K-Mod: Far Beyond the Sword

hey karadoc,

yes i saw the ai behavior, and i like it, it provides a great challenge for me and my friend.

but i have to agree the ai , mostly isnt so aggressive, there isnt enough wars between ai i think, and i dont get a lot of " a city has been razed/captured..."

i also support on tuning up the aggressiveness,

revdcm and rom a new dawn, have introduced a game option - ruthless ai. which made they ai, more ruthless. afforres took the aggressive ai option and added like a more powerful aggressive ai option.

besides that, im having lots of fun.
 
I think the ai is plenty aggressive enough (especially with aggressive ai selected), I just dont think the ai's are aggressive enough about stopping or at least trying to stop someone else from winning (perhaps easily predictable about 20-30 turns out).

The goal is to win, and I think part of role playing would be for everyone to act like they dont want to lose and take appropriate steps when someone gets close.


That said, Karadoc always has some badass new changes I didnt see coming :D
 
So I lost my last game when the Spanish declared war on me for like 150 turns (as the largest civ and with 2 vassals) and would only make peace for a city and a technology, rage! :D Then when I finally had him beat, he gets artillery tech and his massive amounts of artillery wears me down. I couldve done some stuff different though.

On to 1.26b...

I will say one more time, just to clarify, that I think the ai is PLENTY aggressive enough on "aggressive ai", except when someone is within 20-30 turns of winning, where it seems the ai takes no notice and loses a bit of the epic feel of the ai by not responding.

Attachment 1: Heres a new game with 1.26b and China expanded early onto a spot with 6 base plots of jungle, maybe this needs to be fixed?

Attachment 2: Turfan built on gold, good idea for them to do that or not?


Side note: Ever think about increasing the forget rate of "refusing to join war"? At least under certain conditions, like 1. already at war 2. very early game 3. No vision with the offending civ (to even know where to go).

Side Note 2: I totally love Swedagon Paya now! Pacificism actually seems alot more balanced. GJ Karadoc!

Side Note 3: I think this current game shows that the ai is plenty aggressive enough, wars all over the place, almost from the very beginning! I think the "building near the enemy's borders" change for the ai has directly lead to alot more early game wars....(not that I noticed a lack of them before)
 

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Is sevopedia didn't work? i already tick enabled sevopedia in bug option, restart the game and sevopedia still didn't show up. maybe i'll try it again later, who knows i missing something.

btw this mod is awesome;)

Edit: sevopedia really didn't work, i try again this morning and it's still no use. it will use standard civilopedia instead.
It work actually only IF it did not opened first by clicking "civilopedia" button in main menu. if we already opened sevopedia BEFORE game started it will use civilopedia regardless we use sevopedia or not. to enable sevopedia player must NOT open civilopedia in main menu, it must opened first in game screen by clicking brown book symbol. I hope it available though straight from main menu without starting the game first like BUG mod :)
 
@wolkenwand
Unfortunately BUG (and so K-Mod by adopting parts of BUG) had to hard code it so its one of the other dispite the option.

To get Sevopedia requires modifying the Assets/Python/Contrib/SevoPedia/SevoPediaUtil.py file and changing the "False" value(s) to "True"

*edit*

Pretty sure there is 2 values but only 1 changed to False in K-Mod so only that needs changing back :)
 
hey karadoc,

ive been building my mod on top of kmod as u may know,

and i wonder, does adding xml tags to the sdk, can cause oos in multiplayer?

or can i feel safe to say that only stuff that change game mechanics will cause oos?

for instance - ive added some xml tags to the civics, buildings and units - such things probably wont cause oos right?

(asking you since your like the multiplayer mod guru..)
 
Hmmm I ran into a wild peace streak time (globally), it started went I started drafting and slaving like crazy...

Does the ai recognize that you become one of the top 3 militaries and slow down their wars on purpose after that?

On the plus side, a random weak civ offered to vassal to me, that I had been keeping good relations with. :D

Right now, global peace has set in, and everyone is eye balling each other to see when the next war will dust off...Im making every effort to make my neighbors happy...

