[MULTI] Something bugs in Spain

calad · May 24, 2014

Okay, here comes the last update of ~~Venice~~ Gondor:

The doom of Gondor:

The situation this time first fauvored Gondor. Japan player was gone so thread from the north was much smaller. However Spain was huge and angry, also Mayas far in the east were ambitious...

Spoiler Fall of Antwerpen :

Maya player decied it is time to reclaim Antwerped, had they asked and offered little cash would have given it.

Spoiler Marocco back in the north. :

AI Japan could not do what player would have, so Marocco was in deep troubles.

Spoiler Peace! :

And finaly a peace! Marocco decided to make a peace because AI Japan clearly could not do what was needed. The problem was that I could not do a peace with Japan because AI thought he had complitely beaten me (true) and demanded every city I had, so nuclear rain into Minas Anor continued. Also foreign legion arrived into Minas Anor.

Spoiler Spain falls back :

The Spanish army in the south had to be destoyed, so I launced my liberation.

Spoiler Another hollow victory... :

And so were Spanish destroyed, but there is no peace for Gondor.

Spoiler Spain in south :

Spanish landing new troops.

Spoiler And more Spanish :

Clearly the second wawe is coming.

Spoiler Revenge of Isabella :

And quickly they revenged, nuclear weapons destroyed our last ground forces.

Spoiler End of Vatican :

And destroyed city of Vatican. They also nuclear bombed my navy, so I had very few units left.
But to be honest I could have been able to set my units smarter and avoided complitely destruction by nuclear weapons. However I was tired because had Japan be there I would have lost much faster. Also technology had advantaged as well and I could not fight back against Spanish Jet Fighters, they were devastating. Venice is no civ for war.

Spoiler Last of navy :

What I had left retreated into Colombo.

Spoiler Is five nukes enough? :

But peace with Marocco ended and 5 nuclear bombs tropped into Minas Anor, this time there was not just a way to survive.

Spoiler Fall of Minas Anor :

And thus this was the real end.

Spoiler Mad dogs of wars :

And like dog of wars, Marocco and Spain started to fight over spoils of me. Clearly well fitting into their image.

Spoiler The last light :

Colombo was also nuked because I had a nuclear weapons there. Had I been faster I would have launched it into Marocco capital as revenge but he was faster, told me he used hot keys... And this is the last screenshot. My civ5 crashed after this and I saw no reason to rejoin into game.

Mighty end indeed!
__________________________________________________

And thats all. Im sorry but I dont think I will play civ5 anymore unless mp is fixed, and firaxi wont do that. The list of problems is endless: lag is constant, joining into server and game takes very long tie, there is no combat log (who attacked you?), if two person reaches enough faith for belif faster person wins, you cant cancel given resources or traderoutes (they are always 30 turns) and if two or more are in war game becomes almost stopped to others.

Heerlo · May 24, 2014

Very tragic to see ~~Venice~~ Gondor fall in such a way. You did put up a good fight, though.

tzaari · May 28, 2014

Part 8, Decline
Turns 405-438

After the destruction of Venice a new world emerged from the ashes of the war. While Spain was now a land of peace, Mayans successfully ended their Conquest of Arabia by taking most of the Arabian by end of the war. In international field of politics, both Japanese and Mayan embargoes were terminated. For first time since in thousands of years, Spanish trade ships were able to travel for Mayan ports and vice versa.

On Western Continent the once great empire of Assyria was coming to its bloody end. Morocco and Japan launched a war of conquest in witch they set free the city states that Assyria had oppressed long ago. Assyrian war is nearing its end and that end will leave the Western Continent with only two civilizations standing. Japan and Morocco. It remains to be seen if Japan will use its last nuclear bombs to attack Morocco, or if Morocco is paranoid enough to attack its ally first.

On Eastern continent time seems to be running short for the still left city states. Mayas already conquered City of Ife, thus ending the status quo on Zanzibar-Ife Isthmus. Spain is preparing to launch an attack on Lhasa and then the remaining cities of Arabia and perhaps the city states of North.

Demographics 438

In Demographics Spain is still strong. It has the largest population, GNP and army. More trade routes should be made by sea to get more gold. Spanish research points are still growing since the building of schools in Vatican and Colombo, so there will be future tech. Most of the tech tree is now researched by remaining players. Assuria, Arabia and Zulus are now almost forgotten people.

Spoiler The Secret Files of Spanish Empire (not for other players to see) :

Spoiler Things that were bugging Spain :

PS: The Last Conquistador met his end finally in 2003 AD after he was found north from Assyria. Still mapping the planet, but obsolete after the invention of satellites.
PPS: There will be longer post next time. Only 62 turns left, so we intend to end the game by playing a longer hopefully desync-free session.

