Mines and wire

[David Prosser]

I was wondering how sea mines land mines, and barbed wire defences work in Civ II? Sea mines are available, and can be built. They can be laid by any ship that can take cargo. I was wondering how they were swept though. Can one build a minesweeper?


As for landmines, and barbed wire, how are they laid, and how dose a player remove those laid by the enemy?

 

[Duke of Marlbrough]

Either you have some sort of a scenario or the wrong game.....?

That makes me think of a game by QQP called grandest fleet. Too bad QQP went belly up, they had some good games.

 

[starlifter]

how sea mines land mines, and barbed wire defences work in Civ II? Sea mines are available, and can be built. They can be laid by any ship that can take cargo.

Umm.... Sea mines are news to me... And Barbed Wire???

Maybe it is a mod pack or scenario you're thinking of... but the stuff you mention ain't in the regular Civ II game, dude

.

 

[spycatcher34]

Sounds like interesting features though

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Somewhere between war and diplomacy is the realm of the spy.- <FONT face="Script MT Bold">SpyCatcher34</FONT f>

 

[moof]

Sea mines would be very useful, land mines seem like they might
change the game for conquest too much.

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TTFNFm & MTFBWY moof

" Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity,

and I'm not sure about the former. " - Albert Einstein

 

[Smash]

Ok I'll try to steer this on topic.
You have some extra unit slots to work with.You could add a sea mine unit.I think
a boat with 0 moves and high defense....no that won't work..how do you get it to position?
maybe an aircraft with alot of moves...no the ai will do all manner of silly things.
I know you can place them in a scenario for instance...
a missile with 0 moves?..no it will crash when you place it.hmmm

 

[Surf Wax America]

I am thinking that possibly this as to do with CTP. I own the game (what a waste of money), and as far as I remember, sea mines are definitely a part of the game.

And about the barbed wire, I've heard of a modpack that includes it in CTP. It's a terrain improvement as well.

 

[David Prosser]

Yes, the gif was from either a scenario for the barbed wire, and a modpack for the sea mine. Either way, a method of laying, and as important clearing them would be useful for a patch.

 

[David Prosser]

they were in a scenario or madpack. I would like to see them as a permanent feature.

 

[David Prosser]

Smash: I think I know how to use the extra slot to make a sea mine, and a minelaying sub to lay them. That is the easy part. Creating a unit to sweep them, and survive the experience would be the hard part.

One would have to, I think try to create a new 'sweep' command, like P for clean up pollution. That sounds fairly difficult, so the next choice would be to create a cheap expendable sea unit to 'sweep' them.

Spayctcher 43: They were from mod packs. I agree they would make an excellent feature. Maybe someone will take the hint

Moof: Yes I agree sea mines would be useful, especially with the modpack that allows simultaneous moving. You would occasionaly have ships, and land units blundering into mine fields, like in real life. Land mines would be useful if there was alot of flat uninhabited territory to fight over. They would be good in an Afrika Korps/Kursk type scenarion too. There were extensive minefields in the real thing.

 

[The Splang]

How about the mines are given the "Paradrop" ability and 0 moves

so after you place them they cant go anywhere! Also, give em sub ability and Only mine sweeper units can see them!

! WOW this sounds really cool, if I knew how to upload modpacks to sites I would make one

...

 

[allan]

I would suggest what you said above (paradrop, zero movement), but not give them THAT high of a defense--in reality, they damage fleets (and each ship unit is like a "mini-fleet"), but don't obliterate them.... Maybe a defense of 4 or 5, which would serve to damage ships and reduce their number of attacks on your shore.

And how would you make a minesweeper? AFAIK, there are no ships with a special "can see subs" ability to use as a template....

As for land mines skewing the game toward conquest (as someone said above), I think the reverse would be true--they'd make conquest HARDER by bolstering defense.

 

[PinkyGen]

Yikes, new forum is acting weird. !crazyeyes!

Anyways, can't cruisers and destroyers see subs. So these could also be able to see mines.

I agree, mines should only hurt your fleet, not sink it. However, they would protect you coast against those transports (and pathetically weak ships like Tiremes and such. <img src="smile.gif" border="0"> )

 

[allan]

Yes, they would destroy transports and pre-modern ships. So before you send your transports in, send in a stronger ship to take the "hit" (but it wouldn't sink), after which time the mines are cleared in that square (unit destoyed), until new ones are seeded. Minesweepers probably aren't necessary then for game mechanics anyway....

Benefit for using the mines along your shore would be to weaken bombarding ships (obvious), but also to make surprise transport landings impossible (i.e. you'd be alerted when you see other ships trying to "clear" the mines beforehand).

Question: should mines have city shield support, or be like dips/spies and not require support? I think the latter, because you just drop them in the water, you don't "feed" or maintain them after that....

 

[jomey]

Just one question.. How would Aircrafts react to either mine <img src="confused.gif" border="0">

 

[Peteus]

Problem with the hidden mine idea, using existing easily mod-able attributes - how would the transports be hit? If the mines paradrop, and are 0/5/0 say, then the transport would just bump into them (and I think reveal them) because it can't attack either. The only way to stop the TRs would be to wall them out, if they mines surrounded your city, but that isn't all that effective!

The Dominion Wars scenario has some clever implementations of attributes. The Federation self-replicating mines are implemented as a wall of stationary defensive units that needs to be cut through by waves of suicidal Dominion cruisers. Orbital defense platforms are implemented by putting powerful units in "moats" around planets so they can't wander off, but can bombard any units that come near (because outer space functions just like land. Radical changes using familiar (if you think about it!) game mechanics! <img src="icon6.gif" border="0">

 

[Cunobelin Of Hippo]

To simulate the effects of tricky navigation through mindfields, it would be possible to create a new terrain square, "Mined Waters'. Then, 'Sea Engineers' could modify the ocean terrain to 'Mined Waters' which would have a movement cost of 3 or something very high, to represent slow movement. An attacking fleet would be slowed down considerably by such a defence.

 

[David Prosser]

The Splang: You could do them like Paras I suppose. On contact, both mine, and unit would be destroyed. The sea mines from the Modpack have sub ability, and are destroyed on contact. As for uploading a modpack to this site, check out the help, and scenarios sections. I think you will find the necessary directions there.

Cheers

David

 

[David Prosser]

allan: Hi there Allan. Defence of 4-5 sounds OK, but they should be able to blow any Transport/Merchant Ship out odf the water. Historically these were their principle target.As for making a mine sweeper, it would have to be put in one of the "new" unit slots. Getting a gif on one from the download sites would be easy. there are several ship packs. Getting them to actually sweep the mines is the hard part. One would have to program them to "sweep" mines the same way an engineer deals with pollution. I am not sure this is possible.

Landmines could be done the same way, with a special unit to "sow" them. To make sweeping easy, a special cheap unit could be created to "sweep" them.

 

[David Prosser]

Hi PinkyGen. The new " sea mine unit" which you can create acts the same way as a sub, but does not move, and is destroyed on contact. They would certainly be good protection against Transports. So would a new terrain itme "Reef" from one of the modpacks I think.It would be uncrossable by sea units. For example much of the west coast of Africa is protected by a 1000 mile reef.

Cheers

David