Proposal: Buffing buildings

[CYZ]

I've been reading the forums since Civ 4 and have recently been following the news and reviews on civ 5. Like many others I'm quite dissapointed about the way it was released. Not so much because the unbalanced features but more about the fact it doesn't seem like it would be alot of work to improve the current situation.

I have some ideas about how small improvements could make big differences but have no way of actually bringing them into practise. I've read (in part) the mod guide but for me that's way over my head.

The main issue with Civ 5 seems to me that too many buildings are not worth the buildtime and maintenance 90% of the time. The idea the developers must have had of specializing cities is totally ruined and usually you're better off building only a few buildings (usually the same ones) in every city.

I think by buffing certain buildings the whole specilization concept can be brought back.

The best example is the Seaport. It needs sea resources to be build, and then further improves these. I think this should have been done with many more buildings.

For example a windmill will improve wheat with extra production. A granary can only be build near a food resource and improves all food resources with 1. A forge can only be build near a mineral resource and gives all mines extra production.

This way certain buildings will increase the benefits of tiles and resources and you'll automaticly specialize your cities in for example production if it's near alot of hills and food if it's near several food resources.

 

[SevenSpirits]

That's a really nice idea! If stables added a hammer or two to every nearby horse, they'd be a bit more appealing.

 

[The_J]

Moderator Action: Moved to the main forum.
Only finished files belong to the subforums (besides SDK/Lua), questions and working threads belong to the main forum .

 

[CYZ]

Exactly, and a stable can only be build if there is a hore or ivory resource nearby. Thereby forcing you to adjust alot of your strategy to the surroundings of your cities.

Specialization could be extended by giving certain buildings pre-requisites. For example you need sea resources to build a seaport, giving you extra hammers. Then there ought to be a building that gives experience to naval units (no such buildings exists atm, another flaw imo). You need the seaport to build this building. Meaning that without sea resources you can't specialize your city with extra production and experience for naval units.

Do the same with the lighthouse and harbour. (lighthouse can still always be build but without it you can't build the harbor.

In this situation you probably won't have had the oppertunity to build alot of other buildings. The result is a specialized navy city that gets extra production from sea resources, builds stronger naval units faster and gains extra food from sea tiles.

Doing this with more resources, buildings and tiles will add alot of depth when choosing city sites and buildings. Sadly, I know nothing of modding, but this doesn't seem like a huge change that would be hard to implement. It just needs to be thought out, implemented, tested and rebalanced. Three of those I'd gladly do.

 

[CaptainBinky]

Basically, more buildings like the mint which requires silver/gold nearby?

I really like this idea, but I think it's possible to go a bit too nuts. For instance, the seaport requiring sea resources makes sense since it's an industrial building. But why would you need whales and/or fish to build a building which provides xp to a naval vessel?

But I don't want to sound too negative, the idea in general sounds really good and I'd be interested in giving it a go if someone made it

 

[CYZ]

Basically, more buildings like the mint which requires silver/gold nearby?

Exactly, one such building for every resource type. One for cattle and sheep (and horses). One for iron, marble, aluminium and coal. And so forth.

I really like this idea, but I think it's possible to go a bit too nuts. For instance, the seaport requiring sea resources makes sense since it's an industrial building. But why would you need whales and/or fish to build a building which provides xp to a naval vessel?

Gameplaywise, to create specilization. The coastal city with some sea resources will be gaining additional productivity from the sea and will be the best at building ships. The city in an area with horses will gain productivity from that and be best at building cavalry.

It's logical too, the best ship builders will usually live in the city where ships are needed the most. The most experienced horse riders will come from a region where horses are native.

But you are right that it could get too crazy, there should still be plenty of choices to allow strategic depth.

 

[Eejit]

Sounds like a good idea.

You could also do the same with luxury or happiness buildings in a similar vein to Monastery (and, oddly, Circus).

Or perhaps special bonuses other than generic production/gold? Like a building requiring iron resource near city which gives only units requiring iron a particular Promotion, or 5-10 free XP?

 

[CYZ]

Sounds like a good idea.

You could also do the same with luxury or happiness buildings in a similar vein to Monastery (and, oddly, Circus).

Or perhaps special bonuses other than generic production/gold? Like a building requiring iron resource near city which gives only units requiring iron a particular Promotion, or 5-10 free XP?

That's a valuable idea. Although it might easily get overpowered that way. Besides, millitary bonusses aren't worth that much with the current state of the ai anyway.

The monastery is already great, it's culture bonus is quite nice early on. There could be something like a weavery giving bonnuses for cotton and silk and even dye and sheep. But instead of improving tiles it could give a traderoute bonus per resource or something.

I imagine it being a rennaissance building. During this period many clothing factories flourished in Europe. It would also make it more interesting and diverse if it wouldn't be just ancient and classical buildings but some late game buildings as well.

 

[Eejit]

That's a valuable idea. Although it might easily get overpowered that way. Besides, millitary bonusses aren't worth that much with the current state of the ai anyway.

Well it'd be available to the AI too Plus, even if Firaxis don't fix the AI any time soon there are already modders working on it, with promising initial results.

Is there currently any Aluminium resource based bonus to SS parts construction? If not such a building could be made, though not too big a bonus since it directly affects a victory.

 

[CYZ]

Well it'd be available to the AI too Plus, even if Firaxis don't fix the AI any time soon there are already modders working on it, with promising initial results.

Is there currently any Aluminium resource based bonus to SS parts construction? If not such a building could be made, though not too big a bonus since it directly affects a victory.

There isn't atm. It could give a 25% spaceship production for that city only, that way it wouldn't be too overpowered.

Watermill should also be changed since it's just an expensive granary right now. I think watermill should give all lumbermills +1 production instead of the food bonus. I've never heard of watermills producing food, they usually saw logs into planks. This way there'll actually be incentive to settle near a river (when there are forests around atleast). Perhaps it could give a singe gold bonus with electricity as well.

I still think that if the devs had thought the buildings through a bit more the game would be alot better. There's nothing wrong with the idea a building takes a long time to build, but it has to be worth the while

 

[Eejit]

That change would be too much like the Iroquis UB.
Maybe give Watermills either an extra +food or no maintenance. Don't want to go too overboard.

 

[CYZ]

Oh yeah, hadn't thought of that. That would give Iroquis too much of a forest bonus.

 

[SevenSpirits]

Watermill should also be changed since it's just an expensive granary right now. I think watermill should give all lumbermills +1 production instead of the food bonus. I've never heard of watermills producing food, they usually saw logs into planks. This way there'll actually be incentive to settle near a river (when there are forests around atleast). Perhaps it could give a singe gold bonus with electricity as well.

Watermills were used almost exclusively for grinding grain before the medieval era, particularly by the Greeks and Romans. Only later did people start to mechanize other tasks like mine pumping, sawing, and operating bellows, and watermills were initially the main source of non-human power used for those other tasks. (Windmills were still used mostly for making flour at that point.)