Mongol UU

[Dreadnought]

I was really disappointed with the Mongol UU. 4.2.2 9weaker than knight!!!) less cost and mountains don't count as movement. Why am I dissappointed? Here's why:

The Mongols were expert horsemen being taught to ride as soon as they could walk. The Mongols literally distroyed all the resistance the Chinese, Russains, Iranians, etc. could throw at them. Answer me, then, WHY IS THE MONGOL UU WEAKER THAN THE KNIGHT? It should be way more powerful than 4.2.2! I understand how the other factors play in, but (especially the mountain movement thingy) they aren't really battle winning factors.

The Mongol UU should at least be 5.3.2 or something!

 

[The Last Conformist]

I think just about everyone is disappointed by the Keshik.

They are quite good in hills, however.

 

[Stevenpfo]

Hence the reason for the editor. All my games are modded in some fasion (because I like tweaking things). Just start a new scenario and adjust the mongol uu how you see fit without touching the map and when you go to play the game it will be as if it was a random map.

 

[LLXerxes]

I agree. They should have increased atack IMHO, along with thier cheapness.
Drop the trekking movement crap. As usefull as uit is,increased attack is kinda better

 

[bobgote]

Hence the reason for the editor. All my games are modded in some fasion (because I like tweaking things). Just start a new scenario and adjust the mongol uu how you see fit without touching the map and when you go to play the game it will be as if it was a random map.

or change the default rules.

I did it with the impi, as they were crap. the impi was an attacking unit, not a defending one, so i made him replace the swordsman and be 3.2.2 (this was before the celts and their swordsman) and it made the zulu game a lot better (and more realistic).

 

[Dreadnought]

All im saying is that the Mongols were better horsemen than the knights of Europe at the time. But in Conquests they are WORSE than the knight!

 

[player1 fanatic]

No Mongol UU is not weak. It's better then Knight.
I would always take lower cost then 3 on defense.
Need for no iron, and quick movment on hills are just extras.

I played with Keshiks a lot and didn't feels cripled with UU.


What really is a problem is that other Knight based UUs are much better: Raider, Ansar, Samurai and Elephant.

If that's problem for you, try this mod:
Add defensive bombardment of 2 to Keshik (like Longbowmen).
That way it will have enchaced defense in uniue way, since it is Horse Archer after all.

 

[SJ Frank]

By the end of the 2nd century AD the Han Empire had virtually ceased to exist, followed by a lengthy period of rival kingdoms that did not end until 618 AD, when the T'ang dynasty came to power. The T'ang were followed by the Sung dynasties (960-1279 AD), which collapsed in the face of the Mongol invasions. By securing the allegiance of the Hsi Hsia in Tibet (1209), Genghis Khan disposed of a potential enemy and prepared the ground for an invasion of China. For several years Mongol armies pillaged the country; finally, in 1214 Genghis overwhelmed the capital of the northern Chin (modern Peking). During the next decades there was an uneasy truce between the Mongols in the north and the Sung state in the south. The Mongols resumed their advance in 1250 under Kublai Khan, grandson of Genghis. From 1267 onward, the Mongols, this time assisted by the armored horsemen Riders and auxiliary troops of north China, attacked on several fronts. When organized resistance ceased soon afterward, foreign invaders controlled the whole of China for the only time in history.

The above is the civilopedia entry for China. I think it is clear that when China was designed in vanilla Civ3, they didn't plan on adding Mongol in an expansion pack.

Now, the Rider would be the perfect UU for Mongol - the best mounted unit of its time that's lighting fast. The most fitting Chinese UU should be some sort of repeating crossbowmen that replaces the longbow.

I wonder if anybody complained about this when the C3C expansion pack was released, but I guess since the Rider was such a good UU, the Chinese backer's didn't want to give it up.

 

[Mescalhead]

I gave the Keshik blitz ability and it doesn't seem too overpowering yet.

 

[Dreadnought]

I like SJ Frank's idea! The Chu Ko Nu would be a great UU for China (takes place of longbowman with extra defense and bombardment -- after all, power of a crossbow and repeating!) while the Rider was Mongols UU.