Nobles' Club LXXXIII: Peter the Great of Russia

[ecuwins]

Emp/normal/no huts

875BC

Spoiler :

So I end up Oracling CoL and spread the religion to Cyrus. I'm trying to starve out a scientist but end up with a stupid prophit. No biggie, I shrine him and get a scientist the next time.

Late Pottery, yeah, yeah, I know. Bad!

540AD

Spoiler :

I stay at these nine cities until one of Cyrus's flips late in the game. The marble and copper, along with the religious type opening, convinced me to go for culture. Rostov becomes my NEpic city and is planned to be a legendary city. Moscow and St. Petes the other two.

Unfortunately, Music comes too late. I miss the free GArtist. A GScientist pops that same turn so I use him for the GA instead. I still got Sistine, though. Phew.

1874AD culture

Spoiler :

Libbed Nationalism but missed Taj by several turns Oh well. Built Hermatage in the NEpic city. I went for Constitution, Mil Trad, and Econ before shutting the slider down. Then I chugged along to Biology via scientists.

 

[Archon_Wing]

Prince/Normal/No huts
1842 AP herp derp

Spoiler :

Gross map. The way it's placed, you're semi-isolated with Cyrus and he has most of the continent behind him. Wut?

Settled, 1 SW, after finding nothing north
The horses were there, but a bit far to hook up so opted for a horse archer rush indeed. Was kinda late by 400 bc, and the land was meh and took forever. He had 2 cities on hills but didn't bother with spears. My tech is now really crap, and the rest of the game has me pretty poor until I can use some good cottage land.

Wonders were coming in really late, and I got Confucianism, meaning people must be really slow.

AP was not built for the longest time, so I took a late shot at it.

Eventually I meet Pericles and Zara who trade nicely. Free circumnavigation bonus.

Unfortunately, Pericles friggin peacevassaled to Zara. (Pericles is such an awful AI) and suddenly my tech lead started evaporating. I was always around 2 techs ahead, but Greeks managed rifling before I did. Well, I didn't really prioritize that since I was own my own continent. Meanwhile, I meet Qin and form good relations with him. The last 2, Isabella and Monte were duking it out, so I figure I might as well go for an AP victory since Zara's big; I did bribe Pericles into free religion... and he breaks off! Hmm...

Not willing to bother with an invasion, I sent missionaries in galleons to everyone. Sadly, 3 of them had theocracy, but missionary gifting deals with that. And after a long journey with galleons, I just finish off the game.

Also I never got a prophet to shrine. FML.

@ dalamb

Spoiler :

Hmm, it seems like that axe attack was rather slow, usually I'd imagine them like 1200 bc or before. Well, it was fine to extort for techs, but it seems like you barely had enough forces to finish him off. That is a sign you need to chop and whip more.

The looters thing is a random event, btw.

I'm also not sure about taking steel from lib; as I don't think you're going to be able to war with cannons anytime soon, not until you build an invasion fleet. I think libbing constitution would yield more immediate benefits. Or lib Astro (do you have that yet?)

Also, slightly north of Smolensk is another potential city (seafood)

 

[dalamb]

@Archon_Wing:

Spoiler :

Thanks for the comments. I think Steel was in part a reflex from other games where I had been more warlike; it was late at night when I made that decision! It's not a complete waste at this point, though, since with Astronomy coming up reasonably soon my drydocks should be ready in time to build some nice privateers (7 XP in St. Petersburg, 5 on the west coast).

 

[Archon_Wing]

@dalamb

Spoiler :

Hmm, not the biggest fan of privateers, but I'd send them at your most backwards foe furthest away from chemistry. Montezuma's typically a safe bet.

 

[cas]

Just wanted to say I played this one and enjoyed it quite a bit. Monarch, one city space. Barely eeked out a victory in 1962.

Spoiler :

I had to pull out the bag of diplo tricks to keep Greece from a culture victory before I launched. Kept delaying Pericles by bribing him to switch civics. Once perm alliances came up, Persia/Greece hooked up and China was vassal to Ethiopia. So I was able to bribe Zara to war with Cyrus...which meant Pericles was his land target. Zara took Greece's 3rd potential legendary city and then it was easy coasting.

