LK94 - RaR, 25K blood fest
- Thread starter LKendter
- Start date
Doc Tsiolkovski
Deity
Isn't England close to be extinct? And this will kill your rep?
meldor
Deity
I see it and it is in the queue
meldor
Deity
1250 AD (0)
Nothing to change, I think this is going to be a builder set. We don't have enough fast units to take a go at anyone. I don't know why we are still at war with the Celts, I make happy with them.
(I) The Mali are going for the Persians like carazy. It might be a good time to hit them in about ten turns when all their troops are on the other side. The Aztecs take out the English. The Malinese are building the Crystal Palace and the Eiffel Tower
1255 AD (1)
(I) The Aztecs and Celts make happy. Start a prebuild in Salamanca. The Aztecs start the Crystal Palace and the Malinese finish the Arc De Triomphe.
1265 AD (3)
(I)The Mali and Aztecs sign an MPP, dosn't look good for the Persians. We get Mass Production and start Motorized Transportation.
1270 AD (4)
Swap to Crystal Palace due in ten. I will have to work on getting that down.
1275 AD (5)
Mass Production, 20gpt and 275g gets us City Planning, Coffee and Military Trandition from the Persians.
1290 AD (8)
I love it when the AI uses "rail to" and it goes across our territory. The Aztec and Mali are both railing squares in our territory. Pays for the fact that they have been blocking some of our rails.
(I) The Mali and Celts make happy.
840 AD (9)
(I)The people want to build the National Library.
850 AD (10)
I built some rifles, most of our cities have rifles now. The Mali have MotTran but the Aztecs don't. We also have some luxes we can sell to the Mali as well.
Nothing to change, I think this is going to be a builder set. We don't have enough fast units to take a go at anyone. I don't know why we are still at war with the Celts, I make happy with them.
(I) The Mali are going for the Persians like carazy. It might be a good time to hit them in about ten turns when all their troops are on the other side. The Aztecs take out the English. The Malinese are building the Crystal Palace and the Eiffel Tower
1255 AD (1)
(I) The Aztecs and Celts make happy. Start a prebuild in Salamanca. The Aztecs start the Crystal Palace and the Malinese finish the Arc De Triomphe.
1265 AD (3)
(I)The Mali and Aztecs sign an MPP, dosn't look good for the Persians. We get Mass Production and start Motorized Transportation.
1270 AD (4)
Swap to Crystal Palace due in ten. I will have to work on getting that down.
1275 AD (5)
Mass Production, 20gpt and 275g gets us City Planning, Coffee and Military Trandition from the Persians.
1290 AD (8)
I love it when the AI uses "rail to" and it goes across our territory. The Aztec and Mali are both railing squares in our territory. Pays for the fact that they have been blocking some of our rails.
(I) The Mali and Celts make happy.
840 AD (9)
(I)The people want to build the National Library.
850 AD (10)
I built some rifles, most of our cities have rifles now. The Mali have MotTran but the Aztecs don't. We also have some luxes we can sell to the Mali as well.
romeothemonk
Order of the Engineer
Got it before vacation.
romeothemonk
Order of the Engineer
IHT: Not much, MM Sal.
Turn 1: Mali build the Eiffel tower. Arrange builds to get the cheap and effective school of Scribes.
Turn 2: Motorized transport comes in. 600 gold and MT gets us flight from Persia. Get Tea, dyes and compulsory ed from the Aztecs for MT. Flight is only worth 955 gold as they were researching it.
Turn 3: Use some laborers and get cat from 114 spt to 143!!
Turn 4: Get the Crystal Palace. Sal starts a park.
Turn 5: MM some towns, start Sal on the National history meuseum. Pigtown starts the Military Academy. Mali and Persia signed peace for a fraction of a turn.
Turn 6: Mali demand tropical fruit. Nuts.
Turn 7: Sal starts the National gallery. Sugar and spice to Mali gets us cotton and gems and 9 gold. We build the Military Academy in Pig Town
Turn 8: Not too much. Start moving to set up an evil plan of mine. Call it payback.
Turn 9: Sal builds small wonder, starts a school.
