New Civilization page

[The_J]

It's one of these moments, where i think that Flash is maybe even more the Satan than Steam is .
Not that it's a pain for slow connections, after it finally loaded, my flash plugin collapsed. Nice.

 

[Churchdown Yank]

I think it's kinda wacky and cools. Very Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds

 

[timtofly]

Is this the new Civilpedia?

 

[narmox]

Forget HTML5 vs Flash; what really matters is interoperability, and being viewable by everyone.

I don't have Internet Explorer (at least not until I get Civ5 and install Windows :S ). I use Chrome as my main browser, and Safari as my backup browser.


Thankfully the page worked in Safari... But what if it didn't? What if it only worked in IE, for some odd reason? I wouldn't be able to view the page...

Cutting out people based on their browsers is soooo 90s... Flash or no flash, HTML5 or HTML4, what matters is being able to view it.

HTML5 is a red herring. Most people, when referring to it, just refer to the video portion of it, or a few fancy animations or whatever. HTML as a whole is much more important, heck it's even used as a platform to launch Flash objects lol.

I think the big difference between Flash and HTML (nevermind the iphone/ipad's lack of Flash) is that, when the Flash applet has a bug, it just doesn't show up; when HTML has a bug, the browser shows as much as it can show ("graceful degradation" is a core principle of HTML rendering).

This is probably why so many people hate Flash, myself included. I love what they can do with it, but as soon as there's any issue, you're SOL and are left cursing at the site or the developers or who knows what else.



Regardless... About the page itself.. I wonder why not all the leaders have the animation? Maybe to keep some surprises for the game?

N

 

[silentknight111]

Forget HTML5 vs Flash; what really matters is interoperability, and being viewable by everyone.

I don't have Internet Explorer (at least not until I get Civ5 and install Windows :S ). I use Chrome as my main browser, and Safari as my backup browser.


Thankfully the page worked in Safari... But what if it didn't? What if it only worked in IE, for some odd reason? I wouldn't be able to view the page...

Cutting out people based on their browsers is soooo 90s... Flash or no flash, HTML5 or HTML4, what matters is being able to view it.

HTML5 is a red herring. Most people, when referring to it, just refer to the video portion of it, or a few fancy animations or whatever. HTML as a whole is much more important, heck it's even used as a platform to launch Flash objects lol.

I think the big difference between Flash and HTML (nevermind the iphone/ipad's lack of Flash) is that, when the Flash applet has a bug, it just doesn't show up; when HTML has a bug, the browser shows as much as it can show ("graceful degradation" is a core principle of HTML rendering).

This is probably why so many people hate Flash, myself included. I love what they can do with it, but as soon as there's any issue, you're SOL and are left cursing at the site or the developers or who knows what else.



Regardless... About the page itself.. I wonder why not all the leaders have the animation? Maybe to keep some surprises for the game?

N

If a page is coded properly, then when someone doesn't have flash it takes them to the html version. your point is moot. (I like that word)

Also, flash has a player for almost all platforms, while all browsers interpret html5 differently. Getting a web page to look the same everywhere without using flash is much harder.

 

[narmox]

If a page is coded properly, then when someone doesn't have flash it takes them to the html version. your point is moot. (I like that word)

Yes there's always that "if coded properly" keyword in there That's the whole point...

Also, flash has a player for almost all platforms, while all browsers interpret html5 differently. Getting a web page to look the same everywhere without using flash is much harder.

We just proved in this thread that it's not true -- we can't get the Civilizations page to load up properly in Chrome, even if it's the same flash plugin that we have in other browsers on the same computer!

HTML (3-4-5-6-7-8-etc) MIGHT look different (again, it's a matter of proper coding), but it would at least SHOW.


N.

 

[silentknight111]

Yes there's always that "if coded properly" keyword in there That's the whole point...



We just proved in this thread that it's not true -- we can't get the Civilizations page to load up properly in Chrome, even if it's the same flash plugin that we have in other browsers on the same computer!

HTML (3-4-5-6-7-8-etc) MIGHT look different (again, it's a matter of proper coding), but it would at least SHOW.


N.

I'm vieiwing it in chrome without any issues. Maybe you need to upgrade your flash player?

Anyway - I think the overriding point here is not that flash is better than html5 or that html5 is better than flash, but rather that even after more than a decade of browser wars we still don't have a fool proof way of making everything look the same in every browser.

 

[narmox]

I'm vieiwing it in chrome without any issues. Maybe you need to upgrade your flash player?

Anyway - I think the overriding point here is not that flash is better than html5 or that html5 is better than flash, but rather that even after more than a decade of browser wars we still don't have a fool proof way of making everything look the same in every browser.