Silly Monty declared on me with ~20 turns left. Had to divert my space parts for a modern armor to wipe his pitiful 3 unit landing force off the map.

The game was interesting with 3 continents. Monty/Isa were destined to war. The China/Greece/Ethiopia continent was all Christian religion, so that pushed the tech pace a bit mid-game. I converted Cyrus to Confu as soon as possible and we were best buddies from that point on.

Thanks for hosting.

cas

 

[IdiotsOpposite]

Is it too late for a lower-difficulty player to join up this one?

 

[Archon_Wing]

It is never too late. You can play whenever you want.

 

[guspasho]

I just downloaded the scenario to play but why are there different files for different difficulties? I can start a noble game and still select monarch from that. What's up?

I started a game on Noble, no huts/events. 2925BC update:

Spoiler :

I settled 1SW, researched Agriculture > AH > BW. I built Worker > Warrior > Settler. My scout met Cyrus and discovered a ton of empty land. Horses to the west and copper to the east. It looks like I share a large continent with only Cyrus. I also notice very few happy resources for all this land, so I'm going to have a happiness problem and consequently, it is going to be difficult to expand and maintain my economy.

My warrior discovered a convenient opportunity for a worker steal. I'll take it. In the past, on Noble and against non-creative leaders I've managed to steal three workers by just camping a warrior outside their borders. Let's see how long I can keep Cyrus pinned.

Anyone know what Cyrus' personality is like? I'm going to want to prevent him from being able to build Immortals.

I'm thinking of building my second city to the west, on the desert on the coast and next to the corn, where I can get the horses and sheep if I build a monument. What should my tech path be? Mysticism > Wheel > Pottery?

Where should I build after that? Next to the copper? The copper presents an interesting dilemma. I can get the copper and pigs and either the corn or the marble. I'm leaning toward the marble because it would be nice to have the Parthenon, being Philosophical. But that means I can't settle on the coast, and one tile away. What to do? Then there are lots of filler cities to consider. I'll have to try out a dotmap.

 

[ecuwins]

I just downloaded the scenario to play but why are there different files for different difficulties? I can start a noble game and still select monarch from that. What's up?

The file determines what techs and units the AI start with. Selecting a difficulty from the the scenario menu changes the % bonus stuff.

Source

 

[guspasho]

I'm looking for some feedback, see my previous post.

Spoiler :

Spoiler :

I am thinking of building in the locations on the map: Orange > Yellow > Green > Blue. My reasoning is: capture the strategic resources first, then put pressure on Cyrus and take the luxuries from him. I'll fill in the rest later. That third city should be a productive powerhouse if it can handle the population to work several mines without rioting, and the fourth city will capture the gems and have a chance at taking Cyrus' Ivory if I can keep him pinned. And if I can play a cultural game I can keep Cyrus choked with my culture.

Some flaws I already see in this: I will have to crowd my cities to squeeze in a city that can work the spices, and Cyrus' capital culture may grow and take the blue city location before I have a chance to build a settler there.

Speaking of culture. With so few luxuries, it may be prudent to found a few religions, or several, and spread them. What do you think?

Edited to add: doing the math, unless Cyrus builds a monument or library, I have 31-32 turns to build the Blue city. So it will have to be either my first or second. I'm almost done with my first settler so the second may be doable. If I can successfully keep Cyrus pinned by stealing his worker this could work, but the city maintenence will suck. Orange > Blue > Yellow > Green. What do you think?

 

[guspasho]

I guess I'm the only one around. Here's a 130AD update.

Spoiler :

Spoiler :

You can see from the attachments that I achieved my early goals easily. Keeping Cyrus pinned is remarkably easy and no one else is on my continent. However, not having a trading partner is probably hurting me and if I'm going to keep Cyrus pinned, why not just finish him off? I don't know if I should have let up sooner but I wanted to REX enough to get all the available resources. So I expect that once I capture the resources to the east and west of Persepolis, I'll make peace with Cyrus and let him expand to the south. The land down there isn't that good anyway.

