Post patch Detailed Trade Route Discussion

[CivScientist]

well that is your opinion, but when I am getting 3 or 4 food, and 8 or 9 production per trade route to my 1 pop city, it grows my empire quite quickly. All trade route yields are based upon the differential of the two cities, with the largest producer getting the benefit.

And I never said, I don't grow my cities... I just always have a 1 pop city to send my trade routes to.

If you're constantly plopping down cities, this strategy is quite effective. It also make that city in the ice that will never amount to anything more than a resource worth it a whole lot more.

 

[mb2bm55]

I wish there was more transparency from Firaxis about the TR calculation. The work @FaceUnderMask did was excellent. However, his results show there could be several variables at work that must be taken under consideration now as clearly the relationship is non-linear in regards to difference in total or net production of cities and TR yield. Nor is it linear when rounding factors are taken into account (.5 rounded up/down) prior to plot point calculations. i.e. Difference of 12 net production yields +7 while 7 difference is +3.

Variables to be investigated:
Distance
-including whether land or sea routes yield different amounts between the same cities due to difference in distances of the routes
-if not then does the basic tile distance between the cities matter
Resources
-including between cities with the same food resources and different ones
Wonders (food producing)
Global effects (including wonders)
Specialists

Note:
The actual equation bears enormous weight in regards to the value of food production in general. How are we to determine if the super-farm strategy is optimal over the super generator, terrascape, or manufactory strats?

 

[FaceUnderMask]

Variables to be investigated:
Distance
-including whether land or sea routes yield different amounts between the same cities due to difference in distances of the routes
-if not then does the basic tile distance between the cities matter
Resources
-including between cities with the same food resources and different ones
Wonders (food producing)
Global effects (including wonders)
Specialists

I'm fairly sure that distance doesn't matter. Any sources of yield should, though. Personally, I think that the only factors are yield difference and total food in the city. Although I've seen weird cases like +3/+1 which I don't really know how to explain except another weird case of nonlinearity coupled with roundup.

 

[Minor Annoyance]

I wish there was more transparency from Firaxis about the TR calculation. The work @FaceUnderMask did was excellent. However, his results show there could be several variables at work that must be taken under consideration now as clearly the relationship is non-linear in regards to difference in total or net production of cities and TR yield. Nor is it linear when rounding factors are taken into account (.5 rounded up/down) prior to plot point calculations. i.e. Difference of 12 net production yields +7 while 7 difference is +3.

Variables to be investigated:
Distance
-including whether land or sea routes yield different amounts between the same cities due to difference in distances of the routes
-if not then does the basic tile distance between the cities matter
Resources
-including between cities with the same food resources and different ones
Wonders (food producing)
Global effects (including wonders)
Specialists

Note:
The actual equation bears enormous weight in regards to the value of food production in general. How are we to determine if the super-farm strategy is optimal over the super generator, terrascape, or manufactory strats?

Anything that affects the yield output affects trade the same regardless of source. This even includes setting production to build food.

 

[Paszczak]

My head hurts after reading all this! Poor ol' me just can't take it.

What exactly was wrong with Brave New World trade routes that they had to change it. I thought it offered a good deal of choice. Trade with other civilizations for gold and science OR sent "magically" generated food or production to your own cities. Do you want to make your capital a powerhouse OR help smaller cities get big? Send food for a long term benefit OR production for short term bonus toward construction or if starved for happiness?

Dang.

 

[Gort]

The eight trade-route limit was another way tall was incentivised over wide, maybe they wanted to get away from that?

 

[Mutineer]

I do not know, may be i am sick playing tall? personally i think trade routes now in good place.

 

[Xenotitan]

They're not in a good place. The complete lack of transparency is an unnecessary burden on the player. Also, the inability to boost smaller cities with larger ones is an issue.

 

[Mutineer]

Boots smaller cities with stations, boost large with internal routes. I especially like the fact that if one of opponent will start to create high specialize science or energy cities external routes become very good. To be true, I really like current state of trade routes. The only thin i look at is scaling external routes.

 

[Gamewizard]

Trade routes should be more transparent, but other than that I like the way they work.

 

[mb2bm55]

I do think trade routes are much better since the patch. However, as seems to be the consensus, a little more clarity of how they function would be nice. Also, smaller cities should benefit more than they do.

 

[erkanus]

After the changes made by the last patch, trade routes lost a lot of its value. But the most influential change was that it is no longer possible to send a trade route to a newly build city in order to increase production and food like before or like in CIV5.

For example I try to send a trade route from my 2nd big city to my little 2 population city. the bigger city gets 7 production and 5 food while the smaller one gets only 2 food and no production. When I try the opposite, sending the trade route from the smaller one to the bigger one, the result is nearly the same.
So is this means that we will not be able to send a trade route to develop a small city? Are the bigger cities always benefit more?
And how about international trade routes?

How is this calculated? Can anyone explain mechanics of the trade routes in detail please?

 

[Browd]

Moderator Action: Merged with Post-Patch Detailed Trade Route Discussion thread.

 

[Dargov]

I feel the logic of the small city giving a bigger boost to the larger city is more of a comment on relationships between Urban(the larger) and Rural(the smaller) communities.

The Urban cities provide additional workers and reap the most benefit as these workers spend their earnings back in the city. The rural community also grows as a result, it gains a smaller overall benefit, but a larger percentage benefit compared to it's existing output.

As the smaller city grows in size/production it becomes more self reliant, reducing the extent to which the larger city can exploit it.

This is a little at odds with the other mechanics (tile working) however.

And I'm sure it falls down completely when we consider that the central direction/planned economy of a civ, especially a Beyond Earth civ.

I would be curious to consider the % impact of the TR bonus on growth/turns till production completion.

 

[Acken]

The eight trade-route limit was another way tall was incentivised over wide, maybe they wanted to get away from that?

Well they went a bit too far away from that .

Also the lack of transparency(or just poor idea for the yields) + bad UI are a deal breaker to me.