Naval Commanders

[RRRaskolnikov]

If u wanna play in the meantime no problem

YEah food is worrying, overlap is in order indeed.

With two workers prechopping, I guess we can take the detour by poly before going for Oracle.

I see your points about lack of trading options: imo it's a reason to get the lighthouse rather than the oracle (but we are too deep down the Oracle path I think), or take aesthetics as u mentionned. I can't remember JC preferences, but I think he is one of the catapults beelining AI, which means he will get his hands on math early on imo. Though math also leads to currency so I am not sure for now hehe. Though aesthetics off oracle then lit has my preference for now (we will get OBs with Cesar so a wb might just be what we need to make the aesthetics plan the best).

WIll think at it a bit more.

 

[obsolete]

Well, we do have the option to switch to sailing right now, then finish masonry while building the lighthouse, then start teching the oracle while chopping the GREAT LIGHT-HOUSE.

Our tech speed is so low right now with so little commerce tiles, we may have no optimal choice but to choose Monarchy. At least it's expensive and you usually can get quite a few things with it in trades. If not diplo bonuses.

 

[RRRaskolnikov]

Well, we do have the option to switch to sailing right now, then finish masonry while building the lighthouse, then start teching the oracle while chopping the GREAT LIGHT-HOUSE.

Our tech speed is so low right now with so little commerce tiles, we may have no optimal choice but to choose Monarchy. At least it's expensive and you usually can get quite a few things with it in trades. If not diplo bonuses.

Yeah. In this case we can skip poly as well to increase our chances. Let see what Kossin thinks.
edit: are we in slavery already? if yes a double pop whip of worker, overflow into SH when we grow size four?

edit2: nah, poly is fine since we don't want to do both med and poly before litterature I think. And if going for both the great lighthouse and oracle, production is likely to be the limiting factor anyway

 

[obsolete]

I was debating on slavery switch, but usually try to get 2 civic changes in 1 revolution. I'm not so sure but if it doesn't put much delay on SH, then I don't have too much a problem with it, since we won't have another wonder build for quite a few more turns.

Whatever you do, don't lose the Henge Race...

 

[RRRaskolnikov]

I was debating on slavery switch, but usually try to get 2 civic changes in 1 revolution.

Yeah that's why I asked since I would postpone the switch too if it's not done already. I sure don't wanna miss SH with a cha leader (and with so much hammers invested already)!

 

[obsolete]

BTW, after TGLH is done (if we win the race), we should put 1 turn of hammers into Mids ASAP to block any stone wonder-builder from getting any ideas.

 

[RRRaskolnikov]

BTW, after TGLH is done (if we win the race), we should put 1 turn of hammers into Mids ASAP to block any stone wonder-builder from getting any ideas.

Enlight me: AI knows if you started it already and takes it into account when choosing what to build?

 

[obsolete]

Yup, that seems to be the recent exploit these days... using the AI's cheats against them once again.

I also wonder, if maybe we should wait a few turns after the Henge, we'd be getting a total culture of 8+1+2. That way, we'd hit 100c in a few turns to pop borders again. This would at least remove the 2 FoG tiles near our capital, and I'm so used to Murphy's Law trying to screw me over by just 1 turn all the time.

It could be that the 1 turn we pop borders faster by no anarchy, could be the one turn that saves from a nasty archer or what-not. Or maybe I'm just too paranoid. I've been mixing deity with immortal games and I can't quite seperate the different time-line flow very well anymore.

 

[obsolete]

To be honest, now that I think of it, we probably should have put 1 turn into the henge the second I had myst researched. But I am so eager to get that early growth up, etc.

 

[RRRaskolnikov]

I can't quite seperate the different time-line flow very well anymore.

Being paranoid and cautious is the safe choice

 

[babybluepants]

Enlight me: AI knows if you started it already and takes it into account when choosing what to build?

