Need help determining traits

[Gojira54]

Folks,

I am looking to determine the proper traits for the nations below - historical, current, whatevs. I have some traits already for them, but some I am not happy with or am ignorant on, and I have some traits being used a lot, while others barely. I'd like the trait pairings to be as diverse as possible when all is done.

Any\all input is appreciated!

Morrocco
Niger
Nigeria
Ethiopia
Madagascar
China
India
Bangladesh
Japan
Vietnam
Korea
Thailand
Myanmar
Spain
England
Russia
Germany
France
Italy
Poland
Romania
Netherlands
Saudi Arabia
Pakistan
Turkey
Iran
Uzbekistan
Indonesia
Philippines
Navajo
Oceania

 

[timerover51]

I am assuming that you are using the standard Conquests traits, to include Sea-Faring. Also, have you given any thought to using 3 traits, rather than the standard 2? I have not had any problems using 3 traits.

Ethiopia: Religious, Agricultural

Oceania: Expansionist, Seafaring

Netherlands: Seafaring, Commercial (yes, the Dutch are good farmers, but they established one of the largest commercial empires in history in the Netherlands East Indies). Note, I am Dutch in background.

Navajo: Agricultural, Industrious

Japan: Religious, Militaristic

England: Seafaring, Industrious

Spain: Religious, Expansionist

Philippines: Seafaring, Agricultural

Indonesia: Seafaring, Religious

What you might want to do is set up a grid of each possible combination of traits, and then plug into each box the appropriate nation. If you go to three traits, you can have two nations with two of the same traits, but still differentiate between them with the third trait.

 

[timerover51]

This is the grid that I was thinking about.

 

[Gojira54]

Thanks for the input TR! Yes, using the standard Civ3 Conquest traits. I have a grid already, and there are a number of duplicates. Some I know rather well, others not so much, hence the post For instance, I have these 4 as being Religious and Agricultural, and I am not sure which to change and to what.

Ethiopia
India
Bangladesh
Romania

I hadn't thought too much about the 3 trait concept. I generally avoid that in my mods, but only because I tend to also have a starting tech unique for each Civ, Culture Group, and Trait, and you can only have 4 starting techs. I don't think I will be doing all that with this, so that opens the door back up for 3.

Since I have all the details in Excel, this is the grid I have:

 

[Gojira54]

This is the grid that I was thinking about.

So for 3 traits we would need a 3 dimensional cube!

 

[Virote_Considon]

I hadn't thought too much about the 3 trait concept. I generally avoid that in my mods, but only because I tend to also have a starting tech unique for each Civ, Culture Group, and Trait, and you can only have 4 starting techs. I don't think I will be doing all that with this, so that opens the door back up for 3.

If you wanted to do it that way, you could have a third trait being a "lesser" trait without a tech.
_________________________
Anyhow, some ideas:

Morocco
Religious is good as is either Commercial or Seafaring.

Niger
Commercial I'd say is a must. Perhaps Expansionist, or Militaristic, or Religious.

Nigeria
Agricultural is a must. Perhaps Expansionist.

Ethiopia
Religious is good. Then perhaps Seafaring or Agricultural.

Madagascar
Seafaring and Agricultural or Religious.

China
I'd go with Scientific and Agricultural.

India
Religious and Agricultural is pretty good.

Bangladesh
Maybe Commercial and Agricultural?

Japan
These guys are quite flexible. Militaristic, Religious, Seafaring in particular.

Vietnam
Maybe Militaristic and Agricultural?

Korea
Seafaring is a must. Scientific, Agricultural, Militaristic all work.

Thailand
Religious and Seafaring maybe? Religious definitely.

Myanmar
Militaristic for sure. Agricultural or Religious are probably the best fits.

Spain
Another flexible one. Expansionist I'd say is important; along with any of Militaristic, Seafaring, Religious or Commercial.

England
Seafaring is a must. Commercial, Industrious or Expansionist will work as trait #2.

Russia
Expansionist and either Militaristic, Agricultural or Industrious.

Germany
Militaristic and either Industrious or Scientific.

France
Agricultural. Either Commercial, Militaristic, Expansionist or Religious fit.

Italy
Commercial, Religious.

Poland
Militaristic for sure. Agricultural, Religious, Expansionist all fit.

Romania
Religious and Agricultural.

Netherlands
Commercial and Seafaring or Industrious and Seafaring.

