Porting Civilization 3 to Mac OS X, the Linux way

[KingTux]

It may not be as grim for the mac users as you may think. If you're using Mac OS X, you've got to realize that it's UNIX based. Linux has UNIX origions. Linux can emulate programs written with DirectX code under the GNOME environment. As GNOME is UNIX based, I see no reason why you couldn't emulate Civ3 without a version written for the mac. Preferably, this is how I'd do it, but because this is my dad's computer, he wouldn't take to kindly to me revamping his computer with Linux. It may take a little practice, but you'd probably figure it out before a version is written for the mac. If I ever get enough time, maybe I could go over how the Linux folks are playing it without a version written for them. All hope is not lost. Use a web search using the key words "Civ3 Linux" or something similar, and you might be able to find the same stuff that I could. If anyone's interested in investigating this, I'll gladly start a thread, although I may not be too helpful as I visit this site once in a while, when I have free time.

This is the thread for the quote I put here. If I find anything that might help out those Mac users out there, I'll post it here. Wine is my emulator of choice, but I won't be able to check these things out because I'm currently in between computers myself and use my dad's. However, here's a first lead: It appears that there's a user on Apolyton who runs Play the World in Linux who goes by the name of Waren. Using this search technique, I found a thread where he was talking about running 1.29f in Linux.

I'm not a mac user, and can't gurantee anything, but maybe we can work around this problem. Post your own leads and hints if it works. Also, if something doesn't work, let us know also. If it works, it may not be a perfect emulation, but I'm sure that a lot of mac users out there might think that this could be better than nothing. Let's see what you can come up with using this information.

EDIT: BTW, Warren might not know anything, but it sounds like he might know someone who could. Here's the link for the thread if you'd like to see what I'm seeing http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?threadid=70999 .

 

[AlanH]

I went to your link. Waren is a confused bunny. He was talking about an open source project called Freeciv, not CivIII or PTW. I followed the trail into FreeCiv-land, and from what I can see it's a fairly immature project, with a Mac OS X port that stopped in mid-stream two years ago.

I couldn't find the quote you published, but AFAIK, Wine provides an emulator for the Windows API that sits on top of Linux and has to be running on an Intel-compatible processor. Wine will not emulate Windows on a PowerPC. I have no idea whether it could be recompiled for PowerPC, but I imagine that if it could we'd have seen it by now. I also very much doubt that Wine can emulate the proprietary DirectPlay protocol that is used by PTW for network games. If it could then a DirectPlay port to OS X would be possible.

There are two Intel processor emulators that I am aware of that will run on a PowerPC. One is our old friend VirtualPC from Connectix, A.K.A Microsoft. The other is the Open Source project, the Bochs emulator. The first is almost as expensive as buying a cheap PC, so I'm not sure it's worth the hassle. I've tried the second, and it's as slow as molasses. Either would also need a real copy of Windows, although I suppose you could try running Wine and Linux on top of them. Still doubt there'd be any DirectPlay support though, and that would add up to about four layers of OS/emulation, and even a G5 might start to creak. Rather you than me.

[Edited to add some more investigation results]

 

[Trabpukcip]

Does Brad have any thoughts on this?

 

[Brad Oliver]

Originally posted by Trabpukcip
Does Brad have any thoughts on this?

Yes. There's a gulf of difference between Wine on Linux and Wine on the Mac, mainly because most people equate Linux with x86 without even thinking about it.

Wine works by taking existing x86 apps and running them through some open-source Win32 libraries that make those apps think they're really running under Windows instead of Linux. This only works on the x86; for it to work on the Mac, you'd need an additional x86 emulator. At best, it's very impractical. Betting on that angle to be feasible for the Mac is really just a quick way to set yourself up for disappointment, IMHO.

 

[AlanH]

I think that's what I said, only Brad puts it more succinctly.

 

[KingTux]

Well, even if it's not perfect, it still could work. Since it's been a while since I've used Linux regularly, I didn't realize that there was a splitoff from Wine called WineX. To check out this project, visit this site http://www.transgaming.com/. You have to pay $3 for 3 months of use, but it's supposed to be able to run DirectX 8.0 components, along with Civ3. Unlike the regular Wine, this one is paying for the rights to use copyrighted material, hence the $3 fee. I have an uncle who's running Civ3 in Linux, RedHat to be more specific. The only problem is that I don't see him much and he's off in the Persian Gulf. He's the person who started me in Linux. So, in other words, I don't have access to his help.

As for FreeCiv, I've known that's it's been around. Freeciv was mentioned in that thread, but he insisted that he was using Civ3. I thought that maybe he had someone fix it for him, so I thought that he might know someone who would be able to help. I guess he doesn't. As for the free versions of Civilization, I prefer c-evo, even though it's for windows. Hope this helps.

 

[Brad Oliver]

Originally posted by KingTux
Well, even if it's not perfect, it still could work. Since it's been a while since I've used Linux regularly, I didn't realize that there was a splitoff from Wine called WineX.

If by "could" you mean it'll be just as hard and just as unlikely, then yes, it "could" still work. Seriously, this possibility is so far beyond pretty much every other that it's not worth serious consideration.

 

[CapTVK]

You could try building it from scratch with the Freeciv SDL source for OSX.

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=98455

 

[Brad Oliver]

Originally posted by CapTVK
You could try building it from scratch with the Freeciv SDL source for OSX.

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=98455

If you're talking strictly about FreeCiv and not Civilization, you'd be much better off just installing Fink and downloading the FreeCiv binaries rather than messing with makefiles and trying to compile it yourself.