Dahebbie · May 30, 2014

Wow. Looks so interesting.
Could you provide some stats like:
Army size land/navy/airforce
Maybe a look at the social policy tree and stuff like that
Thx

tzaari · May 31, 2014

Dahebbie said:
Wow. Looks so interesting.
Could you provide some stats like:
Army size land/navy/airforce
Maybe a look at the social policy tree and stuff like that
Thx

I can, but Ill need to put these in spoilers since I don't want others to know them before end of the game.

Spoiler Not for other players to see :

Dahebbie · Jun 1, 2014

Thx alot. Always interesting to see.
When are you set to play the next set?

tzaari · Jun 2, 2014

We play on Tuesdays. Since there is only 62 turns left we try to end the game tomorrow.

tzaari · Jun 4, 2014

Dry wind blows from South and brings yet more dust to a place, where dust is abundance already. Old man turns his back on the wind and looks up to the sky to a familiar sight. The sun is still red, but perhaps a bit less than yesterday? Or maybe he is just imagining things again..

Man sits on the dry ground. He picks up a small stone and weighs it. In the world where there is no shortage on stones, he is quite strict on the standards of stones. This will do.

"So, what story would you like to hear today?" He asks childrens, who have been waiting in silence for a surprisingly long time.

"Oh, Tell us the story of the coming of the madness Grampa! Tell us of the days when madness destroyeth the world, please!"

"No, no! Tell us how the madness destroyeth the world and how people survivd!"

"I already told you those yesterday.." Old man said.

"I think I'll tell you an new story. A story of what happened before the madness came and how it became able to destroy the world." He says and starts to draw lines of warship called Carrier on the ground..

Part 9, Future is left for Barbarians
Turns 438-500

It was year 2018 when the war between the Spanish Empire and the Realms of Madness broke out. Spanish Armed Forces were moved on attack positions for a long time and were ready to launch the attack on the enemy forces. They were to hit them fast and hit them hard, for Mayas had a warning for what was to come.

On Zanzibar-Ife-Isthmus the terrible enemy forces of Madness were bombarded by both Cruise missiles and stealth Bombers. Main force was concentrated on enemy rocket artillery, so Mayas could not use them against advancing Spanish Force. After facing the wrath of Imperialist War Machine, enemy was fast to turn their tails and retreat in good order, for they were followers of Order. Ground cleared by this retreat was soon filled with advancing Spanish troops, that were to destroy those Mayan troops on the way to Ife.

In the North a new Town of Salamanca was founded south from Lhasa, to operate as a base for repairing ships base and for Stealth Bombers. The attack of Spanish Armada commenced targeting Dunwich and any enemy troops defending its surroundings. Bombardment by ships and air units shook the ground with immense force and what was left of Mayan units were blown to pieces with Cruise Missiles. After that, the first XCOM units made their orbital drop landing on Citadels of Dunwich and blow them up.

In the latter part of the year 2020 Madness made it's counter-attack. And it was a devastating indeed. Mayas made us of their long forbidden nuclear weapon and dropped it right on top of the Spanish Western Carrier Fleet. What were after that left was bombarded by Naval upgraded Stealth Bombers. When Spanish Admiralty made their estimates on loosed ships they were shocked. Of the formation of 18 warship strong fleet, there was only 7 left by start of the year 2021. 2 Carriers, several Cruisers and even more Destroyers were lost to Mayan Nuclear Bomb and following attack by Stealth Bombers.

And there was more bad news. Moroccans, who had been following the war closely (probably) via Japanese scouting force, had concentrated their army around Colombo and Vatican borders. Declaration of war was followed by massive attack. Sadly, both cities were located on places easy to defend, if there had been any units to do this. The units that were remnants of last Venetian War were no match for Giant Death Robots, XCOMs and Bombers so near on Moroccan mainland. Only victory that was recorded by Spanish Forces was the successful sinking of Moroccan Nuclear Submarine by defenders of Colombo. After that Spaniards evacuated the town for Vatican. Resulting peace gave both cities to Morocco and Spanish Empire were once again thrown out of Western Continent.

On the Eastern Continent Spanish-Mayan War continued bloody. After destruction of most of her fleet Spain sifted the conflict on ground. Since there was no fleet remaining to give support ground troops, more efforts were pushed to build up and use Air Force instead. On Ife-frontier the Spanish Army was advancing and pushing the Mayan troops for better defensive positions. More XCOM units were dropped as a diversion South from Dunwich. Those units orders were to dig in and defend the easily defendable forest and hills. This operation was somewhat successfull since Mayans quickly surrounded the units with their army, thus weakening their units on Ife frontier and giving Spanish Air Force more targets.

While things continued to go well on ground, things continued to sink on oceans. The Second Spanish Carrier Fleet, that had made its long voyage all away from the Southern Moroccan Sea, was descending from north to lay waste on Mayan forces. However this surprise attack was defeated before it even began by Mayan Air Force. All three carriers with all their Jet Fighters and Bombers were destroyed in single turn. Once proud Spanish Armada, the largest Naval Force in the world, was proud no more.