I ran pacificism for a long time (for the first time, ever) and then finally switched to theocracy. I saw several ais running representation for awhile...thought that was cool too.

Zulus came after me with a HUGE army. Idk how he did it. Like 5 trebs, 16 cats, 6 crossbows, 12 longbows, 12 macemen, 10 horsearchers, and 4 knights- when he only had an army half that size the last entire war. I had to beg for gold, and sell precious tech to upgrade enough axes to macemen, slave massive numbers of cats...then destroyed that army...and his power level only dipped maybe 10%. Wow.

Did I tell you I finally got the mauseleum wonder? And I got liberalism the same turn as an enemy civ, but I got it! Ofc I took nationalism and built the Taj Mahal, then switch to theocracy and nationhood . So close, epic!

So Shaka is still furious at me and the Mongols have the largest civ and two vassals (both are neighbors!) When will global peace fail?


edit: Mongols declare war on Shaka!!! I see the vast mongol army...with crazy upgrades marching past my borders!

Mongols attacked from two sides and one side took a city, then one side got crunched by the 30+ stack from the zulus, while seiging a city. Now the other side is pressing to attack another Zulu city. Zulus, man, fighting their hearts out this game. I checked their civics and expected they were the ones that got the pyramids and were using military police, but they do have vassalage and theocracy.

Epic game!!!!
 
@wolkenwand, you're right about the Sevopedia behaviour (ie. it does not work if you open it from the main menu), and Habitus is right about the explanation. It's a flaw in the implementation of BUG. The BUG options are not loaded until the game is started, and so BUG has no way of knowing which version of the civilopedia should be loaded from the main menu. BUG is configured to load the Sevopedia by default, so in BUG (and most mods with BUG in them) you get the Sevopedia from the main menu but you can't get the normal civilopedia from the main menu. In K-Mod, it's the other way around. You can't get the Sevopedia from the main menu.

I've got some ideas for how to fix the problem so that the user options can be properly respected, but I haven't gotten around to changing it yet.

@Keldath, I can't think of any reason why any xml changes would cause OOS errors. In fact, I'd go as far as to say that if there are xml changes which cause OOS errors, then that's a bug in the DLL. (ie. the DLL should take whatever precautions are necessary to prevent OOS errors regardless of what the xml says.)
 
ohh wee im so happy after two days of hard work,

ive finished adding lots of mod parts to kmod:

added advanced diplomacy 2
added occessional promotions
updated super forts tp 1.10 (without bombard still)
jimprovement limitations
free tech
city sizee prereq
better interception
civic specialist yields
influence driven war
dune wars city found value
movable mountains+dune editon
MULTIBLE RESEARCH
city size 3 - for larger cities (used to be always up tp 3)
updated spcecialist happiness and health mod.
added a bunch of python based mods -basic....mod:
basic_inquisition - need to set the building, tech, and civic allowing.
basic_forestry
basic_barbarian_gg_experience
basic_tech_conquest
basic_damaged_land
basic_limited_religions
added occessional promotions
civics plus extra tags
jooyo:
terraform code
sea tunnels
enslavment - civics
civic attitude change
improvement health
bonus commerence modifier
specialist commerce by civics
shkype vicinity
ruthless ai

now how fun is that huh?

ill upload to my thread the mod after i finish balancing all the new stuff, may take a while.

karadoc if theres anything you wanna add, plz tell me.

just felt like sharing my work :)

good week all.
 
Ummm. Are all of those modmods on or do we get to choose which one we want? (Good job anyway ;) )
 
Probably a minor bug...

Took a city and about 4 or 5 turns later, ai poisons its water supply...but its still "in revolt" for another 4 or 5 turns, so its not losing population.

Edit:
Im also seeing alot of ais, by pass rifling, and go for railroad, scientific method, and even biology...and they are paying the price in almost every case.

Edit2: I took the mongol capital 3 times (different cities) as I was taking over all his cities and he would never vassal me, even up until his last city. Werid. Maybe its because he had 2 vassals?
 