Turn 10: Theory of Relativity comes in, get olive oil, 1500 gold and psych from the Mali for it. ToR and 900 gold gets us automatic weapons from the Aztecs, research set to tank warfare. Sal starts Edisons, due in 7. I will now pictorally try to tell a story.
I upgrade all our rifles to trenchers, and our leathernecks to amphibs. Research is now set to total war in 7. Upgrade our pikes and halbarediers. We can renegotiate some trades with the Aztecs, but I leave that to the next person. I do not think I violated any of LK's house rules, and now we are a lot closer to the driver seat of this game. We probably want to build the CIA soon now.
I am happy with this set as I got everything to work properly and got us some Techs, and no evil long term deals. This is a step to making up for the last set which was a double-bogey.
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads9/LK94-1350AD.SAV
If the MA was against house rules, here is the Autosave before I pulled it.
Hmm the file isn't uploading or attaching. I think this should be a legal play though.
Turn 1: Mali build the Eiffel tower. Arrange builds to get the cheap and effective school of Scribes.
Turn 2: Motorized transport comes in. 600 gold and MT gets us flight from Persia. Get Tea, dyes and compulsory ed from the Aztecs for MT. Flight is only worth 955 gold as they were researching it.
Turn 3: Use some laborers and get cat from 114 spt to 143!!
Turn 4: Get the Crystal Palace. Sal starts a park.
Turn 5: MM some towns, start Sal on the National history meuseum. Pigtown starts the Military Academy. Mali and Persia signed peace for a fraction of a turn.
Turn 6: Mali demand tropical fruit. Nuts.
Turn 7: Sal starts the National gallery. Sugar and spice to Mali gets us cotton and gems and 9 gold. We build the Military Academy in Pig Town
Turn 8: Not too much. Start moving to set up an evil plan of mine. Call it payback.
Turn 9: Sal builds small wonder, starts a school.
Turn 10: Theory of Relativity comes in, get olive oil, 1500 gold and psych from the Mali for it. ToR and 900 gold gets us automatic weapons from the Aztecs, research set to tank warfare. Sal starts Edisons, due in 7. I will now pictorally try to tell a story.
I upgrade all our rifles to trenchers, and our leathernecks to amphibs. Research is now set to total war in 7. Upgrade our pikes and halbarediers. We can renegotiate some trades with the Aztecs, but I leave that to the next person. I do not think I violated any of LK's house rules, and now we are a lot closer to the driver seat of this game. We probably want to build the CIA soon now.
I am happy with this set as I got everything to work properly and got us some Techs, and no evil long term deals. This is a step to making up for the last set which was a double-bogey.
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads9/LK94-1350AD.SAV
If the MA was against house rules, here is the Autosave before I pulled it.
Hmm the file isn't uploading or attaching. I think this should be a legal play though.
- Joined
- Aug 15, 2001
- Messages
- 19,964
@Romeothemonk - Please ask for a SWAP in the future. Please don't simply grab the game and play out of order!
Signed up:
LKendter (currently playing)
Romeothemonk (swapped)
Zavior (on deck)
Sanabas
Meldor
Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.
Remember the variant rules:
I don't want to give cities to the AI just to get more workers.
We must build a city known as sacrifice. That city must build a sacrificial alter, and no other culture buildings.
We may never acquire Monasticism and may not build the GL, Encyclopedia or anything else that puts us at risk of getting Monasticism.
Foreign slaves and workers may NOT perform any tasks except to walk to the sacrificial alter.
All AI cities must be razed to generate sacrifices.
I hope we have very few leathernecks. They are worst at defense then rifles.
Well I only see ONE save, so I hope I have the correct one.
Signed up:
LKendter (currently playing)
Romeothemonk (swapped)
Zavior (on deck)
Sanabas
Meldor
Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.
Remember the variant rules:
I don't want to give cities to the AI just to get more workers.
We must build a city known as sacrifice. That city must build a sacrificial alter, and no other culture buildings.
We may never acquire Monasticism and may not build the GL, Encyclopedia or anything else that puts us at risk of getting Monasticism.
