Luxury resources and strategic resource trading

[Strato]

To begin with, I got lucky. My civ currently has one furs, two dyes, two silk, which will soon be up to 4 silk when I place a few roads. The thing is, when I trade those silk, does that mean the number of happy faces will decrease, or does selling excess silks (or other luxuries) have no effect on my civ's happiness?

Given my very generous acquirement of luxuries, does anyone have any advice on what would be good to trade for with them in future? I just traded silks and theology with the Chinese (I'm Greek) for feudalism (I figure an expensive tech given how critical it is for other techs) plus 20 gold (its all they had). Given the fact I'm technologically 'advanced' in this game, what would be good in future for selling my excess resources. I should mention soon I'll be hooking up one horse and one iron, to already supplement my two iron and one horse running in my empire. Yes, a lucky start, though soon to be unnecessary once industrial age hits.

I can't remember the details of the map, but I think it was continents, 70% water, temperate, moist environment, with the second highest level of barb's and something like a large map size. I'm also playing on Regent.

I thought I'd provide a download if anyone is interested in having a look.

Yes, I probably have made a few inherent flaws in my gameplay, so feel free to comment on them. Oh, the other important thing is that I'm also beginning to mount an army against the romans, all because they are my strongest opponent so far, and they'll only get stronger unless they get cut down. Plus it will provide a nice buffer, protecting my precious resources (the scandanavians will also be cleaned up, the map looks too messy with their poorly placed cities). And Sistine Chapel is being built so then I'll have a very happy civ, and can focus more on science/money rather than extra enpenditure on luxuries.

 

[Scuffer]

On the first question, 1 of each luxury is enough to supply your entire civ, so trade that excess, it's not doing you any good hanging around.

 

[Turner]

Selling resources for fair value is a tricky thing. You may think that those dyes are worth more, but the AI will only pay so much for them.

Basically, the more benefit you get, the more it will cost. So if you have a small civ you're trying to trade with, you won't get as much for it as if the civ were larger.

Better to sell it, than to hold on to it. Anything you can do to take away GPT from the AI is always a good thing. This will slow down thier science and make the armies smaller.

 

[Oddible]

Anything you can do to take away GPT from the AI is always a good thing.

Within reason. Giving away your luxuries to the score leader is probably not a good idea. You'll get big trades for the Iron so that should be a priority over the others.

Lux trading has a lot of different strategies. I like to keep a certain parity in my games. The more civs researching the more I'll have to trade with, so I practically give away techs and luxuries to prop up the little guys so that they remain good trading partners. Also, if a smaller civ is at war with a bigger civ, you might consider giving the little guy the lux or resource to help defend themselves better. A lot of times I will just give it away so that the smaller civ can get happy peeps to fight back without draining their coffers with gpt.

Very important - if you are about to go to war with the Romans, there are a couple different paths to take. 1) Get trades established with your other neighbors first so that they will be unlikely to ally with the Romans against you; or 2) Wait to trade until you've declared war and then get your neighbors to join your war by giving them lux as incentive. Sometimes all it takes for a friendly civ to join a Military Alliance is one lux.

Last but not least. If you are a little guy the AI will demand your Lux from you. If you can't defend yourself, then perhaps you might consider NOT building a road to the lux. If you have a trading partner in mind, then connect the lux and trade it immediately before someone else demands it. If the score leader is bigger than you and they are the only civ that needs the lux - don't connect it.

Just some ideas...

 

[Flintlock]

Yes, I probably have made a few inherent flaws in my gameplay, so feel free to comment on them.

okay, but only if you insist

Your city placement is way off, I proabably would've crammed twice as many cities in the same area. Usually, I find CxxC to be good enough, unless the game has a good chance of lasting up to the modern age (such as a map like this or larger) in which CxxxC might be more appropriate. But your cities are something like four tiles apart.
Second, you need more workers you have about 1:1 of workers to cities, which would be fine except that most of them are being used roading tiles inbetween cities.
Similarly, you have some roaded but otherwise unimproved tiles, and some improved but unroaded tiles. And some tiles that are improved aren't even being used yet.
Finally, I'd put the Forbidden Palace somewhere if I were you, since you have alot of land. Rhodes, proabably would be the best location, IMO, unless you're planning on capturing an enemy core which could house your FP.

 

[JoeBas]

Also, if a smaller civ is at war with a bigger civ, you might consider giving the little guy the lux or resource to help defend themselves better. A lot of times I will just give it away so that the smaller civ can get happy peeps to fight back without draining their coffers with gpt.