Frontiers after the Liberation of Ife and Dunwich

Enraged by the news the Spain continued to attack on ground and air. For a once, the strategy of destroying enemy units before her cities was abandoned and Dunwich was bombarded by all and everything, thus reducing the city defenses to zero. After that a lone destroyer was send to take the city by sea. Mayas were prepared for this and had placed all the available units on shores to defend. They were taken out by fighters and remaining Spanish Battleship. And then the city was taken.

On Ife frontier Ife was once again free from Mayan conquerors, liberated by Spanish Imperialists. Mayan army made then a dumb move ordered by some corporal named Artificial Intelligence and removed themselves from the borders of City State (that then declared a war on Mayas by becoming ally of Spain). And when the orderly frontier was now less orderly with rocket artillery and great general placed on front line, this great general and artillery piece was destroyer by Spanish attack.

For a full year things looked good for Spain. Dunwich was held with and Mayas were retreated to defensive positions. But war was costly for Air Force that was now mostly in repairs, while Mayan Air Force continued its bombardment by air and its artillery continued on ground. 2024 Dunwich was reconquered by forces of Madness since Spain had no unit to place defending the Southern Dunwich Citadel. Had it had one, it would been probably destroyed by Mayan Air Force.

After Mayan Counter Attack to take back Dunwich and what was left of Spanish Armada

Spanish Air Force had a serious problem. After the liberation of Ife there was no airbase near enough the frontier to defend the airspace, nor was there enough bombers to keep on bombing Mayan troops. There was also insufficient number of front line troops for advance and problems with placing the rocket artillery on Ife frontier. Ife might have been a much better Strategic Location if taken by Spain, instead of liberation. Mayans had successfully defended their land and would be doing so, all the while when Spanish advance would be much harder without fleet to support it. Therefore peace was negotiated and agreed on later part of year 2024.

Era of Giant Death Robots, aka The last 50 turns

After the Spanish-Mayan war Spain was left in fairly good condition. Nuclear Fusion was discovered in 2025 AD thus giving at last something to do with Spanish Uranium sources and the research of Future Tech started! But there was no change to let the good times roll. Spanish Trade was once again halted by attack of the Moron-Moroccans, who thought it might be good idea to conquer Spanish ally of Genoa. This aggression will not stand!

Spanish Armed Forces made a fast maneuver and placed units around Genoa to prevent the Moroccan attack on the city. Unlucky for Genoa, it was placing units in two hexes around the city. And those were the places that Morocco dropped his XCOMs. 2027 Genoa was taken by Moroccan troops and the first Genoese War between Morocco and Spain broke out. Moroccans were proud of being able to take the initiative. They were fools.

If Spanish Armed forces had learned something from the war with Mayans, it was that the navy had no change in hell to defeat strong attack from sky. And so it was that Moroccan navy was decimated in no less than two years and Genoa was taken by Spanish troops. It was however not liberated, like Ife, for Genoese had been fools to continue the last war with Morocco and therefore clearly not orderly enough to rule by themselves.

A Faceful of Palms

After the war Spain was sure that there would now be lasting peace. Spain was more than 200 points behind the leading Morocco, and Mayas were nearing Moroccan lead in fast pace. Only change for Spain was to bide its time now and wait if the leaders would strike each other. But it turned out that Moroccans had made a decision to wage yet another war on Spain. This was made clear in 2030 when Spain made a note that Moroccan XCOMs were not only staying on small unclaimed part of the Northern Spanish Coast, but bringing in more troops and a settler!

In three years Morocco found the City of Oujda and build a Citadel between Genoa and Zaragoza and brought in 13 units right inside Spanish Empire. Spain had practically twice that and more around the area. Not all could be placed on frontier since the economical problems, for Spanish Trade was once again almost non existent because of the wars. And so the Second Genoese War between Spain and Morocco started in 2033.

This second war lasted until 2035 and there was intervention by Japan on Moroccan side, for on the first years Spain made it mostly clear that Morocco could not have victory by itself. Morocco called in Japanese Intervention by using its long lasting defensive alliance with Japanese as an excuse. Either Morocco did have fears that Spain might still make it to liberate long oppressed Nuevo Madrid, or it was able to make Japanese believe this.

But Japanese intervention was not enough. Most of the Japanese Bttleship fleet was destroyed by same manner as all the former fleets. Morocco was able to take Genoa again but there was no showed on Spanish side and Spain was thinking aloud about Mayan intervention or attack on Moroccan soil. So after a lot of unecessary death, a peace was agreed and Genoa and Oujda was given to Spain.

Later a Momument for "Fallen XCOM units in Unnecessary and Stupid wars" was raised in Uojda

Future Tech, but not Future enough

For the last 15 years Spanish Empire lived in peace. A small hope was left that Japan would attack Morocco, or Mayas would attack both and Spain would yet prevail by stabbing somebody in the back.