Attachment 1: Heres a new game with 1.26b and China expanded early onto a spot with 6 base plots of jungle, maybe this needs to be fixed?

Attachment 2: Turfan built on gold, good idea for them to do that or not?
Turfan looks like it's in a good spot to me. It's a desert gold, so it's not a great tile to work, and it gives him a 2 commerce city-plot, on a hill for extra defence, it meshes well with his other cities; and it gets the cow... So I reckon Turfan is fine.

That jungle city is also in a decent spot, but it's probably not a good choice for the first expansion, because it can't do much until iron working. Still, his options for expansions were actually pretty limited - so I think it's ok.

huh,

so i can add xml tags into the dll files with no worries?

does oos errors mostly cause from python files?

thanks.
I see. Previously you mentioned new civics, and buildings, and units; so I thought maybe you just meant xml changes only. But now I see that you mean adding dll code to support new types of xml tags. It's hard to say whether or not this will cause OOS errors, because it really depends on the specifics of the implementation of the new fields. But it's probably pretty safe. In general, OOS errors are created when there are things in the user-interface which can affect the state of the game. To avoid OOS you just have make sure that the only way the player can affect the state of the game is by issuing commands. eg. build such-and-such, move this unit here, and so on. If simply pointing to a leader's name can change something, then that could be the cause of an OOS error.

For example, pointing to a leader's name may cause the game to recalculate the leader's attitude rating, which may cause it to reassign its worst-enemy, or something like that, and thus change the outcome of future AI decisions. The most recent OOS problem I fixed was a bit like this. If OOS errors are to be avoided, then the key is to make sure that anything which can change the state of the game will happen simultaneously for all players. Most changes are pretty safe. The dangerous places are in the AI, random events, python controls which change the way the game works, and anything related to cache in the dll...

Probably a minor bug...

Took a city and about 4 or 5 turns later, ai poisons its water supply...but its still "in revolt" for another 4 or 5 turns, so its not losing population.
Well, many versions ago I told the AI to take the revolt time into account when evaluating poison / foment-unhappiness. Maybe the poison was still a bad idea, but I don't think it's a bug. I'm sure they had their reasons...

Im also seeing alot of ais, by pass rifling, and go for railroad, scientific method, and even biology...and they are paying the price in almost every case.

Edit2: I took the mongol capital 3 times (different cities) as I was taking over all his cities and he would never vassal me, even up until his last city. Werid. Maybe its because he had 2 vassals?
I agree that the AI undervalues rifling a bit. The thing that confuses the AI about rifling is that riflemen very general purpose, which is unlikely pretty much every other unit in the game. Riflemen in their prime are the best city defenders, and the best city attackers, and the best general fighting unit; whereas most other powerful units do not have such a broad appeal. Anyway, the AI currently doesn't really take that broad appeal properly into account - and so riflemen are somewhat undervalued in some games. (What tends to happen though is that if a strong civ gets cavalry, then every other civ will suddenly realise it's a good idea to start getting rifling...)

As for when civs will vassalate. I haven't looked at that much. It's still the original AI. (or maybe the BBAI AI, I'm not sure). Anyway, I haven't changed it yet. But I can tell you that it's quite an arbitrary calculation.. it depends on the number of units killed and the position on the scoreboard and stuff like that. Generally, units with vassals will be difficult to vassalate because their vassals are always below them on the scoreboard.
 
thanks for the answer,

basicly, im making 2 versions, one, that i added all of the above,

and one without so many changes, just a few added xml tags like - some new civic tags (like the extra happiness u added), some specialist tags and things like that.

i guess such things that , that only add xml tags of prereq for stuff or extra effects, wont cause oos, right?

things like advanced diplo may cause oos.

thanks karadoc :)
 
I couldnt expand anywhere.

I was so terrified of Mongols and the Zulus declaring war on me at the same time, or Pacal attacking from a different angle, and even China had been hostile recently. So I rushed Rifling (which is one of the best techs ever imo, especially for my English army!) and I used 10 turns of upgrading pikes with double city attack to rifles.

