Oh I understand the rivalry part of it all, especially the whole rivraly between air force pilots and navy pilots. Those jokes are always the best I think. But there are better fighting forces then the Marines. Navy Seals, Green Berats and other special forces units.
Other branches of the military vs. Marines
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MarineCorps
Explosion!
The Marine Corps are also the nations so called 911 force as they are faster to respond to the call for arms.
I'll have more once I get a PDF reader on this computer.
I'll have more once I get a PDF reader on this computer.
MarineCorps
Explosion!
Esckey said:
A. Proof?
B. Special Forces units work in small teams, so they really aren't a fighting force.
privatehudson
The Ultimate Badass
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downwithgravity said:no matter what you think about the Marines, the Gunny will always be the man
Give me Apone any day
Hygro
soundcloud.com/hygro/
But special forces, like the SEALs, have trained redicously harder and better than marines. If we trained a force a fifth the size of the marines as SEALs (somehow magically), and somehow gave the full size of the marines the humans who would have succeeded as SEALs but never tried (and thus got trained only as marines), the SEALs would still probably win.MarineCorps said:
Our marines are amazing, but our special forces are far more impressive.
I don't really know why other branches would resent the marines, though, because the marines tend to be put in harm's way and die a lot more often. I couldn't really resent that.
PantheraTigris2
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And how many SEAL divisions are there?
Regements? Battalions?
I've seen Navy SEALs. Not quite what you see in the movies. Long hair, overweight. Look like slobs. Uniforms looked like crap. Granted, I'm sure they were proficient at their job, and when it came to clandestine/ special ops, but the average Marine grunt, next to one of those guys is far more impressive... phyical stature, intense '1,000 yard stare', intimidating presence, military bearing, etc.
But that personal experience aside, the reason the 'other branches' resent the Marines, is because of how we (they) have constantly barked our superiority at them (and backed it up in times of war thoughout history). The Army especially, has been embarassed on several occasions. Things they'd like to forget.
Plus, (especially for the Navy) - they're just plain scared of us. For good reason, too. At NAS Pensacola, I had room mates in the barracks that made trophies out of sailor hats (which they 'altered' heavily with Marine emblems, graffiti, etc.) that had been taken from sailors whom's arse's had been severely beaten.
Heck, we even had a guy shoot a sailor w/ a BB gun - right in the arse - from his barracks window. Marines are psycho killers from the sea... complete trained killers. Makes the softies get a little nervous/ intimidated sometimes.
Plus, they even get scared when we ran through their barracks in formation, calling cadences like "Kill the people! Burn their town! You'll feel better if you do!" and other with lines like "...cause Naaaaaa-palm... sticks to kids, yeah...!" -Made them even more certain of our passionate insane killer instinct.
"If the Army and the Navy ever look on Heaven's scenes,
They will find the streets are guarded, by United States Marines."
No, seriously, the Marines are just psychologically in a class of their own, compared to the other branches. There's the civilian mentality. Then there's the Coast Guard & Air Force, Air Guard (not much different really), And on the other extreme, the Marines just take it further than anyone else.
Probably, the squid-boy that said he's 'gonna go drop a Marine'... got severly beaten/ humiliated by Marines at some point, and is still painfully bitter about it. Probably was talking trash at the time - and that lead to the whole ordeal!
Regements? Battalions?
I've seen Navy SEALs. Not quite what you see in the movies. Long hair, overweight. Look like slobs. Uniforms looked like crap. Granted, I'm sure they were proficient at their job, and when it came to clandestine/ special ops, but the average Marine grunt, next to one of those guys is far more impressive... phyical stature, intense '1,000 yard stare', intimidating presence, military bearing, etc.
But that personal experience aside, the reason the 'other branches' resent the Marines, is because of how we (they) have constantly barked our superiority at them (and backed it up in times of war thoughout history). The Army especially, has been embarassed on several occasions. Things they'd like to forget.
Plus, (especially for the Navy) - they're just plain scared of us. For good reason, too. At NAS Pensacola, I had room mates in the barracks that made trophies out of sailor hats (which they 'altered' heavily with Marine emblems, graffiti, etc.) that had been taken from sailors whom's arse's had been severely beaten.
Heck, we even had a guy shoot a sailor w/ a BB gun - right in the arse - from his barracks window. Marines are psycho killers from the sea... complete trained killers. Makes the softies get a little nervous/ intimidated sometimes.
