Problem with religious emergency

[AlexandriaWolf]

So Scotland's capital was converted by the Ottomans and an emergency was declared. I was the only one who bothered to show up. Now the script said we had to keep the capitol from following the Ottoman's religion for 13 turns. Well since not even the Scots had sent a missionary to re-convert their city I went ahead and started spreading my religion there. Now I didn't convert it fully, just left it at gray, hoping Scotland would get in on the act and come take care of it. But nope, instead Robert the Bruce chews me out and tells me my guys are not welcome. So my choice is to either tank my friendly relationship with him or leave and leave his stupid city to its fate. And yep, the Ottomans came right back in and converted it back. And we lost the competition. This just seems like a REALLY stupid way to set this up and I will definitely never again participate in one of these things.

So any ideas on a way I CAN participate in one of these the next time it comes up? Because the way it seems to be seems REALLY self defeating.

 

[jasper]

Take the hit and win the competition. Be a man dude.

But i think it makes some sense. Imagine if youre scotland, youre in fact going to treat either invasive religion with contempt and wish them both gone.

 

[AlexandriaWolf]

I get that. But then you are literally helpless to actually DO anything about he religious emergency. Because the only way you can keep the city from following the invading religion is to begin converting it to your own. If Scotland doesn't come in and convert THEIR OWN city then you lose by default. I also really hate that you can be trapped into taking part in the emergency even if you vote against it. So even if I do nothing, if I can't stop the religious emergency from happening in the first place, I'm still punished if I don't take part either. Religion is the one thing I SUPREMELY dislike about this game. It's nonsensical and irritating and consumes far too much of your time and resources if you don't just want to roll over and let other civs convert you. But this religious emergency nonsense is really the worst.

 

[Finvola]

Yeah it's pointless if the civ declaring the religious emergency doesn't even attempt to convert their own cities back. Why do they bother declaring an emergency if they're not going to actually do anything? (AI "logic" at its best!) I always opt out of religious emergencies because I don't like them.

 

[AlexandriaWolf]

Yeah but I went back to an earlier save and when it came up again I voted against it but it still passed and I was part of it against my will! So that was even MORE infuriating! Religion is done so poorly in this game that now I want a mod that will turn it OFF!

 

[kaspergm]

It's just another example of a feature of the game that isn't implemented in a meaningful way. Obviously it doesn't make sense from a logical point of view to have you, representing a third-party religion, participating in a religious strife between two religions. So either the game should have made it so only civs following the same religion as Scotland can part-take in the emergency, or they should have somehow made a mechanic that allowed you to remove the offenders religion without spreading your own.

 

[Abaxial]

My experience is that an AI will declare a religious emergency after its religion has been completely extirpated, so there is no way it can ever recover its original religion. But if I read it aright, you only have to stop the city following the religion it was converted to. Which doesn't make a lot of sense either.

 

[AlexandriaWolf]

You're absolutely right @kaspergm . I'm baffled by this mechanic. It literally makes no sense. Also, by the Industrial Era, you should be able to transform your religion into Atheism! LOL I mean, it should at least be an option. It could translate half your existing faith to science (or culture!) and have the effect of negating all further incursions of other faiths. I'd also really like to see paganism as a religion up until the renaissance (or maybe as early as the medieval period) with the option to keep it rather than adopt another religion though it should probably cost something to do so.

@Abaxial you're right. It makes no sense at all. Literally the mechanic doesn't work. The only way to STOP the city from following the religion it has been converted to is to attempt to replace it with your own. And since that draws the ire of the very Civ who called the emergency in the first place it's a lose-lose situation. This REALLY needs to be re-worked by the devs.

 

[Finvola]

I completely agree, it should be reworked and if it can't be reworked it should be removed. I use Pidi's Religious Border Control mod so the AI can only send religious units into a territory if they have open borders, are allied, or at war. Of course it doesn't stop the religious emergencies because it only works if your borders are closed, but it might help cut down on the excess religious spam. I don't know of a mod that stops the religious emergencies. If I did, I'd have that bad boy in my game.

 

[pxpdoo]

So Scotland's capital was converted by the Ottomans and an emergency was declared. I was the only one who bothered to show up. Now the script said we had to keep the capitol from following the Ottoman's religion for 13 turns. Well since not even the Scots had sent a missionary to re-convert their city I went ahead and started spreading my religion there. Now I didn't convert it fully, just left it at gray, hoping Scotland would get in on the act and come take care of it. But nope, instead Robert the Bruce chews me out and tells me my guys are not welcome. So my choice is to either tank my friendly relationship with him or leave and leave his stupid city to its fate. And yep, the Ottomans came right back in and converted it back. And we lost the competition. This just seems like a REALLY stupid way to set this up and I will definitely never again participate in one of these things.

So any ideas on a way I CAN participate in one of these the next time it comes up? Because the way it seems to be seems REALLY self defeating.

It occurs to me that - I'm pretty sure - you can only make a Missionary in a city that has a majority religion. If all Scotland's cities were 'grey,' then none of them had a religion (with a Holy Site) to even make a Missionary.
If I'm correct, then you were waiting for a Scottish Missionary that the Scottish could not build.
And since adding your own religion ******s the natural spread of Bruce's original religion, you (and the Ottomans) were actually slowing his original religion from spreading back from his Holy City.
Looks like the only way to win this one is to spread your own religion at full force and take the Diplo hit.

 

[AlexandriaWolf]

I don't recall what his original religion was but I think a few of his cities stilll had it but yeah he could probably only have made an Apostle in hi capital, which had been converted. Hence the emergency. But yeah it makes no sense to essentially do what he asks and then be punished for it. That's...just a really bad mechanic.

 

[pxpdoo]

I don't recall what his original religion was but I think a few of his cities stilll had it but yeah he could probably only have made an Apostle in hi capital, which had been converted. Hence the emergency. But yeah it makes no sense to essentially do what he asks and then be punished for it. That's...just a really bad mechanic.

Agreed, of course.

 

[The Swede]

Religion is done so poorly in this game that now I want a mod that will turn it OFF!

https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/disable-religion-holy-site.643978/

I use this in almost every game I play.

 

[tomplum68]

I get that. But then you are literally helpless to actually DO anything about he religious emergency. Because the only way you can keep the city from following the invading religion is to begin converting it to your own. If Scotland doesn't come in and convert THEIR OWN city then you lose by default. I also really hate that you can be trapped into taking part in the emergency even if you vote against it. So even if I do nothing, if I can't stop the religious emergency from happening in the first place, I'm still punished if I don't take part either. Religion is the one thing I SUPREMELY dislike about this game. It's nonsensical and irritating and consumes far too much of your time and resources if you don't just want to roll over and let other civs convert you. But this religious emergency nonsense is really the worst.

If you vote against the emergency but it still passes, you are not considered a part of the emergency as one of the aggressors.

 

[AlexandriaWolf]

That's odd. Then why does it still say that "we" lost?

 

[Futumch]

Also, by the Industrial Era, you should be able to transform your religion into Atheism!

I would have liked to see Research Labs, Spaceports, Broadcast Centres, Seaports and Power plants (of all stripes) have a push-back effect against religion. Maybe via a policy card, because that allows people to opt-in rather than a blanket effect. I'd probably throw Seasteads in there too. Call the card Antitheism or Cynicism or something like that.

The thing is Religion is built into the core of the game, so it's pretty hard to cut it away without really screwing over some Civs that rely on it.

 

[Abaxial]

As Kongo you really notice how much you are cut off from because of no religion and no faith. For instance, of the first golden age dedications, two are useless to you.