But be careful if you're playing a game where Rep matters, because if the smaller civ gets knocked out and disappeared, and you still had a per-turn deal supplying them something, then the other AI see that as a broken deal on YOUR part, and your rep takes a big hit.

 

[microbe]

Reasons to trade:
1. you get something valuable you want
2. Ai might just demand it if you do not trade

Reasons not to trade:
1. trade route is unsafe - beaware. The gain is normally not worth the rep hit.
2. you do not want to benefit the AI who is running away.

 

[smeggo]

If you trade horses or iron make sure the civ is miles away from you.
Unless of course it's to a civ at war with your main rival/s.

 

[Strato]

So far my main rival I decided is the Roman's. It's best to take down the bigger empire first, because otherwise they'll just get stronger. Sadly, that means in order for me to trade with others when I go to war with the Romans, I have to push through the Roman empire to get to the heart of the Chinese and the Scandinavian empire by the looks of things, which is another important reason. That's why I'm also waiting with the Forbidden Palace, so there is a better effect.

Thanks for the advice, and answering my question everyone. It's all been useful. For some reason right now, the AI doesn't seem to be fighting amongst itself, everyone is too peaceful. I'm putting it down to difficulty perhaps. (Their aggression is set to normal).

Oh, and Flintlock, thanks also to your general advice with my game in question. I'm not too keen on micromanagement at such a low level, but it certainly is something I'll consider when I take the next jump up (when things get serious). That's why the tiles have been poorly worked

 

[Willem]

Within reason. Giving away your luxuries to the score leader is probably not a good idea.

It has it's uses. Giving it away is great for improving your relationship with a powerful civ that's breathing down your neck. It could just avert a war long enough for you to build up your defences.

 

[Strato]

And what if I'm the score leader?

I managed to get back into the swing of the game, and realise its just like Civ II again in a way, and am absolutely blitzing regent right now (I used to be a king/emperor player in Civ II). Trouble is, I took a rep hit (or two...), so I can't get GPT, and am ahead technologically it reached the point where I'm just giving away my luxuries as gifts. I'm thinking either I was lucky, or the fact I'm using a modded version means more resources, because I also have a lot of strategic resources to trade now, I've got surplus saltpeter (which I'm not giving away) iron and horses (which I'll consider later on).

My lesson learned? If there is a good option to trade, then play the diplomacy game for all its worth. The benefits can only be better than all out warfare to get more resources

 

[The Last Conformist]

If you're the score leader, sell the stuff to anyone willing to pay thru their noses and whom you're not intending to attack within 20 turns.

 

[Strato]

One problem is, the AI never has much gold to part with (no more than 30 at a time). Any per turn deals are basically off because I killed my reputation, so all I have to resort to is tech's or lump sum gold. With techs, the civ's aren't too keen on selling them for luxuries lately, because of a dodgy reputation. Right now I'm just trying to heal old wounds by giving away my excess. I ended up gaving away some saltpeter to the Scandanavian civ, who I can't even see on my map, so pose little threat to me (I hope). He's still a little 'furious' at me however

 

[Turner]

You could always give it away in hopes of it helping you get a diplo win. Is that victory condition turned on? It might help with that.

 

[Strato]

Victories turned on are conquest, dominance, space, culture and UN (diplomacy). The usual suspects So yes, I do have the chance of winning from being a good neighbour. However, I'm really aiming for Space Race right now.

Slowly I think I'll be getting the Vikings to warm to me again. After all, I did sack a few of their cities in the early stages of the game. So yeah, my strategy is to just give stuff away. I noticed just before one other civ is also beginning to warm to me a little (the Mayan), so I guess its beginning to work. Only trouble is, I just got navigation, and sniffed out a very weak Civ (babylonian) on its own island, very weak, technolically backwards and would be a real walkover. And they have five ivory on there, plus another saltpeter, so now I just need to push them into going to war against me so I don't end up taking a rep hit, and my trading power becomes even stronger. Forcing a weaker civ into war.... it's gonna be interesting

 

[Turner]

Well, by giving the resources away, you probably won't go to war with any civ that has a free lux from you. It would probably cost them too much to do so. But then, the AI isn't the brightest crayon in the box. So no guarantees. But it should allow you to focus on the SS victory.

Who knows, maybe you'll get lucky and the AI will go to war with each other. Then you can sit back in peace and get to the SS victory quicker than they could.