I did some worldbuilder testing on this recently and got a different result with Oracle. Putting a hammer into Oracle before any AI has a beaker invested in Priesthood works. They don't research it for ages afterwards. If they've started on Priesthood, they would go for Oracle immediately regardless of what I did. Not sure how this applies to something like Mids or GLH, though, since the tech required has other early-game uses. Has anyone dug up code on this?

 

[RRRaskolnikov]

Interesting findings bbp (SGOTM testing will kill you ), would be interesting to hear more from the code masters indeed... Silu, bestsss, DanF?

 

[obsolete]

I guess baby did some testing after reading this in one of the immortal threads:

Noticing that the GLH still hadn’t gone by that stage, I put the next turn’s production after the lighthouse got built into the GLH, because I recall reading somewhere on the forum that the AI scans everyone to see if anyone has started a wonder before deciding if an AI will build it. With that in mind, I thought that if the GLH hadn’t actually been started yet, this might delay them building it.

BTW RRR, you might also plan ahead for a whip during the mini-light-house before TGLH to get the bonus hammers going sooner. We will probably stack some unhappy, but at least we get +1 happy from henge, haha!

Anyhow, Kossin may take a while for some input, so feel free to get those next ten turns in sooner than latter. I hate seeing interesting SG's hang all the time.

 

[kossin]

City A: definitely not on the PH, that would block the north city. SW on the grassland gives 3 hills which is the next best spot on this island.

City B: ok

City C: alternative could be on the silk 2E1N. We can farm a few grasslands and it gets 2 unused hills. Very bad on food though.

Would also free up a spot for a city alone by the fish... a really crappy city until Moai I guess.

Oracle: need to check more thoroughly what we should consider. MC is never a bad option though.

We need a wb or two to start scouting for locations to settle islands for resources pretty soon.

Romans: unrestricted means it could be Gandhi... or Monte

 

[kossin]

I did some worldbuilder testing on this recently and got a different result with Oracle. Putting a hammer into Oracle before any AI has a beaker invested in Priesthood works. They don't research it for ages afterwards. If they've started on Priesthood, they would go for Oracle immediately regardless of what I did. Not sure how this applies to something like Mids or GLH, though, since the tech required has other early-game uses. Has anyone dug up code on this?

Did you tick on 'random seed on reload' to test this?

 

[obsolete]

Oracle: need to check more thoroughly what we should consider. MC is never a bad option though.

We are not going to get all the pre-requisits in time for MC I fear. So better to just take Monarchy so we have something BIG & NICE to trade around.

 

[RRRaskolnikov]

@Obs: yeah, I will try to squeeze some turns tonight, I will sleep another night

@kossin: good point about unrestricted... Now that I had mentaly prepare myself for JC, I won't mind having Monty next door hehe.
I thought at MC too (was surprised Obs didn't come up with it earlier with his industrious love and all) but I fear we won't have time for pottery as well... no money bag in the capital hurts

Cheers

edit: about the whip, yeah prolly switch in slavery once SH is done and finish the little lighthouse with a two pop whip with max overflow on the big one. I will post some lines before playing in any case to see if I don't miss something

 

[obsolete]

If we researched Med instead of Poly on our way to Priesthood, we'd shave off a turn or two. The problem, is that Med doesn't really help us, when we need Poly for everything from Parthenon to the Library.

It's a calculated risk...

 

[RRRaskolnikov]

If we researched Med instead of Poly on our way to Priesthood, we'd shave off a turn or two. The problem, is that Med doesn't really help us, when we need Poly for everything from Parthenon to the Library.

It's a calculated risk...

Yep... that's what I meant post 23.... though I don't like calculated risk since they seem to doom you more often than not hehe. Really I don't like pushing our luck without any luxury worked in the capital.

 

[kossin]

lol, I forgot Pottery... I haven't played enough the last 3 months.

Monarchy is probably the best then.

Forget Meditation, the 1 turn advantage will be greatly lost later on.