[MOD] CivMore

[fitchn]

That guy has a name, it's goodyhut, and don't you forget it!

Now, now, guys, let's play nice...

*snip*

I still think it's a good idea (I usualy play with tech trading off), but maybe fitchn could include an option where you could disable the feature. It's always nice when you can please everyone, well some will complain anyway, but it's nice to please most of them

Hmm... that may be an option. Upon further contemplation, removing tech trading shouldn't suffer the same problems as adding a feature via python. At this point though, it's not a priority. If I do add it, though, I will definitely provide a way to disable it (personally, though, I'd prefer not to disable any game features, only add more).

Thanks for the suggestions!

 

[goodyhut]

Hmm... that may be an option. Upon further contemplation, removing tech trading shouldn't suffer the same problems as adding a feature via python. At this point though, it's not a priority. If I do add it, though, I will definitely provide a way to disable it (personally, though, I'd prefer not to disable any game features, only add more).

Fitchn it might be easier to add Mod that disables tech trading and adds the tech research bonuses in relation to civs you have open borders with as a feature you can choose when setting up the game. That way if somebody wants vanila tech trading it is the default. If they want to try the new and improved way (imo) they can choose to select it when setting up the game. And if they don't want ANY tech trading then they can select no TT.

I think it would be easier because you can set it up so that if they check the feature then it runs that mod when settign up the game, if they don't select it then it doesn't. Just my 2 cents. Keep up the great work!

 

[alexinjo]

Glad you got it working! Be sure to let me know what you think...!

BTW, welcome to the forums!

I am glad too. I gotta say I like this mod. I especially like those wonders from older civs. I think by having more world wonders, game play is more balanced. Also I like new civs and civics, too bad I can't expand as fast as I would like.

I was thinking that is it impossible to make unique units for each civ for different eras? I don't really care what perks they have, but it would be awesome to see different units in later eras also, not everyone having same riflemen etc. Of course more civs added to this one too...

Some sounds are missing imo, and texts for new world wonders.

great work fitchn

 

[Officer Reene]

Good to see 'ya back!

Glad to be back....

MP testing is in it's early stages... I'll probably report in by the end of this week or next week (therefore I can have a long test period to review)

I'm hesitant to add this one, for the reasons mentioned previously...

I understand... hopefully Jeckel's new random generator will fix the OOS errors

however since I cant code Python to save my life.... I cant test it

I'm not sure about this one; it won't have the problem that some of the other gameplay altering python scripts, but I'm just afraid that it would make it too easy to get in contact with everyone, and reduce the need to explore. Hopefully, the expansion will bring back the 'trade comunications' option in the diplo screen!

You have a good point there... I just like this option since it's more ala Civ3 and more realism.... but it's your mod...Im just the tester you can take and leave any of my suggestions I wont get offended

Same deal with this one... Honestly, though, I don't quite see the advantage of being able to destroy buildings; very few buildings have any kind of negative effect, anyway. The only buildings that it may make sense to destroy would be national wonders to build elsewhere, but this would take out the need to plan ahead. I am considering an alternate approach, however, that would allow you to move the buildings as you can with the palace; I'm still undecided on it, and I'm not even sure if it will work... I'll let you know when I get to that point!

actually I dont use the building option... I just use it to raze cities after initial capture...

I like to see whats in the city (wonders, etc) before razing it after first capture... and see if it's worth keeping... or deciding to move it after having it a while and seeing it's not in the best spotb

of course this is a suggestion only.... I still gotta solve the OOS error with it (or have someone better at it fix the problem )

I can see how this may be a unfair advantage over the AI

Please don't get me wrong; I'm not trying to be negative, and any feedback from the community is highly valued, but I want to be careful about adding python gameplay elements to the mod for the reasons mentioned in the first post... Please, keep the feedback coming, though!

hey no offense taken

Im just making suggestions and you provide me with your point of view

after all your the mod master!


