Obsolete Features in Multiplayer Diplomacy

[ssmith619]

I was just thinking about diplomacy in multiplayer, and realized that a lot of features will be obsolete. For example, trade embargoes! It would work so much better if you just talked to each other via built-in chat (which it hopefully will have) and that way you could agree to it but the other person wouldn't need to know. Also, don't you think most players would opt for a silent MPP so that people wouldn't know that the person is very well protected. It just seems like when human interaction is involved most of these dipolmatic features will be lost. What do all of you people think?

 

[Cunobelin Of Hippo]

But 'advertising' an MPP, by officially signing it, could serve as a better deterent than a silent one should one wish to avoid conflict.

I guess there's a niche for both. Same with embargoes - a publicly declared one might please an ally more than a backroom handshake because it could encourage others to follow suit.

 

[ssmith619]

Yeah, I realize all of those things might not change as much, but what do you think will change?

 

[Bill_in_PDX]

Further, without the actual trade embargo in place, how would you know if the ally was holding true to their word.

With enough civ's he could always say, oh no, I didn't trade that rubber to him, I traded it to Cleo...etc..., and you have no way to verify it.

 

[GI Josh]

if the game has mixed human/ai players, breaking the public treaties will have reputation consequences.

 

[KaNick]

Further, without the actual trade embargo in place, how would you know if the ally was holding true to their word.

You can always go to the foriegn advisor screen and click on the trade button. The tan line means that a trade is possible and a blue one means that a trade is in place.

Embargoes could also be good for cutting deals short instead of waiting for the end of the 20 turns.

 

[Yzman]

I like the official one better. If they aren't going to cheat you, then why should they care if they sign a real embargo?

 

[MSGT John Drew]

Stealthy trade embargoes? What?!

First of all if you are persistent you will soon find out what civs have trade embargoes against you. Just offer each of them something each turn and if a trade doesn't go off then think "trade embargo". Duh!

This "stealthy trade embargo" idea is a real slippery slope. If this is in the game then another tedious, repetitive, and boring aspect of the game comes into play. (Check each civ each turn for TEs). We already have the "check each turn for tradeable workers from each civ" tedium. Let's not add another.

And in the real world what nation currently can do a stealthy trade embargo of all goods right now? None! Nearly each country is in some kind of trade agreement with every other country on the planet.

Better yet fix the "Trade Embargo" option to be more specific. Something like - "Don't sell Iron to America!" or "Don't buy those mad cows from England!". Now that's more realistic.

 

[slothman]

The wierd part about hidden MPP's is that that is part of the reason for WW1. If the various countries knew the MPP's between them it might not have happened.

 

[Athelstane]

They knew what probably would happen. But as Austria-Hungary got full support of Germany, they HOPED that Britain would back down. Austria-Hungary and Germany both knew that if Austria-Hungary declared war on Serbia, Russia would declare war on them. And when Russia declared war, France would follow. The only uncertain thing was Britain. But Germany expected Britain to declre war.

The thing about the events in 1914, was the strong MPPs. Noone somehow couldn`t back down, afraid of losing face, and they KNEW they steared their countries to catastrophe.

Is there in real life something like a secret MPP? I don`t think so. Two reasons:
1. The point of a MPP is to let everybody know, if you attack us, we`re not alone. You WILL get a hard fight.
2. In real life, friends and foes are obvious through relations. You can`t keep them secret. And the MPPs often rest on a very long history. An example: In the Napoleonic wars, Denmark/Norway sided with Napoleon ONLY because Sweden sided with England.

I think the MPPs work great. If it shall work, it has to be broadcasted. A secret MPP is an ambush!