Yeah that's kinda what I was going towards, flash vs html5 is just an apple/adobe marketing thing, the real issue like I said is compatibility and interoperability, as well as graceful degradation when something doesn't work properly - better to show SOME or to show it ugly, than show nothing at all.

ie better to show a still picture of Japan's leader instead of the animated Montezuma, than show no picture/animation at all (trying to keep it on topic dammit!)

N

 

[Stuie]

I think it's kinda wacky and cools. Very Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds

That's what I was thinking - Beatles, Yellow Submarine, LSD.

Why is Catherine looking like some sort of Sea Goddess?

 

[narmox]

That's what I was thinking - Beatles, Yellow Submarine, LSD.

Why is Catherine looking like some sort of Sea Goddess?

They must be reading this forum and decided to connect with gamers' fantasies...

 

[Zhahz]

EDIT: I musst agree tho, I don't like flash heavy sites. I would prefer a clear html site than that civ5 flash

Yep, I really dislike flash heavy sites and it's really annoying to get a loading bar for every trivial little click.

 

[andrewlt]

I'm sure Fraxis programmers would have no problem moving to HTML5, however it does not depend on them. Why coding in HTML5 when Firefox 3.5 is not fully compatible and Internet Explorer doesn't recognize HTML5 tags at all?

It has to do with the end users; most users still run older browser, therefore the site needs to be supported on them.

I work as a programmer for a company that does lots of ecommerce sites; some of our clients still request that the sites we build must be IE6 compatible

Text > Flash easily 99.99999% of the time. I hate Flash. It does nothing but bog down computers. It's mostly used for annoying ads. Or graphical stuff that actually make sites less easy to navigate.

Firefox 3.6 with just a few tabs open with Flash easily uses up more memory and processing power than games like World of Warcraft.

 

[chaotoroboto]

Bismarck + Boat reminded me of the Dai-Gurren from Gurren Lagann, and George Washington reminded me of this:

(NSFW) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=foqOtlrPCN4 (NSFW)

 

[sghiminini]

Text > Flash easily 99.99999% of the time. I hate Flash. It does nothing but bog down computers. It's mostly used for annoying ads. Or graphical stuff that actually make sites less easy to navigate.

Firefox 3.6 with just a few tabs open with Flash easily uses up more memory and processing power than games like World of Warcraft.

I'm not really sure why you felt to quote my original message. I never said anything about Flash. I'm not a fan of flash in the first place.

The original message I replied to was saying something in the line "Fraxis is not a competent company because they are using crappy flash and not HTML5...".

All I'm saying is that no developer would use HTML5 as most browser don't support it yet.

 

[Churchdown Yank]

That's what I was thinking - Beatles, Yellow Submarine, LSD.

and in the steam preload there's an mp3 which, if you play it backwards, says "sid is dead". Ahh - those were the days. Trippin'

 

[Jubbly]

It's one of these moments, where i think that Flash is maybe even more the Satan than Steam is .
Not that it's a pain for slow connections, after it finally loaded, my flash plugin collapsed. Nice.

Well the J if you have an awful computer and connection you should probably get used to it. In 2010 it shouldn't be an issue, I am poor as but can afford a decent connection and rig.

 

[Lorteungen]

I'm vieiwing it in chrome without any issues. Maybe you need to upgrade your flash player?

Which version of Chrome are you using? I'm using the same build as the other poster and can't get the page to work either. The rest of the site works just fine. Adobe tells me I have the latest plugin. With IE8 the whole site is just black.

Edit: I just found out that the site works in Chrome in incognito mode. Weird.

 

[andrewlt]

Well the J if you have an awful computer and connection you should probably get used to it. In 2010 it shouldn't be an issue, I am poor as but can afford a decent connection and rig.

It's not an issue of having an awful computer. It's an issue about why websites would use more system resources than modern games. And mostly for crappy, annoying advertising.

 

[Alsark]

Regardless... About the page itself.. I wonder why not all the leaders have the animation? Maybe to keep some surprises for the game?

N

When they first brought the page up all of the leaders were animated... for about a day. Then, for whatever reason, they took out about half of the animations. Somebody found a URL that linked to the missing animations and managed to save the video animations and upload them to YouTube (including the ones that still work on the site). The YouTube videos were taken down (but only the ones that weren't animated), and the URL linking to those animations was removed.

 

[timtofly]

Bismarck + Boat reminded me of the Dai-Gurren from Gurren Lagann

It just reminded me of the song: Sink the Bismarck.