Im just still glad your working on this ... and listening to us testers

 

[fitchn]

Fitchn it might be easier to add Mod that disables tech trading and adds the tech research bonuses in relation to civs you have open borders with as a feature you can choose when setting up the game. That way if somebody wants vanila tech trading it is the default. If they want to try the new and improved way (imo) they can choose to select it when setting up the game. And if they don't want ANY tech trading then they can select no TT.

I think it would be easier because you can set it up so that if they check the feature then it runs that mod when settign up the game, if they don't select it then it doesn't. Just my 2 cents. Keep up the great work!

I'll look into it, but it most likely won't make it in by the next release...

Thanks again for the feedback and kudos! Let me know if you have any other suggestions (or critisisms)!

 

[fitchn]

I am glad too. I gotta say I like this mod. I especially like those wonders from older civs. I think by having more world wonders, game play is more balanced. Also I like new civs and civics, too bad I can't expand as fast as I would like.

I've drawn quite a bit of my inspiration from the older civ games (along with some stuff of my own); I was actually kind of disappointed that they pulled out some of them, particularly the ones that have been in it from the beginning!

As far as the civics are concerned, do you think they cripple your expansion too much? The main reason that I increased the civic and upkeep costs was because most of my games where running at 80-90% science from the gate... in previous civ games, if you could pull 60%, you where doing good!

I was thinking that is it impossible to make unique units for each civ for different eras? I don't really care what perks they have, but it would be awesome to see different units in later eras also, not everyone having same riflemen etc. Of course more civs added to this one too...

I am planning on adding at lease a second UU for each civ. If I can find enough distinct units, I will possibly add a third UU; if I can't find enough, I may at least add some flavor units for the ones that I can find...!

Some sounds are missing imo, and texts for new world wonders.

What sounds and texts are missing...? I realize that I have yet to add the civilopedia entries, and most of the sounds for the new buildings and wonders are just reused from others, but I wasn't aware of anything that was missing outright... Please, let me know, so that I can fix it!

great work fitchn

Thanks...!

 

[alexinjo]

About the sounds missing...

I don't get sounds for any new world wonders, nor any texts. I think my settings are correct because they worked before using this mod. I use a soundblaster soundcard, the cheapest one. And I think some other game sounds are missing too, I am not sure which but the game is more quiet than before, I'll get back on this. It doesn't help that I listen to mp3s at the same time also

About expansion...

I personally feel that the original expansion in civ4 was fine. Playing without this mod on Noble level I could build 4-5 cities and after that I would get stagnant growth and penalties for science and it really slowed me down. But with this mod even changing a civic makes me lose money with one city not to talk about 4 cities. I don't mind putting science rate to even 30% for sometime, but it is annoying not to be able to expand even to 3-4 cities without running into problems.

These are my thoughts for now

 

[Officer Reene]

About the sounds missing...

I don't get sounds for any new world wonders, nor any texts. I think my settings are correct because they worked before using this mod. I use a soundblaster soundcard, the cheapest one. And I think some other game sounds are missing too, I am not sure which but the game is more quiet than before, I'll get back on this. It doesn't help that I listen to mp3s at the same time also

FYI any new wonder/building (anything with the "obilesk question mark" pic)

Fitchn hasnt made it yet... (and the wonder movies too)

so nothing is wrong... Fitchn will add it soon


it's okay man... none of us get the new sounds yet!

 

[Officer Reene]

The First Contact Mod component doesnt work in MP

I let Jeckel know (on the original thread) and maybe he can fix it

until then it's not MP compatable so I removed it from the mod


on a similar note the Show Attitude Mod works fine (I didnt think there would be any problems since it worked in 1.52) in MP


I'll keep you posted!


EDIT: Jeckel is working on it he hopes to get it fixed by this weekend... therefore I'll be able to retest it again!

 

[fitchn]

About the sounds missing...