Mayas did attack Japan and Morocco but that war is for the Mad people to tell. Spanish Empire researched for Future Tech for 130 points until the end of the game, but that was not enough for second place. Morocco and Mayas were competing untill the end of the game by conquering whatever there was left to conquer of City States and long ago collapsed empires of Arabia and Zulus.

And so it was, like Spaniards thought during the last two wars with Morocco, that Morocco was to come second. They should have attacked either Mayas or Japanese in the end to keep up their lead, but instead they went on Spain that was by the time a second grade treat to them. Spain could no longer compete for the Victory in remaining years, but it still had enough force to keep Morocco stalling with unnecessary and useless war with nothing to gain of. On the other hand, Mayas had still some Arabian cities and City States left for taking. And so they did, and so the Madness won.

Spanish Empire in the End

Demographics in the End

Spain end the game as most populous civilization, second in grop yield and GNP and third in Manufacturing, Land and Soldiers. There might have been better numbers in demographics, but all the Spanish efforts were turned to future tech research in the last ~15 turns of the game. In the end Spain made 3395 research points per turn.

I was kind of disappoint that there was no real wars in Western Continent, between the players. In my opinion all of the neighbors of Morocco had a good reason to attack Morocco and thus try and win the game. However Japan was not interested in such an attack. Assyria was left behind technologically quite early and Venetians did not try to provoke others against Morocco. And so Morocco prevailed Victorious in West.

On Eastern Continent Victory might have been for Spain if I had attacked Mayas earlier. Mayas and Morocco had plentiful of weaker neighbors to conquer and make points by that way. Spain destroyed Romans so early that they really did not have much to give for Spain by points. However it was enough for Spain to lead the game 3/5 of the turns, even when Spain was choked economically by trade banning and other nasty ways that the Venetians might tried to

So thanks for everybody who read this thread, posted replies and made suggestions. And of course for other players. Ill include some more screenshots here of statistics by Beachead and a link for Beacheads replay-video.

Statistics (by Beachead): http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/...rt=newestfirst&browsefilter=myfiles&view=grid
Replay (by Beachead): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UxBq1-wYguY&feature=youtu.be

Spoiler Things that were bugging Spain :

PS: After so many spoiler-tagged bug reports, I think Ill write one post solely in order to summarize the bugs we had and how much time we used for actually playing the game vs battling with desyncing and bugs. There is also some game mechanics and improvements on the multiplayer interface itself I'd like to point out.

Heerlo · Jun 4, 2014

Wow, that was quite a game. And a great read, too. :goodjob:

Congrats to ~~Mayas~~ Mad People on the win.

tzaari · Jun 5, 2014

Here is the summary of the game by Promontory aka Player of Japanese Civilization. He doesn't have account here in civfanatics so I'm posting this for him.

Japan retrospective

This was my first multiplayer Civ 5 game and my first time playing with these people. I figured I could take the opportunity to give my impressions of the game from a newcomer's perspective. Obviously all comments of the other players are of them as players of this particular game and not of them as persons. No screenshots because I didn't take any, just a big ol' wall o' text.

I had never played Japan before, and wasn't really sure what to do with them. I wasn't planning on pursuing victory at all costs - I get more enjoyment out playing and chatting about whatever with other humans. I also didn't think the points victory was a very good idea, since I expected everyone to turtle up and make a mad dash at each other's cities in the last 50 turns. I was looking forward to co-operating with my friend who had invited me into the game, but sadly he was on the other continent. My most long-term plan was 'let's be a sort of a seapower I guess'.

Since I didn't really know what kind of players the others were, I expanded perhaps a bit too conservatively, prioritising defensible locations and relatively short distances between cities. This manifested in happiness problems, because I didn't cover a lot of terrain and bonus resources. My big advantage was that I had tons of jungle and mountains, so I set out to squeeze every possible science point out of them. In retrospect, I definitely should have paid more attention to food production, but since my happy cap was very low for a long time I didn't bother until later in the game. Should've turned all those riverside jungles into farms, I certainly had rainforest to spare.

Diplomatically I was genuinely interested in peace for a long time. About halfway through the game I arranged to go on a trip which coincided with the probably very last and most 'critical' play session. Since I knew I wouldn't be around when the game would be decided, I started to be a bit more active for my own amusement. As it turned out, the game continued long after this 'decision'!

I probably spent too much time being concerned about Assyria: I thought they had too many cities, but didn't appreciate how much their AI governance set them back. Once I was sure my technological advantage was enough to deter them and not just invite a technology-stealing attack I became more relaxed with them. They and half the world did send spies to steal technology, but I wasn't really bothered by it: it was a a natural consequence of keeping the tech lead for so long. Still, my concern about Assyria led me to ally with Morocco.

Morocco was pretty easy to get along with, which helped our relationship in the game. We talked about city placements, allied against Assyria, traded, took long walks on the beach together... I did, however, sense that Morocco was a bit suspicious. However, since our relations had been good or at least cordial throughout the game, I didn't really want to actively betray them and didn't plan on attacking them, even if it might have been optimal for points. He did pick autocracy instead of my suggestion, order, but it wasn't a dealbreaker.