Plus, they even get scared when we ran through their barracks in formation, calling cadences like "Kill the people! Burn their town! You'll feel better if you do!" and other with lines like "...cause Naaaaaa-palm... sticks to kids, yeah...!" -Made them even more certain of our passionate insane killer instinct.
"If the Army and the Navy ever look on Heaven's scenes,
They will find the streets are guarded, by United States Marines."
No, seriously, the Marines are just psychologically in a class of their own, compared to the other branches. There's the civilian mentality. Then there's the Coast Guard & Air Force, Air Guard (not much different really), And on the other extreme, the Marines just take it further than anyone else.
Probably, the squid-boy that said he's 'gonna go drop a Marine'... got severly beaten/ humiliated by Marines at some point, and is still painfully bitter about it. Probably was talking trash at the time - and that lead to the whole ordeal!
Hygro
soundcloud.com/hygro/
The number of SEALs is not open to the public. As for what they look like, I have two comments: 1) they don't waste their time trying to look like marines, (and since they are so specialized thats ok. I'm glad large divisions like the marines pay attention to looks) and 2) to have a fat SEAL either he must have been one of those old warrant officer types or something, doing all paperwork, or something must have happened to the SEALs in the last few years...PantheraTigris2 said:And how many SEAL divisions are there?
Regements? Battalions?
I've seen Navy SEALs. Not quite what you see in the movies. Long hair, overweight. Look like slobs. Uniforms looked like crap. Granted, I'm sure they were proficient at their job, and when it came to clandestine/ special ops, but the average Marine grunt, next to one of those guys is far more impressive... phyical stature, intense '1,000 yard stare', intimidating presence, military bearing, etc.
Desmond Hawkins
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The reason they have hostility towards the marines is that the marines occupy many of the same niches as all of them. This means they are competition. Much more competition for the Army than, say, the Navy.
PantheraTigris2
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Hygro said:
What are you talking about? You have been comparing a (small, elite) special forces unit designed for specific SPECOPS purposes, made up of members from different branches of service (yes, surprise not all SEALs are really 'Navy', just like not all Army Rangers are really 'Army'), and comparing it to an entire branch of service, the Marine Corps - which even has it's own Air Wings.
Ok - scenario time.... let's say... all the F/A-18's from (just from) my former MCAS, (est. about 144, on avg 12 planes per squadron (12 squadrons))... vs. your SEALS teams. Bombs away. Boom.... they're all dead. Game over.
See. no comparison!
Sure, those SEALs are sneaky, and and get launched from submarines, etc... but we're talking SHEER FIREPOWER here... tanks, planes, boats, land divisions, etc.
Over two hundred thousand Marines... vs how many SEALs? couple of platoons, maybe? 100-150 tops on active duty?
I'd say Marine Force Recon will give them a run for their money on certain exercises anyway.
PantheraTigris2
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Sobieski II said:
Competitions where, for example, the Marine F-18 pilots win out over the Air Force's F-16 pilots in joint tactical training exercises... inexplicably - yet routinely.
Even the USAF guys I've worked with admit they can't explain 'why' it's commonly the case. Well, when you talk to (on the radio every day), and meet, and occasionally get to know - pilots from the different services, the reason is quite evident. The Marine pilots are like machines. They are the epitome of what a cold, calculating, professional, blood-thirsty pilot is.I'm telling you - the foundation of it all is the USMC's mental approach. They just take the whole 'military' concept more seriously, and insist on nothing but the best - and understand that training the mind to function in a more militaristic way will achieve in the desired results. They've always known this... that's why the Germans in WWI called them 'shock troops', 'devildogs', and 'masters of chaos'.
GenMarshall
High Elven ISB Capt & Ghost Agent
Im supprised that this thread does not mention anyting regarding the Air Force and the US Coast Guard. They are both branches of the military (with the Coast Guard in the Dept. of Homeland Security)
Yuri2356
Test Screening
After reading all this, I'm wondering if it was a Marine Pilot who killed those 4 Canadians in a Friendly Fire incident in Afghanistan...Thing is, if you over-militarize any of your forces you will eventually reach a point where your soilders cease to use reason and just whip into a killing frenzy without warning. Your Doberman shock-troops might need to be but down if they go and napalm the neighbors cat...
Elgalad
Bully!
Much emphasis is often placed on the training Marines go through and it Is rigorous. That is only one aspect of what makes up the spirit of a Marine, but it is the easiest to define...