I don't get sounds for any new world wonders, nor any texts. I think my settings are correct because they worked before using this mod. I use a soundblaster soundcard, the cheapest one. And I think some other game sounds are missing too, I am not sure which but the game is more quiet than before, I'll get back on this. It doesn't help that I listen to mp3s at the same time also

Oh, okay; you're talking about the sounds and popup texts for the wonders! I haven't finished these yet. I'm still undecided as to whether I will be putting wonder movies in or not, but I will at least have an image and a sound! As far as the other missing sounds, they are more than likely the sounds for some of the new leaders; the creators of Civ Gold are still working on many of those, and I will add them in as they do.

About expansion...

I personally feel that the original expansion in civ4 was fine. Playing without this mod on Noble level I could build 4-5 cities and after that I would get stagnant growth and penalties for science and it really slowed me down. But with this mod even changing a civic makes me lose money with one city not to talk about 4 cities. I don't mind putting science rate to even 30% for sometime, but it is annoying not to be able to expand even to 3-4 cities without running into problems.

These are my thoughts for now

I will probably scale back some of the costs, but I wanted to make it harder to keep the science rate up (but I wasn't looking to stifle expansion). I also wanted to make it so that high upkeep civics were noticebly higher than the low upkeep ones (many times in the vanilla version, a high upkeep civic would only be 1-2 gold more than the low upkeep ones). There are 5 basic upkeep costs in the game: number of cities, distance from capital, unit upkeep, civic upkeep from number of cities, and civic upkeep from population. I'll mess around with some of the values and see if I can come up with ones that increase upkeep without stiffling growth. Which ones do you think need to be reduced?

 

[fitchn]

FYI any new wonder/building (anything with the "obilesk question mark" pic)

Fitchn hasnt made it yet... (and the wonder movies too)

so nothing is wrong... Fitchn will add it soon


it's okay man... none of us get the new sounds yet!

I'm slowly but surely replacing the obilesk button with more specific buttons, but they probably won't be completely changed until sometime in the beta stage. As far as the wonder movies are concerned, I still haven't decided if I will put any movies in, as they will take a long time to make, and dramatically increase the size of the mod. Who knows, though, maybe they'll make it into it someday...

 

[fitchn]

The First Contact Mod component doesnt work in MP

I let Jeckel know (on the original thread) and maybe he can fix it

until then it's not MP compatable so I removed it from the mod

Well, I guess that means one less decision for me to have to make!

on a similar note the Show Attitude Mod works fine (I didnt think there would be any problems since it worked in 1.52) in MP

I'll keep you posted!

I may add this one down the road, since it has no affect on gameplay.

 

[Officer Reene]

I'm slowly but surely replacing the obilesk button with more specific buttons, but they probably won't be completely changed until sometime in the beta stage.

hey no sweat... I was just explaining it to alexinjo so you wouldnt have to respond and could keep working on your revised version

...As far as the wonder movies are concerned, I still haven't decided if I will put any movies in, as they will take a long time to make, and dramatically increase the size of the mod. Who knows, though, maybe they'll make it into it someday...

You could do what I did for my custom wonders... I made a "snapshot" photo of my wonders movie making it static pic but with info about the wonder...and some pics of the wonder/person/building

It's not a movie but a static pic.... but it shows you the wonder info without having a blank "blue" screen

it's easy to do too...

and customizes the wonder without have to make the tiresome movies

 

[Jan Zizkov]

Hi there, great MOD!!! My girlfriend and I both love it, but playing the MOD over a LAN gives a serious problem. We both have the MOD loaded, we can set up a game in the LAN LOBBY, but as soon as we launch the game the whole system stops. We both get the windows-message where we could send a report...
Is there a way to play this MOD over a LAN? Thanx

 

[Officer Reene]

Hi there, great MOD!!! My girlfriend and I both love it, but playing the MOD over a LAN gives a serious problem. We both have the MOD loaded, we can set up a game in the LAN LOBBY, but as soon as we launch the game the whole system stops. We both get the windows-message where we could send a report...
Is there a way to play this MOD over a LAN? Thanx

