Middle-end game problems.

[Willem90]

So i play on emperor level. With china it's easy for me because it has extra science.
But every game i seem to get ownend in the end/middle because my technology isn't as advanced as them.

I ususally rush one/two CS's or another player with some immortals or something. But when we get to medival age, my grip on the game seems to drop. I got to defend against 2 players or i get hapiness/money problems which slows me down alot.

Eventually it's my longswords/muskets against their advanced artillery/rifles and i can keep it up for a few turns but eventually their technology keeps getting better while mine is left behind. Eventhough they got as many cities as i do.
I know i should specialize my cities to production/science/gold/military but it just doesn't seem to work.

Any suggestions?

(I just red something about horseman rush, i prefere to play a normal game if it's possible ^^ and i normally get honor as first policy with a general to rush early game. Than i normally get piety because otherwise hapiness pwnz my ass)

 

[Levitar]

Research Agreements.

Recently on an Immortal Archipelago (which meant all but one civ still existed) I was able to keep up 6 Research Agreements full time. Which meant I was essentially getting a new tech every 3 turns when you include my own research. My 1750 I was a full era ahead of every one.

The key here, though, is the same as everything. Money. Sometimes I had to buy something from them before they had the money for the Agreement.

 

[metatheory]

Attack your neighbor first
So I'm not trolling...

A suggestion for China is to bee-line Machinery for Cho-Ko-No. Then play catch-up in other techs. Keeping 6-8 Cho-ko-no around, as well as a few horsemen, should provide adequate defense until you catch up.

I would also build a library and Papermaker in every city and either go patronage for the 33% tech gift from City States or Rationalism (grab the first couple for sure).

 

[Supr49er]

Welcome to the Forums

As China, ally with Maritime City States for the food.
This lets you put scientist specialists in all your science buildings.
(yes, build as many in your cities as you can)
You should be ripping through the tech tree.
Get to the Rationalism Policy as soon as you can.

 

[aimlessgun]

First off: why are you rushing city states? Unless they are military CS with good luxuries you should be making friends with them instead.

What order are you getting technologies in? Are you building libraries everywhere and managing your scientist specialists to maximize techtime and minimize overflow?

Are you using research agreements? Outside of the early game you should be sinking a lot of money into those.

You don't need Piety for happiness...I'm not sure what you are doing but unless you are on a conquering spree there are plenty of ways to control happiness without Piety so you can use something like Rationalism instead. Make sure to grab luxury resources with your city spots. Befriend city states for luxuries. Trade for luxuries. Build colosseums.

You shouldn't need Honor for the general. And unless you are getting culture from ancient ruins or are French, it is not even very fast anyways! You don't need a great general to warrior rush people, just abuse the crappy AI and be smart with your tactics, and you'll get a general the normal way.

I don't understand what you mean by saying China has extra science. China gets no bonuses to science.

 

[Willem90]

My goal early game is making 3 warriors, a scout and later i try a era jump with great library.

When i started playing i always saw CS's as usefull but i could never sustain a good relationship with more than 1 CS because i never had the money...
I always seem to get into money problems eventhough i sell the luxuries that i have multiple times.

Normally i go for the military tech's. Bronze&iron work asap.

As for social policies, should i save my points for patrionage + commerce?
Normally i get honor for the 15% friendly bonus and double xp. Or i choose for tradition (solely for the 33% combat bonus in friendly lands).

I'm looking for a basic strategy to tackle my problems (i always put everything on random except the rescources).

 

[Supr49er]

Paper Makers give +1 Science for every 2 Citizens in the city, and +4 Gold.
Build them in every city.

 

[Willem90]

Paper Makers give +1 Science for every 2 Citizens in the city, and +4 Gold.
Build them in every city.

ye i do. That's why i always achieve victory with china. I'm looking for suggestions when i don't play them ^^

 

[Supr49er]

The advice in my first post is pretty Civ generic. But some Civs are better suited to other victory conditions. What Civ are you trying this with?

 

[guczy]

Also have a science city. Possibly in a deep jungle, with all science buildings, and specialists. BTW a lot of ppl seem to have this problem (i mean the AI running away with tech). I have the opposite problem, on Emperor i dont even go for Rationalism anymore cause even without that i have a HUGE tech-lead, RAT would be overkill.

 

[Willem90]

The advice in my first post is pretty Civ generic. But some Civs are better suited to other victory conditions. What Civ are you trying this with?

random... So i never know which one i'll get ^^ that's how i got good in warcraft III and such ^^

what policy order should i follow?

EDIT: i don't feel like micromanaging all my workers... that would be a bit too boring for me tbh

 

[aimlessgun]

General strategies:

2 Cheesy Military Strategies:
1-Horserush- Rush to Horsemen, take out everyone on your landmass and then consolidate.

2-Rifle/Artillery slingshot-Go straight to Iron Working. Build about 4 warriors then 1 settler, use the settler to secure Iron. Use your initial warriors to puppet a couple cities, save your money so you can have 5-6 swordsmen right as you get Iron Working. Also, do NOT spend any social policies.

Go back in the tech tree and get Calendar and Writing so keep out of Very Unhappy and speed up your tech (puppets will build the libraries and use the scientists unless you get unlucky ) Then continue on to Steel while your swordsmen own faces. Upgrade to longswords, continue to own face, get all the requirements for Gunpowder.

At this point your capital should have created a great scientist. Burn him to tech Gunpowder. Now you are in the Renaissance. Get the rationalism policies to get 2 free techs. Get Metal Casting and Rifling. Congratulations, you have Riflemen before the birth of Jesus. You have won the game at this point, but just in case, continue to teching towards artillery. One of your puppets will probably have made another Great Scientist by now, burn him to tech Artillery and get into the Industrial Age. At this point you've really won, because anyone on your landmass is screwed. If there is a big AI on another continent don't worry, you will have time to deal with them before they can build a spaceship, if they even try.