Foreign slaves and workers may NOT perform any tasks except to walk to the sacrificial alter.
All AI cities must be razed to generate sacrifices.
romeothemonk
Order of the Engineer
LK, I thought I was up because you had swapped with Meldor. I am sorry if this caused any inconvience. We only have a total of 5 amphib units of any type. There are 4 amphib infantries and the leatherneck that killed the Celts. We only have 1 transport as well. I think the 6 gpt of unit upkeep and the ~500 glod to rush the transport worth it.
- Joined
- Aug 15, 2001
- Messages
- 19,964
OUCH - My bad.romeothemonk said:
My template was screwed up and didn't have the swapped marked correctly. Zavior should be back from vacation and is up.
Signed up:
LKendter
Romeothemonk
Zavior (currently playing)
Sanabas (on deck)
Meldor
Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.
Remember the variant rules:
I don't want to give cities to the AI just to get more workers.
We must build a city known as sacrifice. That city must build a sacrificial alter, and no other culture buildings.
We may never acquire Monasticism and may not build the GL, Encyclopedia or anything else that puts us at risk of getting Monasticism.
Foreign slaves and workers may NOT perform any tasks except to walk to the sacrificial alter.
All AI cities must be razed to generate sacrifices.
- Joined
- Aug 15, 2001
- Messages
- 19,964
I got a chance to look at the game. A few thoughts come to mind:
1) We are still way short of workers.
Meldor added 3, and RTM added 0. We now have the ability to plant forest. Kawauka has an absurd 14 excess food. The plains should be mined to reduce the food count. Low corruption Akwesasne is stuck at size 7, but could grow if we clear more jungle. A lot more cities are still suffering from bad tile development.
2) The 8 defense factor machine gunner is now available. This will hold up to the AI cavalry stacks. We need to get some of these built.
3) I can't believe we are the ONLY civ building Einstein's Lab. There are several killer wonders coming up. Spirit of St. Louis (colossus effect), and Steal Foundry (100% production boast) are some of the good ones. While the WW help isn't needed from Hollywood, the content face in every city would be nice.
4) More than 8 luxuries do NOTHING for happy help. I have seen that comment several times. We now have 6 natural luxuries and import 7 more. I tried an experiment and declare war on the Mali and the Aztecs. This dropped us back to 6 luxuries, as the Persian coffee route was broken. The net effect was ONE more unhappy person in 25K sacrifice. More then 8 luxuries is a waste of trade resources
We are throwing away 20/turn for useless coffee from Persia.
5) This is the big one. We need to change tactics and STOP grabbing more land. We want to get to 8 natural luxuries (the maximum that is useful) at stop grabbing land. We need the AIs to start building settlers like crazy as that slows down their development AND is the best source of sacrifices. We are nowhere close to getting the number of workers to kill, and even if we raze every city on the map that won't be enough.
1) We are still way short of workers.
Meldor added 3, and RTM added 0. We now have the ability to plant forest. Kawauka has an absurd 14 excess food. The plains should be mined to reduce the food count. Low corruption Akwesasne is stuck at size 7, but could grow if we clear more jungle. A lot more cities are still suffering from bad tile development.
2) The 8 defense factor machine gunner is now available. This will hold up to the AI cavalry stacks. We need to get some of these built.
3) I can't believe we are the ONLY civ building Einstein's Lab. There are several killer wonders coming up. Spirit of St. Louis (colossus effect), and Steal Foundry (100% production boast) are some of the good ones. While the WW help isn't needed from Hollywood, the content face in every city would be nice.
4) More than 8 luxuries do NOTHING for happy help. I have seen that comment several times. We now have 6 natural luxuries and import 7 more. I tried an experiment and declare war on the Mali and the Aztecs. This dropped us back to 6 luxuries, as the Persian coffee route was broken. The net effect was ONE more unhappy person in 25K sacrifice. More then 8 luxuries is a waste of trade resources
We are throwing away 20/turn for useless coffee from Persia.