My tech tree shows all the techs I've researched except Code of Laws and Theology. I got CoL via an Oracle slingshot and Theology from a prophet. I've managed to pretty much solve my happiness problem for the time being. I founded two religions with those techs and between religion spread, temples, gems, and a randomly-generated gold mine, I have enough happiness to support ten pop at least.

Right now I'm still working on REXing and teching. I'm not targeting Optics yet, and right now I'm trying to decide what to research next. I just finish Aesthetics so I can build the Parthenon, and I need to get some techs that will help me rebuild my economy. I also need workshops and plantations. Great Library would be nice but I won't research Literature right away so I can get those and Optics first. After that I'll want Philosophy for Pacifism, Civil Service for Bureaucracy, and then a beeline to Liberalism.

 

[GGracchus]

@Gushapo

Spoiler :

Very nice choking of Persia, I would probably just keep on choking him until you decide to kill him off. You seem to be in a very nice shape, after literature you can either go music for the GA or currency for trade routes. Either way, I would probably grab those two, then go for optics, then liberalism, maybe with civil service somewhere in there. I would also shift your second city on the peninsula west of persia 1N, onto the plains hill, so as to grab the spices, you don't need to share the gems with the other city.If you can, grab all the territory, but if you want to tech up you can make peace, and let persia settle it for you(then conquer him later)

 

[AbsoluteZero]

I tried this twice on deity.

First attempt HA rush cyrus. I hit some really bad attack rolls and lost my entire stack of HA at the first city ><. Still managed to take 8 cities off him or so when I finally went broke because of no commerce and no happiness resources. HA rush is possible but hard.

Second attempt I did a 200 AD ( or so ) Engineering rush. Took a few cities easily but then I went broke again because no currency ( had to skip it to save time ) and whip anger could not be dealt with ( no monarchy and no happy resources ).

Both times Cyrus was totally useless as a trading partner, I had to self-tech everything.

HA rush is definitely doable if you're luckier then I was, problem is what do you do about the other huge continents which are bound to run away before you can reach them.

 

[Dirk1302]

^I haven't played out my game further. If you can take out Cyrus before 1000 AD without going on strike i'm sure you can deal with the other continents, there'll be enough time to catch up with a whole continent. Maybe an early rush is indeed best, my game position isn't that promising either.Ha rush looks more promising than engineer here to me. Cyrus teched that rather early iirc.

 

[WelshGandalf]

Spolier @ 250AD
Monarch/huts

Spoiler :

Haven't had a philosophical leader in a while in GOTM's so I decided to go specialist-crazy. The abundance of food in our land also led me to this decision.

I chopped out the pyramids (725BC) in the capital and built the oracle -> CoL (925BC) in my 2nd city. After these were done I revolted into caste/rep around 1000BC.
By 250AD I had also built the following wonders, all specialist-related...
-Parthenon (150AD)
-Temple of Artemis (100AD)
-Great Library in capital (325BC with a great engineer)
-National Epic in capital (225AD)

I've had one great engineer (used for Great Library), and 4 great scientists so far (1 academy in capital, 1 bulbed philosophy, 2 sitting around). About to finish civil service so then I can bulb paper & education.

I only have 5 cities... wonder-whoring slowed my expansion. One of them is a rubbish city on the border, however it became the tao holy city so all that culture means its about to grab some gems from the Persians, which is nice due to the lack of happy resource (pyramids have been very useful for that). Going to get 1 more city soon to get crab & deer on the north coast and that will be it I reckon, depending on where iron is (when I finally get around to researching iron working).

Economy stats....
science slider @ 0% (has been for ages), +12 gold a turn, 191 gold in bank, 116 beakers a turn (go specialists!).
Capital has 5 science specialists, plus the great library and an academy resulting in 73.5 beakers a turn and 91 GPP a turn ... it only just spat out a great scientist last turn and the next one will be along in only 6 turns...