And spammed cats from my tech cities when they finished their monetary buildings. (Theocracy rules!)

So, nobody else got rifling, and some only got railroad for machine guns until it was much too late (Mongols). I think they all mass rushed scientific method (meh tech if you ask me). So I declared war on the Zulu finally and waited for them to attack me. They didnt take the bait, so I crushed their army in their land with a massive number of double upgraded cats (suicided like 14 cats on their main stack, to insta win the rest of the fight).

I took only one city, and Mongolia declared war on the Zulus (they were arch enemies thank god).

Mongolia was 2600 power at this point (I was 1900) so I made peace with Shaka (1700) and turned my army around, taking one Mongol city and then going for Mongolia's beautiful capital. And they would not become my vassal, as I took city after city, with barely any losses.

The north, Pacal, Portugal, and the Celts had a war top, but no one had rifles so very little land was lost/won. I think finally the Celts vassaled peacefully to Portugal, and Pacal could not take much land with them united. Pacal will later become the next super power after the mongols, with a huge gnp.

Side Note:
I noticed the Ai is VERY hestitant to build Rifles with city defense upgrades. Maybe 3 or 4 of them in a stack of 30 rifles...the city defense upgraded Rifles are almost as good as machine guns, on defense, imo. Would it possible to code the ai into keeping 3 or 4 city defense upgraded units (archers and longbows included, in previous ages) in each of their cities? I think that would be reasonable gameplay if they have the resources/experience levels...

I turned my super army around after defeating the Mongols many cities and even with no city defense, I lost as many as 14+ vital cannons to what seemed like mostly Zulu city defender upgraded rifles (odds wise not numbers wise)...Zulu capital gives their units triple upgrades from their massive Great Generals.
 
Major/minor annoyance...

Im at peace, and it seems someone, somewhere, is always burning down my buildings (I have friendly spies counter espionaging in my cities too)...normally it isnt that big a deal to replace the buildings, but Ive lost 2 monastary buildings in the last 8 turns, and I cant replace them because they are obsolete.

If we cant stop the ai from spy swarming you, even in peace, can we at least stop them from attacking irreplaceable buildings? Maybe the ai should save its epsionage for governor revolts or something during war time...just saying.
 
52+ Mayan infantry/42 Mayan cannons split into 2 stacks while invading Celtia...but Pacal is losing his border cities to Chinese forces...and the Mayans took the Celtic capital 3 or 4 turns ago and lost it again while off taking another city, a couple spaces away, because they didnt leave enough defensive forces.

Idk if this is a defense issue, like leaving enough defensive forces, or a scouting issue where they dont see the invading forces in time to defend properly.

sorry
<----super bored.
 

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karadoc,

i know u changes something in the unit military support test style, at first , i didnt see the text file change, bu then i saw in the civics that for like 1 militery support cosy i see a number like 12423543 - so i found out u did that change.

my question is - could it be that ur change affects other parts of the civics - ive added a like that adds commerce changes to buildings via civics - but the number get is similar - 4657687 style instead of like 10% commerce.

is the two related - or is it something i did wrong in my addition perhaps?

*****
ok what i wrote dont mater so much , now, i removed this code, i dont want to bug you with it.

*****

on another note - in my on going multiplayer game - me and my friend had a ctd - not an oos, just plain ctd -
we think it happened because my friend tried to choose and order units while he was under attack - enemy attacked the city, and he pressed on units to move inside the city - during that attack phase, that caused a ctd.

*****
ok i can defendantly confirm that choosing choosing your own units while the ai is attacking at the same time causes a ctd on multiplayer.

****
regarding vassal, the ai circled around my city, with lots of troops, and his vassal was also at the same spot, together, they could destroy my city easily, but they didnt, they just walked around the city a long time only pillaging, and when there was nothing to pillage they just stayed.
it seems they ai dont know that he has combined power of his troops and that of his vassal, maybe he needs to be taught that he can use both armies.


but the generally, the ai does war really good, i just love it, it so hard, and the ai act smart.
very well done karadoc.
 
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