5) This is the big one. We need to change tactics and STOP grabbing more land. We want to get to 8 natural luxuries (the maximum that is useful) at stop grabbing land. We need the AIs to start building settlers like crazy as that slows down their development AND is the best source of sacrifices. We are nowhere close to getting the number of workers to kill, and even if we raze every city on the map that won't be enough.
meldor
Deity
A quote from my turn log...LKendter said:
While it looks like we are thorwing it away, it was taken in a deal for tech. At the time lux was set higher. I worked on getting infra in to get more happiness in various places like the cathedrals that were needed. I assume Romeo continued that.
lurker comment: one benefit of hogging the luxes is that it denies them to the AI, creating the AI clowns that are so crucial long term. A corollary to this is that once one is in the driver's seat, shipping one's own luxes to dangerous AI's can be curtailed.
Doc, is LK correct about luxes over 8, or is something else at work here?
Doc, is LK correct about luxes over 8, or is something else at work here?
Doc Tsiolkovski
Deity
1) Lee is not correct. It was that way in PtW/DyP, but for C3C every additional luxury will cause one Happy Face (4 with standard Marketplaces/RaR Dep Stores). That is not overpowered, btw, but the reason why so many things can cause unhappiness.
2) Just noticed something unexpected while working on RaR1.04: 'Double Sacrifices' improvements are cumulative! So, if you need a lot more cp, you can revolt into the (admittedly and intentionally horrible otherwise
) Theocracy, and build a Holy Relic.
2) Just noticed something unexpected while working on RaR1.04: 'Double Sacrifices' improvements are cumulative! So, if you need a lot more cp, you can revolt into the (admittedly and intentionally horrible otherwise
) Theocracy, and build a Holy Relic.
- Joined
- Aug 15, 2001
- Messages
- 19,964
Doc, then please explain why my experiement in dropping from 13 luxuries to 6 luxuries only gave ONE more unhappy person in 25K sacrifice? Until you can give me proof on your statement I will never agree with it.Doc Tsiolkovski said:
romeothemonk
Order of the Engineer
During my turns I was working on getting our best cities better. This was my goal. Note in my turn log in 1 turn I got ~30 more spt in cat just from worker actions. I also greatly increased the spt count in pigtown, and the city by our coal, as well as 25k, and the city between 25 k and Sal.
I would not build any more military for a bit We are over unit support costs, and tanks can be built. Building anything else IMHO is completely ridiculus, even defensive units. Tanks are just too awesome in RaR.
It is an old habit to grab all the luxes possible. I would listen to the good Doctor on this one.
A thought though. We could stockpile Enemy workers in 25k, then revolt when we have ~100 of them, then let the blood flow. This is not forbidden in the rules, but might be against the spirit of the game.
I would not build any more military for a bit We are over unit support costs, and tanks can be built. Building anything else IMHO is completely ridiculus, even defensive units. Tanks are just too awesome in RaR.
It is an old habit to grab all the luxes possible. I would listen to the good Doctor on this one.
A thought though. We could stockpile Enemy workers in 25k, then revolt when we have ~100 of them, then let the blood flow. This is not forbidden in the rules, but might be against the spirit of the game.
- Joined
- Aug 15, 2001
- Messages
- 19,964
I agree tanks are awesome. However, I don't want to have my empire defended with tanks. They need to get on the offensive and that requires defensive units.Romeothemonk said:
What we DO want to build are some armies, and get the pentagon. 3 unit tanks armies will raze just about anything. Tanks with artillery support can pretty much destroy any units that invade our country. IMO we are still light on artillery.
My experiment that dropped from 13 to 6 luxuries showed very little happy effect. Until someone can prove to me that luxury #9 does something, I won't believe this.Romeothemonk said:
The Holy Relic gives CULTURE. Therefore, this building is prohibited.Romeothemonk said:
Doc Tsiolkovski
Deity
LKendter said:
Ok, you got me here - I never tested it conclusively, after I knew for sure a 9th Luxury will give another HF.
And, as always in Civ, the real answer lies somewhere in the middle between
and 
.Here's a large table.
And we see that a total of 11 Luxuries has an effect. More do not help, though they show to give HF in the box.