Look at the recruiting posters and you'll get a little more of the picture. When the Army's slogan was "Be All that you can Be", the Navy's was "It's not just a Job, it's an Adventure", and the Air Force's was "Aim High"; The Marines was "The Few. The Proud. The Marines." Straight up you get this picture: The Army is there to help you grow, learn, become something better. The Navy is there to provide an excellent adventure. The Air Force will help you to achieve lofty goals. And the Marines say, "We dont take everyone because we are very selective. You aren't coming here to Get something, you are coming here to Give something. And it will be worth it."
During boot camp and OCS, you are treated to an incredible culture shock. Your drill instructors will show you on the first day the most effective way to commit suicide and ask that you do so in the shower so that your fellow recruits will have an easier time cleaning up the mess. They berate you and encourage you to quit. They repeat constantly how easy it would be to do so, how all the pain and suffering would end. Those you care about and who care about you are far away. Noone here cares about you, because you are not worth such regard, yet. You lose all identity other than a nickname you are given by your new tormentors. Until the end of basic training, your opinion means nothing. Noone cares what you think. Noone cares who you are. All that matters is that you learn some very basic things.
1) When you are told to do something, you do it Now.
2) Why is no longer in your vocabulary. Only What, When, Where, and How.
3) If you fail to comply, you will cause others to suffer.
4) Life is not fair. Justice is not universal. Pain is the price of success.
5) Duty is a reward, not a goal. Courage is self sacrifice. Honor comes from Fidelity. Glory is never found in one's self, but only in the success of your brothers.
6) You are a weapon. That weapon exists for one purpose only - to preserve a dream of freedom. You will destroy anything that opposes that dream with extreme prejudice and no apologies.
7) The human body is very fragile and easy to break if you know how. Military hardware is not as fragile but no less susceptible to the right methods. Death and destruction are never the goal; They are only the means to victory. The true victory is Peace.
One day finally comes after months of physical and mental abuse and hardship. Your tormentors walk up to you and tell you that you have been judged worthy. They will shake your hand or salute you as appropriate, but in either case, you feel a seachange in your heart. No longer are you one of the masses of civilians. You are now and forever a member of a small elite corps whose lineage stretches far back beyond centuries, beyond even the millenia. Many other names have been given to one such as you..
Spartan
Praetorian
Samurai
Paladin
Musketeer
Janissary
Gurkha
Today you have earned the right to join their proud ranks because today, you Are a Marine.
-Elgalad
Look at the recruiting posters and you'll get a little more of the picture. When the Army's slogan was "Be All that you can Be", the Navy's was "It's not just a Job, it's an Adventure", and the Air Force's was "Aim High"; The Marines was "The Few. The Proud. The Marines." Straight up you get this picture: The Army is there to help you grow, learn, become something better. The Navy is there to provide an excellent adventure. The Air Force will help you to achieve lofty goals. And the Marines say, "We dont take everyone because we are very selective. You aren't coming here to Get something, you are coming here to Give something. And it will be worth it."
During boot camp and OCS, you are treated to an incredible culture shock. Your drill instructors will show you on the first day the most effective way to commit suicide and ask that you do so in the shower so that your fellow recruits will have an easier time cleaning up the mess. They berate you and encourage you to quit. They repeat constantly how easy it would be to do so, how all the pain and suffering would end. Those you care about and who care about you are far away. Noone here cares about you, because you are not worth such regard, yet. You lose all identity other than a nickname you are given by your new tormentors. Until the end of basic training, your opinion means nothing. Noone cares what you think. Noone cares who you are. All that matters is that you learn some very basic things.
1) When you are told to do something, you do it Now.
2) Why is no longer in your vocabulary. Only What, When, Where, and How.
3) If you fail to comply, you will cause others to suffer.
4) Life is not fair. Justice is not universal. Pain is the price of success.
5) Duty is a reward, not a goal. Courage is self sacrifice. Honor comes from Fidelity. Glory is never found in one's self, but only in the success of your brothers.
6) You are a weapon. That weapon exists for one purpose only - to preserve a dream of freedom. You will destroy anything that opposes that dream with extreme prejudice and no apologies.
7) The human body is very fragile and easy to break if you know how. Military hardware is not as fragile but no less susceptible to the right methods. Death and destruction are never the goal; They are only the means to victory. The true victory is Peace.
One day finally comes after months of physical and mental abuse and hardship. Your tormentors walk up to you and tell you that you have been judged worthy. They will shake your hand or salute you as appropriate, but in either case, you feel a seachange in your heart. No longer are you one of the masses of civilians. You are now and forever a member of a small elite corps whose lineage stretches far back beyond centuries, beyond even the millenia. Many other names have been given to one such as you..