 

[Willem90]

General strategies:

2 Cheesy Military Strategies:
1-Horserush- Rush to Horsemen, take out everyone on your landmass and then consolidate.

2-Rifle/Artillery slingshot-Go straight to Iron Working. Build about 4 warriors then 1 settler, use the settler to secure Iron. Use your initial warriors to puppet a couple cities, save your money so you can have 5-6 swordsmen right as you get Iron Working. Also, do NOT spend any social policies.

Go back in the tech tree and get Calendar and Writing so keep out of Very Unhappy and speed up your tech (puppets will build the libraries and use the scientists unless you get unlucky ) Then continue on to Steel while your swordsmen own faces. Upgrade to longswords, continue to own face, get all the requirements for Gunpowder.

At this point your capital should have created a great scientist. Burn him to tech Gunpowder. Now you are in the Renaissance. Get the rationalism policies to get 2 free techs. Get Metal Casting and Rifling. Congratulations, you have Riflemen before the birth of Jesus. You have won the game at this point, but just in case, continue to teching towards artillery. One of your puppets will probably have made another Great Scientist by now, burn him to tech Artillery and get into the Industrial Age. At this point you've really won, because anyone on your landmass is screwed. If there is a big AI on another continent don't worry, you will have time to deal with them before they can build a spaceship, if they even try.

i'll try the 2nd one out ^^ but maybe not even so hard on military since i'll have alot of money problems like that ^^

 

[aimlessgun]

i'll try the 2nd one out ^^ but maybe not even so hard on military since i'll have alot of money problems like that ^^

You shouldn't have money problems because your costs will be pretty low. Your military will be like 8-10 elite units (play careful, don't lose these guys), so that cost is low. Since you will be unhappy like 90% of the time your puppet cities will be small, and thus will build stuff very slowly and not cost you much money. Build tradeposts everywhere around the puppets and they will give you decent income. Conquering stuff gives you some money from looting the cities.

Remember to delete captured workers that you don't need! You will capture TONS of workers, 20g each for deleting them! Not that much, but of course you don't want to pay upkeep on them.

 

[Lanstro]

Emperor should be manageable without any exploitative strategies. Some general tips for any civ:
- for the first few cities, settle in spots where at least one of the first six hexes is above average: ie a 3 food square, gold/gems/silver on a hill, etc: border growth is generally slow and you'll generally be working one of those first 6 hexes for a long time
- have enough workers so every hex you work is improved
- farm riverside hexes, trading post everything else
- try to befriend as many maritime city states as you can
- unless there are exceptional circumstances, build a monument, a library and a marketplace in every city
- try to avoid tradition unless you can't win the war without that free general, or unless your civ gets extra bonuses for hunting down barbarians (eg Germans and Songhai): I've found saving up for commerce, or even dumping it into tradition and the wonder building policy, places you in a much stronger position in the midgame
- settlers are cheap, courthouses are not: when you conquer cities, raze them and then re-settle
- in a war-heavy game, generally keep your happiness somewhere between 1 and 10. If you're below 5, build/buy happiness buildings. If you're above 5, settle new cities. Prioritise settling new luxuries that you don't have.
- scientist specialists are really powerful. run 2 of them in most cities if you're falling behind in tech

 

[}{ELL/\/()]

2 issues

You either arent doing enough research agreements (i'll often even pay the civs for something they have or just give them it if they dont have the money, think of it as 500 gold for a tech)

You dont have enough cities, tech is directly based off population, keep cities as puppets if you have to expand more. If you are having trouble with this its probably because your cash flow or policies arent good enough. Spam more trading posts and get bonuses that reduce unhappiness from #of cities.

One other thing, ya scientist specialists are good, but save up your GS till you get at least 2-3 and look forward in the tech tree when you can use them for the biggest advantage (can really jump ahead to arty, rifles infantry or something)

 

[edcrane]

I would tackle this using policies.

If you're trying to keep your empire small (say, 3-6 cities), I'd spend early policy points on the patronage tree. The 2nd policy on the left will give you something like 100+ beakers if you ally with a ~6 CSs. If you find that gold is an issue, sell more luxuries or build more trading posts.

If you're more expansive (say, 9+ cities), I'd go for the communism + rationalism route: build libraries and universities in every single city, ally with maritimes, and fully populate your science specialist spots. This will give you a huge mid-game boost, though you'll probably be behind in technology before you hit biology.

 

[durannarud]

Piety is worthless as far as I'm concerned. Save your Policies for patronage and rationalism. Build lots of trade posts... it'll solve both your money problem and your science problem to a lesser degree.

Don't build more than 3-4 cities yourself (unless you're going for the city sprawl). The rest should be pupetted AI cities surrounded by trade posts.

Don't be afraid to run your empire in mild unhappiness. Every time this happens, the game will fill in the specialist slots for you. When you get your happiness boost, you'll be expanding your population in no time (just get a maritime ally).

And finally, don't build a gigantic military. Just a core set of veterans (implied they have to be almost constantly at war). And maybe 1 worker for every two cities you own.

 

[Willem90]

ok if i put a city on gold focus, will it make tradeposts itself? i don't wanna micro all my workers :s

 

[aimlessgun]

ok if i put a city on gold focus, will it make tradeposts itself? i don't wanna micro all my workers :s

No. But the automated workers tend to build tradeposts everywhere right now.

But if you're playing on Emperor, controlling your workers is sort of expected It would be like playing Warcraft 3 without retreating damaged units.