Marijuana and isolated spaces

[El_Machinae]

I hadn't considered this. The black market in marijuana has growers tromping off into isolated spaces, building roads in order to contribute to erosion, sucking water from streams in order to choke out downstream ecosystems, clearcut areas, and then use fertilizers and pesticides.

The new study, spearheaded by the California chapter of The Nature Conservancy, brings environmental concerns to the forefront of the policy discussion.

http://fse.fsi.stanford.edu/news/environmental-impacts-marijuana-california

Strikes me that properly sourcing one's pot has become important now (I don't associate pot-smoking with deliberate environmental callousness. And legalizing it would allow proper farms to grow it, where things like 'regulations' matter and communities can arrange the lands to reduce the damages.

 

[onejayhawk]

Sure. Legal pot would be a good thing. We raise enough food to feed 10% more than the world population. Politics is the problem in both cases.

J

 

[Formaldehyde]

California has always been one of the major marijuana producing regions. And much of it has been grown in federal forests where it wasn't irrigated at all.

This looks to me more like a PR puff piece from a conservative think tank that it does any serious scientific study.

 

[onejayhawk]

California has always been one of the major marijuana producing regions. And much of it has been grown in federal forests where it wasn't irrigated at all.

This looks to me more like a PR puff piece from a conservative think tank that it does any serious scientific study.

Stanford is a conservative think tank. You heard it here first.

J

 

[Formaldehyde]

Exactly. Which is why I'm not surprised in the least they are just echoing the other right-wing "science" scare tactics.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

Outdoor grown marijuana cannot compete in the current market. The "dangerous growers setting traps that kill hikers" "environmentally insensitive growers damaging the ecosystem" and other such arguments are all obsolete.

 

[Formaldehyde]

Here is the data from 2003-2005, long before it was legal in California to grow any form of marijuaua:

Marijuana Production in the United States (2006)

1 Marijuana $35,803,591
2 Corn $23,299,601
3 Soybeans $17,312,200
4 Hay $12,236,638
5 Vegetables $11,080,733
6 Wheat $7,450,907
7 Cotton $5,314,870
8 Grapes $2,876,547
9 Apples $1,787,532
10 Rice $1,706,665

And it is not just California where it is such a major enterprise compared to other crops:

California

Marijuana $13,848,267
Vegetables $5,668,637
Grapes $2,607,181

Alabama

Marijuana $569,409
Cotton $198,393
Hay $120,262

Florida

Vegetables $1,289,360
All Oranges $1,046,646
Marijuana $593,802

Tennessee

Marijuana $4,787,250
Soybeans $277,861
Hay $252,365

North Carolina

Marijuana $672,253
Tobacco $539,872
Cotton $306,317

 

[Timsup2nothin]

That "largest cash crop" status has a whole lot more to do with price than quantity. Sort of a meaningless statistic.

 

[Formaldehyde]

Right. It is such a "meaningless statistic" that so many farmers have decided to illegally grow it instead of traditional crops.

And the price of an ounce of pot in Colorado is still obscenely high based on how much it costs to produce.

 

[El_Machinae]

Outdoor grown marijuana cannot compete in the current market. The "dangerous growers setting traps that kill hikers" "environmentally insensitive growers damaging the ecosystem" and other such arguments are all obsolete.

If you want to call a study published last week "obsolete", I guess.

It's not that they can't compete. It's that they participate.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

Right. It is such a "meaningless statistic" that so many farmers have decided to illegally grow it instead of traditional crops.

And the price of an ounce of pot in Colorado is still obscenely high based on how much it costs to produce.

That's the point. It doesn't take a "farmer" to produce a higher dollar value of marijuana than rice. A meaningful statistic would be a comparison of weight, or acreage. If you would get off your knee jerk defensiveness you would have understood that.

Farmers aren't getting in the marijuana business. Outdoor grown marijuana can't compete effectively in the current market, and it doesn't take acreage to produce a cost effective crop. Quite the opposite in fact.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

If you want to call a study published last week "obsolete", I guess.

It's not that they can't compete. It's that they participate.

Published last week doesn't mean that the data collection is current, and the issue is moot because any growers doing environmental damage through outdoor farming in isolated areas are dinosaurs anyway, even if they haven't gotten the memo that they are extinct. The market will take care of them.

 

[Lohrenswald]

I'm not entirely sure what the point being tried to made here is.

 

[Formaldehyde]

That's the point. It doesn't take a "farmer" to produce a higher dollar value of marijuana than rice. A meaningful statistic would be a comparison of weight, or acreage. If you would get off your knee jerk defensiveness you would have understood that.

That is simply ludicrous unless you wanted to verify that marijuana did indeed consume vastly more water than other crops, or have similar questions. Cash value of crops is an industry-standard way of comparing them.

I am discussing this matter in an adult and rational manner. if you would stop with the inane personal attacks merely because I disagree with some of your personal opinions, it would certainly be appreciated.

Farmers aren't getting in the marijuana business. Outdoor grown marijuana can't compete effectively in the current market, and it doesn't take acreage to produce a cost effective crop. Quite the opposite in fact.

That is your personal opinion which you haven't corroborated in the least with a suitable source.

But farmers have indeed gotten "in the marijuana business" in many states to the point where the amount they make now dwarfs what they make raising legitimate crops. Much of it is grown in out-of-the-way locations in hilly or mountainous areas. But some of it is even grown between the corn stalks or similar crops.

And this is particularly true with legal marijuana cultivation which is attracting more and more farmers because it is based on traditional agricultural practices:

24 Hours With A MARIJUANA FARMER

 

[El_Machinae]

Published last week doesn't mean that the data collection is current, and the issue is moot because any growers doing environmental damage through outdoor farming in isolated areas are dinosaurs anyway, even if they haven't gotten the memo that they are extinct. The market will take care of them.

So, you're recommending that it's not prudent for one to consider the source of their purchased marijuana, since it's 'probably' not sourced from damaging grow ops?

 

[Timsup2nothin]

So, you're recommending that it's not prudent for one to consider the source of their purchased marijuana, since it's 'probably' not sourced from damaging grow ops?

I think that anyone who is concerned about the quality of the product (hence, everyone) is already eliminating outdoor grown sources. I doubt there is a legal dispensary in California that has any outdoor grown available because they generally have product standards that outdoor grown can't meet.

 

[onejayhawk]

I'm not entirely sure what the point being tried to made here is.

Join the crowd.

I think that anyone who is concerned about the quality of the product (hence, everyone) is already eliminating outdoor grown sources. I doubt there is a legal dispensary in California that has any outdoor grown available because they generally have product standards that outdoor grown can't meet.

The ironies abound.

J

 

[Timsup2nothin]

I'm not entirely sure what the point being tried to made here is.

My point is that talking about "marijuana farms" and/or "farmers" is an absurdity.

IF it were possible to grow quality marijuana on a farm it would produce about five million dollars per acre. So, yeah, farmers would absolutely love to make the switch, but no one is expecting a sudden return to widespread use of hempen rope, which is the only viable use for marijuana grown by the acre. Marijuana growers are not farmers. They deal in square footage, not acreage.

There are undoubtedly some clowns out there causing exactly the environmental problems described and nibbling on the fringes of the market; selling poor quality product to buyers they hope to never see again. The market will take care of this problem without any specific "is my weed produced in an environmentally friendly manner?" investigation required.

Bottom line: unless you are buying crap it was grown in a warehouse and had no contact with the environment, much less harmful impact on it.

 

[Farm Boy]

Scale.

 

[mrt144]

Legalization has pushed niche and boutique weed cultivation too which is done on a tiny scale.