Spartan
Praetorian
Samurai
Paladin
Musketeer
Janissary
Gurkha
Today you have earned the right to join their proud ranks because today, you Are a Marine.
-Elgalad
Hygro
soundcloud.com/hygro/
Oh I totally agree with you, I just originally was aurguing with MarineCorps who was saying that S.F. didn't have anything over Marines.PantheraTigris2 said:What are you talking about? You have been comparing a (small, elite) special forces unit designed for specific SPECOPS purposes, made up of members from different branches of service (yes, surprise not all SEALs are really 'Navy', just like not all Army Rangers are really 'Army'), and comparing it to an entire branch of service, the Marine Corps - which even has it's own Air Wings.
Ok - scenario time.... let's say... all the F/A-18's from (just from) my former MCAS, (est. about 144, on avg 12 planes per squadron (12 squadrons))... vs. your SEALS teams. Bombs away. Boom.... they're all dead. Game over.
See. no comparison!
Sure, those SEALs are sneaky, and and get launched from submarines, etc... but we're talking SHEER FIREPOWER here... tanks, planes, boats, land divisions, etc.
Over two hundred thousand Marines... vs how many SEALs? couple of platoons, maybe? 100-150 tops on active duty?
I'd say Marine Force Recon will give them a run for their money on certain exercises anyway.
But there aren't 200,000 marines! If we had that many, Iraq would be a cakewalk compared to what it is (bringing in reservists and guard to do 120,000 totaly troops?)
Desmond Hawkins
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PantheraTigris2 said:Competitions where, for example, the Marine F-18 pilots win out over the Air Force's F-16 pilots in joint tactical training exercises... inexplicably - yet routinely.
I'm telling you - the foundation of it all is the USMC's mental approach. They just take the whole 'military' concept more seriously, and insist on nothing but the best - and understand that training the mind to function in a more militaristic way will achieve in the desired results. They've always known this... that's why the Germans in WWI called them 'shock troops', 'devildogs', and 'masters of chaos'.
Yah, I think the Marines have a better philosophy when it comes to training a marine rifleman before anything else.
PantheraTigris2
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Hygro said:
Hmmm, when I served (during the twilight of the Clinton years), the USMC was at it's lowest manpower in quite some time - at around 176,000 on active duty (this does not count the 1/4(+) of the Marine Corps that is reserve). There were over 200k Marines back then, counting the reserves. And today, you can be assured the number is at least slightly higher... so I'd venture to say the number on active duty is somewhere around at least close to that... all things considered at this present time (activated units, etc).
Hygro, time for your daily dose of Marine Corps motivation. Stand at attention, and scream this at the top of your lungs...
READY TO FIGHT, READY TO KILL!
READY TO DIE, BUT NEVER WILL!!
MARINES MAKE THE BLOOD FLOW!!
BLOOD MAKES THE GRASS GROW!!
ONE SHOT, ONE KILL!!
SEMPER FI, DO OR DIE!!
KILL!! KILL!! KILL!!
OOH-RAH!!!
There, now don't you feel 'that good ol' Marine Corps spirit'?
And Elgalad, remember "Pain is {NOT} the price of success"... 'pain is merely weakness leaving the body'.
...as they say in Marines. Now if you will excuse me, remembering all this has got me motivated enough that I feel like practicing some drill maneuvers out in the parking lot. I'll call my own cadence.
j/k
joacqin
Prince
So having your mind and sense of self worth wrecked and then rebuilt as an unthinking machine is something to be proud of?
Hygro
soundcloud.com/hygro/
You know I was thinking that if I were healthy and the draft was going to snatch me (in the event it came back), I might join the marines just to do it right, but after reading that piece of evil I think I'll stick with the army, thanks. Killing's bad enough, but killing and convincing yourself its good is just plain wicked! And not wicked in the "wiickkked!!" sense, but its orriginal meaning.
bobgote
Trousers
i'd like to see how US marines would go against a small, elite force like the SAS or someone like that. can that be arranged, do you think? 
Or even any kind of decent opposition.
Or even any kind of decent opposition.
Yuri2356
Test Screening
Elgalad said:
I agree with everything on this list except for Paladin. I belive the palindins were more of a blessed officer corps that elite troops, as most of them were commanders. I'd say Chavalier or Teutonic Knights deserved that slot more.