I have a similar problem... but when me and my bro play over the LAN sometimes the loaded game does not appear in the lobby

this has happened on and off the last few weeks.... I think it may be a router problem but I cant figure it out!


to solve this problem.... I use the Direct IP connection....

that always works for MP game..


also you may want to clear your CIV 4cache out everytime before you start the game (also clear your g/f's computer's cache out too )


we had LAN working for a couple of days... but now it's on the fritz...

and we are back to Direct IP connection

I dont see any lag issues or playing differences between Direct IP and LAN

(although LAN is a "private" connection between the computers and IP goes over the internet.... but firewalls should stop any problems)


Hope that helps

let us know how it goes....

 

[fitchn]

hey no sweat... I was just explaining it to alexinjo so you wouldnt have to respond and could keep working on your revised version

Thanks, I apreciate it!

You could do what I did for my custom wonders... I made a "snapshot" photo of my wonders movie making it static pic but with info about the wonder...and some pics of the wonder/person/building

It's not a movie but a static pic.... but it shows you the wonder info without having a blank "blue" screen

it's easy to do too...

and customizes the wonder without have to make the tiresome movies

I was planning on at least doing that! I may put some movies together, but they would be a long way off...

 

[fitchn]

Hi there, great MOD!!! My girlfriend and I both love it, but playing the MOD over a LAN gives a serious problem. We both have the MOD loaded, we can set up a game in the LAN LOBBY, but as soon as we launch the game the whole system stops. We both get the windows-message where we could send a report...
Is there a way to play this MOD over a LAN? Thanx

First off, thanks for the kind words!

Honestly, I haven't played a game over a LAN in quite some time! See if some of Officer Reene's suggestions do the trick. You may also want to try Civ IV vanilla over the LAN first, to help determine if it is a problem with the mod, or something else.

Let me know what you find out...

@Officer Reene: Thanks for helping out...

 

[Officer Reene]

Ive been testing this verison in MP as well as in SP games...

I noticed something about the Great Generals "born" in AI cities....
they dont do anything but sit in the cities! They can be python coded to do more... but that may mess up MP and AI play...
so I offer my alternative

@fitchn: I remember you posting in response to my question (Post #77)

I am aware of what is causing the error. I added the UNITAI_GENERAL and UNITAI_AGRICULTURALIST attributes to the new great people (of the same name) as a placeholder to program how the AI should handle them. The particular error that is coming up when the game is first loaded is because these UNITAI's have not been defined in the CIV4BasicInfos.xml file. However, these attributes are hardcoded into the game; If I attempt to add them to this file, the game gets a fatal error and crashes. I will not be able to add these in properly until the SDK is released; I will be pulling these out of the files until then for the next release. As I've mentioned before, the game will essentially ignore these tags since they are not defined; as such, the error has no affect on the gameplay or stability of the mod in any way!

in the earlier version you said to ignore the errors... in this one you coded it this way: (CIV4UnitInfos.xml)

<Class>UNITCLASS_GENERAL</Class>
<Type>UNIT_GENERAL</Type>
...
...
<DefaultUnitAI>NONE</DefaultUnitAI>
...
...
<UnitAIs>
<UnitAI>
<UnitAIType>NONE</UnitAIType>
<bUnitAI>1</bUnitAI>
</UnitAI>
</UnitAIs>
...
...

In the earlier version (to avoid the error msg on start up) I followed TheLopez and Snaitf's format (in their respective GG mods) and changed the tags to:

UNITAI_SCIENTIST

of course this does not solve the problem of "hardcoded" issues (basically no AI set up for the GG or GAg)

However I did find out that with the UNITAI_SCIENTIST tag the AI will use the GGs (building a Military Academy or such) as opposed to letting the GG sit in the city and do nothing

since this AI tag is already in the "vanilla" version... it probably lets the AI use the GG to discover (or help discover) a technology and/or make the GG a Great Specialist in that particular city...