I thought of Venice as a potential target pretty much throughout the game, but I was deterred early on by his super-defensible city and his straightforwardness in our deals. I even agreed to build a city for him when he immediately agreed to pay the first sum I suggested, which got me an early university and some upgrades. I stayed out of the first Venice-Spain war, and my conquest of Venice's allied city state Brussels was more motivated by the fact I had picked Exploration as a social policy when Rationalism wasn't yet available and wanted an extra port city. I also used it as an opportunity to level up my army, although Venice suggested my army was struggling. We can't handle Brussels bureaucracy!

Later on Venice's diplomatic style became more brusque. He had picked Freedom, and would occasionally send me open borders offers without any preamble. When asked, he stated his onlymotive was to drive more of his tourism to me (and, I thought, cause me happiness problems). His other deal offers also became much more 'take it or leave it'-style, which was of course true, since he was filthy rich, but didn't warm me towards him. He asked me once what I was planning, suggesting I was going to attack Morocco, but didn't actually offer an alliance against them. He sent me alliance offers through the diplomacy system, but didn't actually discuss with me about them. I also considered the possibility of a Morocco-Venetian alliance against me. Thus I gravitated to Morocco's side and started to encourage Morocco to take action. In retrospect, I could have allied with Venice, but was put off by Venice's style. Morocco was easier to work with.

Relations with Spain were ambivalent. I sent some ships to observe the narrow strait between our continents specifically to see how he would react, and he reacted very suspiciously. From this I gathered that he was an experienced player and figured he would be able to hold his own against Venice and Morocco. Spain was a big help, perhaps even the prime mover of keeping me as the host of the world congress versus Venice while asking for very little in return, which I appreciated. I was puzzled by his attempt to colonize 'our' continent when he had defeated Rome early on in the game and had a huge area to work with - seemed like a waste of resources to me. However, I warned them when I noticed an increased amount of Moroccan troops moving to the direction of the colonies just to give them a chance, but my warning came too late.

I had very little contact with the Zulu or Arabia. The Zulus, however, were played by my friend who had invited me to the game. When the Mayans attacked them, I felt obligated to help - friends to eternity, loyalty, honesty, we'll stay together through thick or thin and all that. I also considered the Mayans as a dark horse of the game after both Zulus and Arabia had trouble - I had the tech lead for a long time, but was pretty sure the Mayas would eventually have the best science production. Finally, I disliked how Mayans publicly denied their attack plans only to attack a few turns later.

Attacking the Mayans didn't cost me anything - I only sent my existing navy, taking advantage of the Great Lighthouse wonder. I didn't send any ground units because I didn't think they would be able to hold - they would also be too slow. I endeavoured to keep the fleet's movement secret, although it ran into a Venetian submarine. Venice did not comment on the fleet at all, although I suspected them of warning the Mayans. Luckily for me, the Mayans didn't have ships near Dunwich and I was able to organize the fleet for the attack. I attacked on the same turn as I proposed an embargo against the Maya to 'roleplay' my role as the host of the world congress. Mayan comment of 'so what, are there any Japanese around here then' followed by my fleet sailing out of the fog was a very satisfying moment.

The fleet did some damage to the Mayan coast, but couldn't do anything about the Mayan ground force attacking the Zulus - which the Zulus acknowledged, but were happy nonetheless that someone was even trying to help. The original plan was to raid Mayan sea resources until the last one and then threaten its pillaging (and the happiness minus) if there would be no ceasefire. However, when the next session began Zulus immediately sued for peace, so not all of Mayan resources were damaged. I considered this a very tiny war and wasn't feeling particularly antagonistic against the Mayans.

For reasons detailed above I then began to conspire with Morocco against Venice. What gave the most drive to the plan was the Venetian completion of the Manhattan Project and their purchase of Antwerpen with its uranium - with nukes Venice would have been a very dismaying target. I engaged in some additional intrigue as well. I contacted Assyria and told them of our plans, saying that if they would choose that moment to attack Morocco I would not send a full force against them. I did this so I could confidently send more troops against Venice, and to direct any Assyrian aggression against Morocco instead of myself - in all honesty, I would probably have been an easier target.

This would have worked better if Assyria hadn't accidentally sent their approving response on allchat, which admittedly was damn funny. Luckily he didn't directly name me, and Morocco seemed to think Venice was behind it. Assyria had, however, possibly misunderstood me. He seemed to think I was planning on backstabbing Morocco, while I was simply stating I would focus on Venice instead of him.

I managed to coax Morocco into agreeing to attack Venice, which he had possibly been planning already. I renounced any claim on the Venetian capital and named Minas Ithil as my price. The reason for this was that while the capital was the real prize with all its wonders, it was a lot closer to Morocco. Taking it for myself would just prompted Morocco to take it, and he was in a much better position to do so. Having Minas Ithil for myself would not give me any wonders, but at least a lot of population and science, and a possible staging ground for attacking Minas Anor if the Moroccans would turn against me.