Saudi Arabia
Religious and Commercial or Religious and Expansionist.

Pakistan
Militaristic and Religious or Militaristic and Commercial.

Turkey
Religious and Expansionist.

Iran
Commercial and Expansionist.

Uzbekistan
Militaristic and Expansionist or Agricultural.

Indonesia
Seafaring and either Religious or Agricultural.

Philippines
Seafaring and either Religious, Militaristic or Agricultural.

Navajo
Commercial, perhaps either Agricultural, Industrious, or Expansionist.

Oceania
Seafaring and Expansionist.

 

[timerover51]

Is there any particular reason that you have Bangladesh when you also have India and Myanmar/Burma?

I would not rate Romania as Religious, more like Agricultural and Commercial.

Ethiopia has the Coptic Church as a major factor in its history, while Agricultural suits the area the best.

India you could go with Religious and Scientific or Industrious.

Thinking of the Black Hole of Calcutta, you could make Bangladesh Militaristic and Agricultural, although that could also be used for Myanmar/Burma.

Your Seafaring countries should include England, the Netherlands, Oceania, Indonesia, the Philippines, and probably Spain and Japan.

 

[Blue Monkey]

India as religious/scientific makes a lot of sense. Scientific/commercial is also a possibility - the Roman Senate actually debated what to do about the gold drained from the Roman economy through trade with India. Seems like this combination is playing out again currently through international banking & investment in research. Pakistan I'd place as religious/militaristic. If you take Bangladesh' traits from the time of the Pala Empire then Industrious/Seafaring might be a good choice.

 

[Gojira54]

Thanks for the input guys! Now I am definitely playing around with the 3 trait concept.

Bangladesh is actually a throw-away country which I may replace. The process here was mostly based on language. I took the most commonly spoken languages, and chose their home country. I already excluded Portugal, as the language is so similar to Spanish, and may do the same as Bengali is close to Hindi. I added Navajo as Americas needed SOME kind of representation, and I have a nice Navajo Translator to help, and Oceania because I just love it, and Maori isn't difficult to translate. The ability to translate is key, all units, as well as some buildings and resources unique to each civ will be in that language, among other things. Hence you don't see much of the New World on this list. I would add Mayan or Incan if I could translate that.

Anyways, what you have posted is great, more input is always welcome!

 

[timerover51]

Thanks for the input guys! Now I am definitely playing around with the 3 trait concept.

Bangladesh is actually a throw-away country which I may replace. The process here was mostly based on language. I took the most commonly spoken languages, and chose their home country. I already excluded Portugal, as the language is so similar to Spanish, and may do the same as Bengali is close to Hindi. I added Navajo as Americas needed SOME kind of representation, and I have a nice Navajo Translator to help, and Oceania because I just love it, and Maori isn't difficult to translate. The ability to translate is key, all units, as well as some buildings and resources unique to each civ will be in that language, among other things. Hence you don't see much of the New World on this list. I would add Mayan or Incan if I could translate that.

Anyways, what you have posted is great, more input is always welcome!

Hmm, based on conversations with people, I am not so sure that Portuguese is that close to Spanish. However, I do have a Malay Phrase book from World War 2 that you could use. My future daughter-in-law, who grew up in Jakarta vouches for its accuracy for Malay. I will have to see what else I have. I do have a Portuguese phrase book as spoken in Brazil on my computer as well. I will check what other ones that I have. I am pretty sure I have a Romanian one, and also one for Hungary, if you want to consider that as a possible civilization.

 

[Gojira54]

After factoring in all the comments, and doing a bit more of my own research, this is what I came up with. Not 100% happy with it, but I wanted all the holes filled. Also the civs I will be using are fantasy civs that are based on these countries, so ballpark accuracy is acceptable.

Still, if any of these are bizarrely wrong, I want to fix it, so please let me know

 

[Blue Monkey]

The South Asian civ traits seem appropriate.

Navajo is a name imposed by the Spanish during the colonial period, Diné is what they call themselves.

 

[timerover51]

I am not sure about making Madagascar a Seafaring Civilization and leaving Spain as not one. While Madagascar is an island, I cannot think of any significant seafaring tradition there. Spain is surrounded on three and a half sides by water, and does have a strong seafaring tradition.

Make Spain Religious and Seafaring and Indonesia Agricultural and Seafaring. I am not sure what to do with Madagascar besides Agricultural.