Again this is not perfect... but it levels the playing field so that the AI can utilize the GG as the other great specialists... when born in a city...


Im sure this happens with the Great Agriculuralist... but I havent witnessed many GAg in AI cities...

Unlike GGs, which I see a lot of in AI cities (probably because of my custom buildings/wonders made specifically for GG coinage allow for more GGs to be born! )

so Fitchn my suggestion is change the tags in your next release!

NOTE: I changed the tags already in my copy of the mod (as well as my bros) so we will report to you if there is any problems with the changes

PS so far no MP issues and we've been playing normal speed, with the year at 1240 AD


Again this is only a suggestion, take it as you will and I wont be offended if you dont use it

If someone else can report differently on my observations or prove me wrong...please post your own observations!

 

[Officer Reene]

Sevo is working on a building model (and possible movie) for the Temple of Artemis:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=172512


looks like you could use that (unless you got your own model done)

also Impaler[WrG] wrote this:

...As for Temple of Artimus I was thinking that with the change they made to the Pyrimids we lack a free Granary in every city building so why not have it with this temple, it even makes a tiny amount of logical sense (unlike the pyrimd) as Artemus was the godess of fertility.

so maybe add a free granary in every city to this wonder?

(like how Stonehedge adds a obilesk to every city)


Just a suggestion

 

[fitchn]

Ive been testing this verison in MP as well as in SP games...

I noticed something about the Great Generals "born" in AI cities....
they dont do anything but sit in the cities! They can be python coded to do more... but that may mess up MP and AI play...

As is, the will only use the Great Generals for the promotion; they will sit in the city until the AI has enough money to upgrade them...

so I offer my alternative

*snip*

In the earlier version (to avoid the error msg on start up) I followed TheLopez and Snaitf's format (in their respective GG mods) and changed the tags to:

UNITAI_SCIENTIST

of course this does not solve the problem of "hardcoded" issues (basically no AI set up for the GG or GAg)

However I did find out that with the UNITAI_SCIENTIST tag the AI will use the GGs (building a Military Academy or such) as opposed to letting the GG sit in the city and do nothing

since this AI tag is already in the "vanilla" version... it probably lets the AI use the GG to discover (or help discover) a technology and/or make the GG a Great Specialist in that particular city...

Hmmm... interesting! I would have thought that the computer would be even more thrown off than this, as the General does not have the same abilities! I'll have to give it a try! Do you ever see the AI use any units with the Leadership promotion? If not, perhaps the solution might be to give the unit more than one UNITAI, say perhaps the UNITAI_COMBAT as well...

Again this is not perfect... but it levels the playing field so that the AI can utilize the GG as the other great specialists... when born in a city...

Im sure this happens with the Great Agriculuralist... but I havent witnessed many GAg in AI cities...

Unlike GGs, which I see a lot of in AI cities (probably because of my custom buildings/wonders made specifically for GG coinage allow for more GGs to be born! )

In my initial testing, I found that the AI would simply disband the Great Agriculturalists, since it didn't know what to do with it. Perhaps some combination of the existing UNITAI tags might work with it.

so Fitchn my suggestion is change the tags in your next release!

I may just have to do that!

*snip*

PS so far no MP issues and we've been playing normal speed, with the year at 1240 AD

Good to know!

Again this is only a suggestion, take it as you will and I wont be offended if you dont use it

If someone else can report differently on my observations or prove me wrong...please post your own observations!

If anyone has any other observations about this (similar or different) and/or any suggestions, I would love to hear from you!


Note: I find that the easiest way to test the AI is to go into the world builder on the second turn, and drop a spy into several of the AI cities... then you can keep an eye on them to see exactly what they do and don't build, and how they use what they have. In the case of the Great people (or any other unit, for that matter), you can also drop several into their cities (for them, of course) and see what they do with it. As a matter of fact, I would love to have one or two people on board to help specifically with AI testing... any volunteers...?