Possible AI cheat: does "no tech trading" only apply to the human player?

[MrCynical]

@Warpstorm: Are you sure that it applies for unknown civs as well? When I've been isolated tech costs don't seem to be reduced on the older techs, which I'd logically expect if the bonus applied to unknown civs. It definitely didn't in Civ 3, but it's possible they changed it for Civ 4 since being isolated was so crippling in Civ 3.

 

[Seven05]

The tech cost itself won't be any lower, what you'll see if that you will have some unexplained beakers already "in" the various techs. If you have one that nobody else (or very few others) has ever discovered the tech will have a price displayed as 0/500 for example, but if other civs know of the tech you'll see it listed as maybe 125/500. You should see this alot when in the diplomacy window, mouse over any tech the other civ is offering and look at the tech cost.

 

[Nilrim]

So just looking at the AIs size and saying it should suck at tech is a bad assumption.

Oh I understand that, my problem was that not only was it high in tech but it also had all those military units. If I had that few of cities and that number of military units my cost would be so high that there would be no way I could run at a very high Sci. You try and have a 5 city Civ, have 50 or 60 military units, lose half of them in a short war but still have the same number near the end of that war. The cost to maintain AND build new units quickly is MUCH eaiser for the AI then a human player. Factor in unit upkeep for 50-60 units then new bulidings and SCi. Nope the AI cheats plain and simple.

 

[The Q-Meister]

Actually I have found that I do much better in Civ IV - technologically and otherwise than I did in Civ 3. I also enjoy it much more so maybe that has something to do with it...

I think more likely it is something to do with the need to make far fewer cities to be successful; I was never the "build 50 cities as fast as you can and ignore everything else" type so it's refreshing that I can still be the most advanced civ with only 4 or 5 cities.

 

[MrCynical]

@Nilrim: What stage in the game is this? In the industrial age and later is perfectly possible to have this level of military and be the most advanced with only 4 or 5 cities (and I've done it myself more than once). Unit upkeep for 50 to 60 units is at most 50 to 60 gpt, and probably much less, not at all improbable once a civ is up and running. The number of cities involved is far less important in Civ 4, and it's not uncommon for the capital to give production and commerce equal to most of the rest of my empire put together. As for replacing half the army during wartime, a civ that has focused on four cities ought to be able to built a unit almost every turn in each of them, to say nothing of drafting, pop-rushing and buying units as well. There is nothing here that would remotely surprise me if I saw it in a multiplayer game, so I see no reason to assume the AI is cheating because it isn't being incompetant.

The AI has substantial bonuses to upkeep at the higher difficulty levels, but these are no more "cheating" than the bonuses it receives to research and production at levels above noble.

 

[Lucas87]

@Nilrim I believe the AI does build units more easily than we do but I don't know how much. I know when I'm playing the small peaceful civ and someone declares war on me I can churn out units in a hurry. Nationhood, Slavery and Universal Suffrage all at once at 100% gold really lets build units in a hurry. I don't know how much the AI uses these strategies, but its possible to get units without a whole lot of straight production.

 

[Kamamura]

If you check tha Handicap rule file, you will find out that even on Noble where the odds should be even, AI still has bonus for hurrying production (I think only 40% percent of the cost) - probably to compensate for the AI's notorious incapability of strategic planing (so it can buy new units quickly to cities that come under attack). I suspect that AI abuses this bonus and buys units constantly instead of building them - that's why it has 30+ idle useless units in cities.

Naturally, all strategy games cheat (except chess programs), because there is not strong enough demand from the customers for decent AI that is costly and hard to develop, so developers rather spend bucks on graphics where they earn the most (so next time when you shout 'woot! new 3d engine', be careful what you wish for).