My armies are so week!

[erix]

Hi,
I always lose may armies in the first attack. It seems like 3 tanks are stronger than an army which contains 3 tanks.
I at least got 10 armies but 9 of them have lost in the first battle. I think using leaders for improvements is better.
Am i missing something?

 

[Dirk Aurel]

Well first I´d also say armies aren´t as good as they could have been,in fact I´d say that about the entire combat system of Civ3, but they are part of the game.Think the biggest advantage of an army is it´s defensive value,now I wouldn´t use a defensive army in the early stages of the game,there are simply too few of them,but in the later stages with the Pentagon and Military Academy,creating a Mech Inf Army is very impressive.As for your tank army,which I use too,attacking single units is good,am not sure if your not messing something up because tank armies do have Blitz ability but you can´t attack three times,so your army was probably too weak when attacking the third tank.Attack and defensive values of tanks should give you round about a one in three chance of losing... :crazyeyes

 

[erix]

Thanks for the info. I was just unlucky i think.

And I have another question.
As I understand "blitz ability" means the unit can go back when it is weak. Than should all the units in the army have blitz ability for the army to have blitz ability?

 

[Zachriel]

Originally posted by erix
Thanks for the info. I was just unlucky i think.

Probably. Try to select an easy combat for the first time you use your army. That way you can build the Heroic Epic. Afterwards, you can use your army against more difficult targets. I usually save them for that particularly well-defended city.

 

[Maleficence]

Blitz in this case refers to the term: "blitzkrieg" roughly meaning "lightning war", which was a term used to describe the strategy employed by the combined arms of the german wehrmacht and luftwaffe during the beginning of WW II. It's a strategy most noted for quickly attacking in succession, while denying your enemy the chance to gather its troops or form any cohesive defensive plan.

In the game, the blitz ability translates into a unit being able to attack once for every movement point it has (note: if you attack a stack, you'll use up one movement point to attack and another movement point to retreat back to your original scare after you defeat the unit you attacked, for a total of two movement points. )

Panzers', modern armor and the like have the blitz ability as well as armies.

The ability to retreat is given to "fast" units. A fast unit is a unit with more than one movement point. You will need an army compromised solely of "fast" units in order to be able to retreat, as I believe the number of moves per turn an army gets is based directly on the number of moves per turn the units inside of it have. So if you have a unit with one move per turn, it will be the slowest unit and will set the pace for the rest of the army, making the army as a whole, not fast, hence unable to retreat.

 

[erix]

I got it. Thanks.
So putting units with 1 move per turn into an army is not a good tactic.
Retreating generally doesnt work for me because oppenent's units generally have more move turns left and kills my army before it retreats. They sometimes put 4-5 units in a square and when I attack them, the war goes on for hours (actually 1.5 minutes ) And I lose my army.
I started using my leaders for wow rush building.
Thanks again for brief explanation.

 

[Dirk Aurel]

Wouldn´t go that far erix,1 movement armies are just as good, you don´t have any Blitz units till tanks anyway.What seems pretty effective are armies consisting of UU´s.In my last game had an army of Samurai,3 units A&D 4 and a movement of 2, excellent,now have an army of three Immortals,also great because Pikeman don´t excist yet and their 2 on D is the best there is.Otherwise I´d use armies consisting of 3 Swordmens, good A&D value,which one can´t say about Horseman,3 Knights make a better army though than 3 Cavalry,due to high differences in A&D values.Have also changed my Mech Inf,they now have the Blitz ability and can move along with tanks

This is justified since Mech Inf today is more mobile than tanks were in WW2. I´d also say that normal Infantry is probably too weak,and doesn´t get the recognition it deserves,tank armies in the game are too effective,in reality tanks would never move without Infantry support,way too risky.

 

[erix]

I just started using all my leaders for hurrying wonders. I think that provide more benefit than armies.
Thanks anyway.

 

[Dirk Aurel]

Hmm yeah,but use at least one to create an army,noteably the first,with it victorious you can build the Heroic Epic,increasing your chances for further leaders to come,for rushing wonders or whatever you want to do with them.