The Venetian war has been detailed elsewhere. Targeting nukes turned out to be an annoyance, and in an interesting mishap one of my nukes damaged a Moroccan paratrooper - starting a war between us! Assyria immediately declared war as well, but cancelled when we worked things out. For a moment Morocco thought that I had indeed betrayed him, because it was not obvious what had caused the war declaration. Once the mistake had been identified, we resumed our campaign, but my economy took a hit with all the trade routes to Morocco being cancelled.

I was able to conquer Minas Ithil without using nukes, which was a relief. I was absent on the second round of the war on that aforementioned trip and came back to a dead economy and a large navy - turns out the AI loves carriers. Assyria, Arabia and the Zulus had quit, so I and Morocco proceeded to partition Assyria with little incident. Meanwhile, I learned that Spain was planning on attacking the Maya and mentioned this to Morocco, who then began planning on seizing Spain's last holdings on our continent.

After Assyria's partition the rest of the game was uneventful for me, and frankly, I was quite sick of it already with all the questionable design decisions and technical issues. I stayed out of Morocco's first invasion of Spain because I noticed Spain's impressive air force and tried to mediate. I joined in on the second attempt mostly out of boredom, but sent only my oldest ships to be hammered by Spanish Stealth Bombers. Morocco surprised me by giving up all his gains in the peace treaty. While we had been chatting a lot during the Venetian war, messages from Morocco had become increasingly rarer, which was worrisome. I wasn't entirely sure what his plans were anymore. It's possible that my two leftover nukes were all that kept the alliance going.

Spain tried to persuade me to turn against Morocco. During our discussions, they accidentally typed 'Maya' instead of Morocco (followed by me sending my message intended for Morocco to him, oops). After clarifying this Spain tipped me off that the Mayas had been planning against me for a long while. I had been trying to keep a loose formation of ships guarding approaches to my coast (well outside of nuke range) throughout the game and had noticed Mayan submarines. Meanwhile, Mayan X-Com troops had airdropped into the city state of Mogadishu. When questioned about these, the Mayans had claimed 'observation in Assyria' in regards to the subs and 'defense against Morocco' on the topic of X-Coms.

I hadn't bought these explanations, since Mayans had lied about their intentions to the Zulu, and after Spain's warning decided to step up patrols (sorely wishing air reconnaissance and patrol routes were still in the game, why would you take those out?), knowing that there was one blank spot I habitually tended to ignore because sending ships there was slow. The discovery of the Mayan task force was not entirely surprising. He had skillfully used his submarines to find a blind spot and amassed a substantial force to take my capital, with destroyers (that 'melee ships' can take cities was news to me) to actually take the city and X-Coms in Mogadishu in jump range to defend it. When they were discovered, the Mayans declared war while I was typing a conciliatory message to tell them to go home since the game was up. I was not really in the mood for the war (over six hours of sitting, playing past midnight!) but the Mayans were itching for it, saying that the game would be boring without it.

I had, meanwhile, calculated my available force and concluded that the Mayan fleet would be easily crippled - part of the reason I offered him peace. When things came to a head, my loose formation coupled with the bonuses from the Great Lighthouse and Exploration meant that I could scout the Mayan fleet and destroy parts that were most threatening with ease. I took losses, but in two turns the Mayan fleet's ability to threaten my capital was gone before they were even in range of my land- based aircraft. Peace was made, and the surviving Mayans sailed home.

If a team victory had been an option then the Moroccan-Japanese alliance would have topped the scoreboard. But everything is made up and the points don't matter. Japan defended her coasts and crabs for over 6000 years, honoured her alliances and made great leaps in science. The canon ending for this playthrough is Oda Nobunaga and Ahmad al-Mansur together on a beach, their mechas holding hands, walking side by side across the glowing sand towards the sun setting over Minas Anor, and no-one can tell me otherwise.

Overall, playing with other people was entertaining enough, but we probably could have played a better game (we should totally play Alpha Centauri!). Warfare in CivV is tedious, tedious enough that I actively avoided fighting wars, but there isn't enough to do in city-building either. One unit per tile meant that times Morocco and I actively hampered each other in our wars by blocking each other's movement! Yet stacking aircraft is not a problem at all.

Multiplayer suffers from technical problems, and even a small disconnect will hand over the reins to an AI which will quickly undo your plans (in my case, Japan's AI planned a war against Morocco), and the game itself feels like it lack features (like the aforementioned air reconnaissance). There are also a number of puzzling elements - the accidental war between Morocco and I, city capture screen not accounting for everything (in my case, I often got the impression that my happiness after a conquest would be negative, but thanks to Order's Iron Curtain policy I stayed positive, despite what the game said) and several other annoyances I forget at the moment. Here's hoping for Beyond Earth having a working multiplayer at launch. If not, we'll always
have mindworms.