Looking at bulbing miltrad I think, and then going on a military spree. Persia has 7 cities and lots of space to expand to, but it behind in tech. He would like aesthetics, alphabet and currency from me, and has horse riding, iron working and construction to give to me (not that he's willing to trade them).

 

[popalopa]

Coming back to Civ IV after a break.... I really want to play but I kinda forgot how to do things the right way .... .

I settle in place and go for AH to get the big... Because there is a lot of forests then I will go for BW.
First build : Worker...

And then I don't know >.<

Spoiler :

I saw the corn and went AH-> Agriculture-> BW&#8230;
After the worker build 2 warriors to explore/fogbust for my future cities.

I don't really know how to dot map, my city placements are not really good&#8230; I went for the wheel (cause the pig wasn't connected) and pottery to start cottage the capital.

I want to start settling south to block Cyrus...

 

[dalamb]

@popalopa: You could take a look at some dotmaps people made for their own games (done via the BUG mod, alt-X). Mine was from 2650 BC, maybe not too far ahead of where you are -- but read VoiceOfUnreason's comment immediately thereafter, since I made a few strategic errors that he commented on.

 

[WelshGandalf]

@popalopa: You could take a look at some dotmaps people made for their own games (done via the BUG mod, alt-X). Mine was from 2650 BC, maybe not too far ahead of where you are -- but read VoiceOfUnreason's comment immediately thereafter, since I made a few strategic errors that he commented on.

My comments on that dotmap

Spoiler :

I think the green city is fine. I settled that. With the copper in the inner ring, you can get a monument out in no time to pop the border.

As for the cyan one, I put it 2E of the horses. The city is a beast, with 2 food resource, horses, and quite a few hills for production. Sure you miss out on the corn, but you don't really need it, can always squeeze a city up there in the future, maybe 1S of it to make use of the desert tile.

I was so busy building wonders that Persia took the purple city & another one further north of it

I also put a city 1E of the sheep to the east of the capital. Inner-ring food gets it started early, and it would eventually claim the deer and marble (the marble being the main reason I settled it). It worked OK but it meant I couldn't work the fish off to the east... but then the only 2 spots that reached the fish didn't look appealing at all.

Finally, 2N of the sheep isn't bad for an ice-city. Freshwater lake, hill forest deer & crabs will keep it going.

 

[WelshGandalf]

An update @ 1300AD

Spoiler :

I got great people coming out of my ears! I think I've had 12.

Scientists have bulbed philo, paper, edu x 2, pp
I've settled 2 gs, 1 ga
used 1 ga for a ga
gp creating jewish shrine (about 12 gpt I think)
1 ga and 1 gs left over at the moment

Anyhow, all this bulbing led to me getting MilTrad from liberalism in 1000AD, which is a new record for me This was also done with very little trading (maybe 2 techs). I had to get gunpowder then too before being able to build Curiasers (I cna't spell that word ). Got 10-12 or so together and am now attacking the Persians. As of 1300 AD I've taken 3 cities - I probably could speed up a bit though. I have 9 cities to his 12 now, he keeps settling the southern lands whilst I capture his older cities, sounds good to me He'll get pikemen soon, which will be a bit annoying but OK.

I'm teching banking at the moment, so I can revolt into mercantelism in my next golden age (Taj is almost complete). Then I'll finish printing press, get replaceable parts and rifling, then I can have cavalry & an upgraded economy. two of the cities I've taken have hamlets/villages/cottages all around them so I'll make good use of them.

Once the Persians are gone, I planning on teching to space, I wonder how fast I can manage it? Also, just how many great people can I spew out? :crazyeyes:

 

[popalopa]

@popalopa: You could take a look at some dotmaps people made for their own games (done via the BUG mod, alt-X). Mine was from 2650 BC, maybe not too far ahead of where you are -- but read VoiceOfUnreason's comment immediately thereafter, since I made a few strategic errors that he commented on.

Ok.. Thanks, I'll start from that.