1216? Do the increased costs stack atop themselves or just modify the base number? Because that number could become rather large later in the game.
     
  9. phillipwyllie

    phillipwyllie Wannabe Deity

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    Just checked with my current game where I'm in the Renaissance era with 3 cities. The Internet would cost 11339 from a base cost of 9860 which is a %15 increase so it's linear.
     
  10. Matthew.

    Matthew. Deity

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    It would actually be 1150. Capital doesn't count towards the number, if I recall correctly.
     
  11. phillipwyllie

    phillipwyllie Wannabe Deity

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    Yes it does. Before you found your capital check the cost for Pottery, and compare after you settle your capital.
     

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