Japan's pros:
+ Good science production
+ Victory at sea
+ Didn't die
+ Super witty city names

Japan's cons:
- Conservative expansion
- Constant economic balancing
- Never actually used a mecha in battle. For shame
- I wanted to name the Japanese city closest to Casablanca Play it again, Samurai, but it didn't fit. It was only after I rewatched the film that I remembered it's Play it, Sam(urai) which fit perfectly. It was right there and I only realized in the last session

Beachead · Jun 5, 2014

IÄ IÄ Ph'nglui Mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn!

So it came that Realms of Madnesssss claimed victory by handy little over 100 points. First half of the first game was a real nail-biter.

Spoiler Spanish assault :

Last game ended just when I noticed the first Spanish armada approaching from the coast of Lhasa, though I had been forewarned by moroccoans and japanese about the disappearance of the spanish fleet.

Thanks to this forewarning I had for ten turns ramped up my defences on the coast and massproduced copious amounts of guided missiles. Thanks to my extensive ground wars on the east I could not afford a fleet and there was no time to build any so I had to just trust in my Citadels around Dunwich and R'lyeh and the natural defence of the Innismouth's locations.

I did not give a flying about Ife since I only took it to have front line of land wars away from my most important production cities of Arkham and Miskatonic which produced most of my land forces.

Since my bomber squadrons had not any problems taking cities in the east, I spent all the upgrades before to naval attacks since I was fairly sure that Spain would try to sneak attack me from the sea. This prediction came true and I am sure I could not have held the spanish massive fleet in check without the upgrades. My bombers were true elite formation, each of the 12 of them having 3-4 upgrades, including naval II and air repairs which kept them just coming and let me almost ignore spanish interception.

And lastly... I had one nuke in my sleeve.

I lost Ife and Dunwich momentarily, mainly thanks to Spain sacrificing about 8 XCOM squadrons and two entire carrier task groups to it. Truly the massacre my stealth bombers made startled even me. My sub managed to spot the second spanish fleet that strayed too close the coast and in one glorious turn, my whole bombing wing took out three carriers. On that moment I realized that I will have this game.

I had previously thought that to have a shot of victory against Morocco I would need to take Spains capital and the old Roman Capital to counteract the points he would get from conquering city states and assyria and venice, but when it came clear that Morocco-Japan were gunning against Spain I knew that I could coast to victory by annexing remaining Zulu and arab cities + some city states for good measure.

That I promptly did in the last 15 turns so not to give anyone heads up and possibility to try to counter that move.

But I had one task still ahead me, a matter of honor.

In the glorious and insane war against zulus our free-market communist economy (truly insane) was hit hard by japanese pillaging fleet that did considerable damage to Realms of madness coastline. I had sworn to have my revenge, and revenge was to be had. So I constructed Task Force Dagon and sent it with expert care through japanese blind spots. It had one purpose and one purpose only: Take and hold Neo Kobe city or drown trying. And oh boy did it drown.

Spoiler Task Force Dagon :

I planned to wait for the last 10 turns so Japan could not take their city back, but alas, they spotted my beautiful fleet and turned it into sinking wreck. God damn, Nippon.

Still, my last minute conquering gave me my victory, but I cant be too proud of that. It was mainly made possible by the fact arabian player missed something like 70% of the games so it was just wrecking AI. Since I am immortal-deity level player it wasnt much of a challenge to take whole Arabia.

Also Morocco could have attacked my east coast which was without other defence than XCOMs and air force units. Or conquered Japan or just probably by taking all city states in the other continent. So I have to concur with japanese player, the game was really the love story of Oda and Ahmad. But alas, a win is win, and so world will perish in the chaos of the awakening of the old ones. Iä Iä! Thanks to all participants and readers of this topic, nice to have you as watchers.

pvtjava · Jun 6, 2014

Thanks for all of your time and effort on this. It has been great fun reading along. I sincerely hope there are more threads like this to come.

tzaari · Jun 6, 2014

pvtjava said:
Thanks for all of your time and effort on this. It has been great fun reading along. I sincerely hope there are more threads like this to come.

I'm glad you liked it!

There might just be more to come. We start next game in next week or week after that, but this time with more victory conditions. I am just hoping that game gives me this time something that is not Mediterranean, after playing Ottomans, Byzantium and Spain in this BNW games.

About the summary of the bugs we had during the game: I did send this same list to 2K Support and they send reply in same day. I referred to the petition that now seems to have more than 200 signs in it and linked this thread. I hope they do still patch Civ5 to fix things in multiplayer.

Spoiler Message to 2K Support :

PS: Forgot to mention problems with Hybrid. House-rule works too well on fixing that.

Dahebbie · Jun 7, 2014

Thx guys for this very nice write up. Very god to hear from japan as well.

