Lux trading with the AI

[Whomp]

Recently I posted the disadvantages I see in lux trading to the AI's. The AI seems extremely reluctant to use their lux slider (if at all). Instead they'll turn citizens in their most productive cities into clowns. So, the way I see it unless you're getting a needed tech or the AI is completely backwards or you're getting it with an MA then you shouldn't make that lux trade.

Here are my questions...
Would it be true to say that the AI with the most luxs (traded or otherwise) will likely be the AI leader? I forgot but does the AI get more content faces at the higher levels? Are there any other things you look for when reviewing an embassy?

Some recent examples in demigod games.
In the picture below an embassy revealed the Romans had two luxs so no need for clowns.

On the other hand, the Mayans in the same game had more pop at 6 but only one lux and were already using a clown. Their research ran at 80%. If they were fed a lux it could be 100% and a lot more beakers than the Romans.

A more extreme example is the Persians in a game where they're at pop 12 but only have 1 lux. They're carrying 3 clowns rather than turn down science.

The Greeks in this particular game had 4 luxs and became the runaway AI. Eventually they needed a little to slow them down.

 

[Pentium]

Why couldn't they turn science to 100% with clowns?

 

[Whomp]

They could but science, shields, commerce and growth are all lessened by the clown. If they moved all citizens to tiles with 80-90% science instead with the lux slider of 10-20% all this would change. Maybe neutral on beakers but positive on the other three.

 

[Pentium]

I see your point. But you're just looking at one city, they probably have lots of them. If they are smaller than their capitals, a lot of gold would be wasted.

I would be nice if they were able to use specialists too.

 

[budweiser]

I dont think luxuries are the key. I think taking away their gold is more important. I think its more important for you to aim at getting all eight luxuries yourself even if that means trading two or three luxuries to get one (except if you are trading with the leader). After all you will be better able to manage your luxuries than the ai. I also think its better to use luxuries, resources and tech for barter rather than your gold. I think above all, you should keep gold away from the ai. Eventually you will be able to use your troops (shields) to take land and resources. Then you can control who has access to what via trade.

Did you ever notice that your advisor will always suggest that you acquire more resources and luxuries no matter how many you already have?

 

[Whomp]

I'm not sure I completely agree. I agree giving gpt to an AI is dangerous but lump sum not as much. In fact there are times where you can go back to that same AI and get back the lump sum plus gpt by doing a "2 fer". Unless I think gpt will give a positive return or a "3 or 4 fer" I can't do it.

In the case of the size 12 Persians they could add 6 gpt without 3 clowns in the capital and who knows how much more in the other core cities.

Sometimes a resource is ok because you force the AI to produce that product now. In turn, you can put them a resource recession.

On needed techs, 2fer's, weak AI's and MA's I see a lux as fine.

 

[mastertyguy]

Did you ever notice that your advisor will always suggest that you acquire more resources and luxuries no matter how many you already have?

I never listen to my advisors, unless deals and anarchy, because of this. Military says I shouldn't build military, when the AI sneak attacked me, because I don't have money, and I'm sure domestic could say you need more cities, when you disable dom+conquest and you colonize all your modded map size, and you get 512. When you have all ressources three times, they want you to get more, when you are 3 culture points to 100k, you should build temples in all cities, etc.

 

[Pentium]

Oh, advisors. Everyone wants as much as possible for his thing.

Of course it by far the best to control all the luxes and resources. But sometime you can't or just play a peaceful game.

Higher lux slider or a lux usually pays itself off by increased number of working laborers. So I always buy as many luxes as I can.