 

[loki]

It's already been debated before. Here is my favored tactic dealing with GLs.
Use your first leader to generate an army (unless you are neck to neck with the AI for building a wonder you really want). This will allow you to build the heroic epic, increasing your chances to have more leaders later (which you can use to hurry wonders).
Now, regarding armies : use the military academy to build armies. and put only defensive units in them. An army of infantry is slow, but it quells many resistors per turn and is virtually inexpungnable from a conquered city. Beside, the AI will never try to attack defensive armies, so it's great for defending your stack of artillery.
I rarely use offensive armies.

Note: if you are using 1.17, there could be several benefits for offensive armies (tanks, modern armors), since they fixed the blitz option, allowing you to attack several times per turn. The tech competitive AI in 1.17 will maybe force you to use your GL to ruch wonders more often though.
I haven't much to say about 1.17 since I play 1.16 for now.

loki

 

[Dirk Aurel]

Exactly what I said loki,but wasn´t wearing my signature before

 

[Zachriel]

Armies are great.

In this position, I'm deep within enemy territory. The recently conquered town of Shanghai is protected by an Infantry army, and is attacking Beijing with about 20 bombers. There is an artillery stack in range of Beijing with about 20 artillery, also protected with an infantry army. They are supported by three tank armies and various other units, including infantry and elite tanks. Only other armies could stand up to the withering fire of this attack force.

(Notice that Shanghai has already completed the Cathedral and Temple. I said I was deep in enemy territory. )

 

[loki]

A quick question for you Zachriel : if this city flips with your army and 20 bombers in it... Will you reload ?

loki

 

[erix]

No. In that case Zachriel will throw the machine from the window.

 

[eyrei]

Originally posted by Zachriel
Armies are great.

In this position, I'm deep within enemy territory. The recently conquered town of Shanghai is protected by an Infantry army, and is attacking Beijing with about 20 bombers. There is an artillery stack in range of Beijing with about 20 artillery, also protected with an infantry army. They are supported by three tank armies and various other units, including infantry and elite tanks. Only other armies could stand up to the withering fire of this attack force.

(Notice that Shanghai has already completed the Cathedral and Temple. I said I was deep in enemy territory. )

Looks like one of my games. I am perfectly satisfied with the way armies work, except I really wish that armies of marines and paratroopers would retain their special abilities.

 

[erix]

An OT question.
How can I also take screenshots of my game like the one above?

 

[Zachriel]

Originally posted by loki
A quick question for you Zachriel : if this city flips with your army and 20 bombers in it... Will you reload ?

loki

No. I will take my lumps as always. :arrow:

There are not only 20 bombers, but an infantry army, and about 20 assorted other military police units in that city. I have already completed the temple (by force-building) and cathedral and will build the colosseum on my next turn, so the chance of a flip are very small to none. (Not that I don't worry about it!)

 

[Hagbart]

You have to load units into them!!

 

[narmox]

Doesn't the 1.17 patch make garrisons more powerful now? I seem to remember a definite "now 1 army should keep 1 citizen from revolting", rather than _may_.. Or something like that.

Time to re-read the changelog...

 

[Zachriel]

Originally posted by narmox
Doesn't the 1.17 patch make garrisons more powerful now? I seem to remember a definite "now 1 army should keep 1 citizen from revolting", rather than _may_.. Or something like that.

Time to re-read the changelog...

Yes, You are now able to completely stop all chances of a flip with a massive military stack. There used to be a very small, but finite, chance before of a flip. This never bothered me, but the new way is better, I think. Unfortunately, as far as I know, they have not provided quantitative information on this.

In Shanghai, I disbanded some infantry and forced the temple while it was still in resistance. With the massive military power, they were stable in just one turn. Then I disbanded one infantry and rushed the cathedral. Next turn I will rush the colosseum. Beijing, I did the same. I started with about 5000g in my war chest and make about 100g per turn. My cities are cranking out new infantry and tanks.

I am very, very deep into enemy territory. I think I can hold it, but only if I can keep Russia (brown) and the Iroquois (purple) out of the war. The continent used to be balkanized in the center. Persia (green) kept starting wars. This is what happened.