Sounds so bloody annoying with the technical difficulties! Makes me hesitate to try MP. Aside from that, im considering shifting my university study from history to finnish so that I can join your group :lol:

Thx again

calad · Jun 9, 2014

Now I looked graphs again. Looks like my Venice did very well. Nothing is more dangerous than envious neighborhoods.

Heerlo · Jun 9, 2014

calad said:
Now I looked graphs again. Looks like my Venice did very well. Nothing is more dangerous than envious neighborhoods.

You played Venice very well IMO. It was a wonder that you held out as long as you did.

Tulevaisuusauto · Jun 11, 2014

Spoiler :

Morocco started from a pretty nice position, the first thing I did was to maximize faith production because Pagodas help a lot for over half of the game. I picked monasteries as I noticed incense in some quantity near me. At the same time I wanted to get a port city as cargo ship trade is more lucrative. This brings us to the economy. I usually want to strive for a strong economy as it helps a lot during the way to the end so a big part of the game(even bigger as this was a point victory game) was focused solely on getting enough GPT and I'd say this succeeded mostly.

Spoiler :

We had a lot of desert which let us build the Kasbah which makes deserts average land to settle. I wouldn't build a city completely surrounded by desert though as you'd have to import food. We imported food to Marrakech after getting the economy rolling so that helped a lot later as war production for nearly any unit was 1 or 2 turns.

Spoiler :

Generally speaking I didn't have to worry much about happines or money during this game as they were always manageable with a lot of frustrating micro management(lag and micro means you'll be looking at the city view for a looooong time) What hurt the most was probably Order which nearly everyone voted to be the world ideology, this meant that I had to cut down on specialists which hurt my score(future tech).

I picked Autocracy for the military boni and the Third Way as we had problems with coal(we had none before the war with Spain).

Spoiler :

But yeah, I think most of you want to read about the war with Venice we had.

Spoiler :

After annexing the colonies of Spain, I thought the time was right for trying to conquer Venice.
The first priority was to complete the manhattan project. I had fallen behind in tech a little bit as I had to literally build my army from scratch to wage the war against Spain. As I am fairly new in playing against humans, I decided to overlook the navy as I thought a few nukes would be enough to reduce the cities for easy taking.

Spoiler :

I don't remember exactly how I allied with Japan but we had had some nice deals with them all in our favour so I thought they would be nice to have with me. I didn't fear any backstab so the accidental war we had shocked me for nearly 10 minutes as I was trying to work out what the hell should I do to win. Gladly it turned out to be a terrible design choice.
So yeah, after I hid my units in the desert near Casablanca, I tried to rush manhattan project and a nuke ASAP but it was very slow work, the Japanese had more than 2 after I got my first one and my strategy depended on a surprise nuclear strike which kinda succeeded as it wiped out most of the Venetian army. After that progress was very very slow as we tried anything to get through the Thermopylaeic terrain. Overlooking the navy was the worst choice I did in this game and I didn't have time to rectify this as every city I had rolled out tanks as fast as possible to counter the super efficient Venetian war machine.
When I learned the Japanese would miss a session, I gave up and made a peace with Venice, then I produced as many nukes as possible in 10 turns and finally won the war, altough the Spanish helped with this a lot. I gave colombo to the Spaniards because I had to fix my economy and start rebuilding Minas Anor after the massive nuclear destruction. After getting happiness(burnt Salamanca) and money on the positive, I started to build more army and focus on getting GDR's on the field as nukes were banned soon after the Second Venetian war.

Spoiler :

We decided with Japan to carve Assyria and the city states between us. It was a nice blitz with minimal losses(one ship, and an xcom).

Why I think I lost.

After end game set in I decided to push Spain out from our continent, this went well. After this, I wanted to punish Spain by invading them which was obviously a bad choice. I really thought they had lost all their navy in the war with the Mayans and that they had posted most of their forces on the Mayan border. The second war was just out of boredom as I realized I probably had no time to try and surprise the Mayas. But yeah, during the last session, frustration against the stupid game mechanics and horrible net code really set in and I couldn't focus. Might've won it otherwise, but I really didn't give a hoot about it anymore. Apparently I was so bored I forgot about chatting which worried Japan. :lol:

The next session will be played with more victory rules so it could be fun again to play this game.

Spoiler :

Nick Carpathia · Jun 20, 2014

That looks like a fun game!

[MULTI] Something bugs in Spain

calad

Emperor

Heerlo

Jedi Master Hearlo

tzaari

Chieftain

Dahebbie

Warlord

tzaari

Chieftain

Dahebbie

Warlord

tzaari

Chieftain

tzaari

Chieftain

Heerlo

Jedi Master Hearlo

tzaari

Chieftain

Beachead

Chieftain

pvtjava

The Grey Cat

tzaari

Chieftain

Dahebbie

Warlord

calad

Emperor

Heerlo

Jedi Master Hearlo

Tulevaisuusauto

Chieftain

Nick Carpathia

Unleash the HAARP

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