Questions about archaeological sites....

[Sherlock]

Where and in what order should I send an archeologist out to excavate these sites?

I'm assuming do ones in my own borders first.

Then no one's territory, then in city-state, then in other Civs?

Or should I never do one in another Civ's area? Does that tourism go to the Civ that excavated the site (me, hopefully) or does it go to whatever Civ owns the territory the site is on?

Any suggestions on how to proceed with these will be appreciated. I'm trying hard for a cultural win but so far I have 0 out of 7 Civ's won over.

 

[TPangolin]

I'd actually do the ones in foreign borders first and always pick the option in which you gain an Artifact.

First you want to make sure you have enough Museums or Buildings/Wonders with Great Work slots in them before you embark on such a mission.

The logic is that you want to dig up all your enemies' artifacts before the have a chance to get there.

Also, if you want to improve your Tourism points with other civs It's best to have either a diplomat in their capital, Open Borders, a shared religion or a Trade Route with them as this increases the rate in which they fall under your influence quite considerably.

In regards to landmarks, the tile yields will go to whoever owns the tile. What difficulty are you playing on?

 

[kaspergm]

Basically, if you want to maximize the number of archeological sites you get access to, never trade open borders to another player when you're closing in on archeology tech. If no-one has access to your borders, you will be guaranteed any site within own borders and can leave that one 'til others are cleared.

Secondly, try to grab any archeological site in no-man's land and in city state areas first. Prioritize those that are immediately adjacent to another civs borders (less he expands and claims the site) and obviously try to clear close to who-ever you think might be getting to or might already have archeology tech finished. You can use any available military unit to "occupy" an archeological site if you want.

About digging within another civs borders: You need to decide what your diplomatic strategy is. When you dig within another civs borders, they will approach you through diplomacy and ask you to stop taking their cultural items. If you oblige to this, no diplomatic penalty incures (unless you break the promise, obviously). If you refuse to follow their request, you will get a diplomatic penalty. However, the penalty is not that big and will be constant no matter how many further sites you excavate, so depending on circumstances, it can be worthwhile to take the diplomatic hit and continue digging - especially if you have finished exploration and they have many hidden sites within their area. Notice that hidden sites will count exactly the same as normal sites, even if the AI can't see the hidden sites themselves.

If you dig an archeological site in another civs territory, you get the option to make an artifact (goes to you) or you can make a landmark (goes to them). Making a landmark within a foreign civ or city state territory will give you a diplomatic bonus / influence boost (+40 influence with CS I think). I think most players don't use this option too often, but a marginal strategy can be to finish exploration and then dig hidden sites, and then leave the landmark unless you find one of the great works of writing, which you will obviously convert to cultural renaissance for massive culture boost. This way you can scavenge all hidden sites without getting diplomatic penalties, although of course you will give the AI the benefit of the landmark (unless it's outside of their workable borders, which will still give you the diplomatic boost).

 

[Mustakrakish]

I get AI's first, get one, swear not to do it again, maybe make a monument to improve relations. Then no one's territory and CS, also making monuments when possible, also improving influence. Then my own. By that time most or all are filled.

 

[happyturtle]

I like to make landmarks in city-states for the major influence boost.

 

[GoStu]

My first Archaeologist(s) out the door often dig up the ones in my own territory that are in working range of the cities. My reason? Same tech unlocked the museums to hold them in. With an Artist's Guild up early enough, I often don't have space to put any foreign artifacts in. I let my highest production cities squeeze out the Archaeologists, and the mid production cities throw museums up.

 

[joncnunn]

My first one(s) I build are also always the ones that my own cities can work and become landmarks.
Reason: With an Airport & Hotels these can provide more tourism than an artifact after the World Council resolution passes that adds culture to landmarks & great improvements.

Those outside of that range wait for me to have space for artifacts. First ones of those I'll grab are those in neutral territory just outside my borders, then the ones that were technically within my borders (but outside of working range), following which closest in sight but skip major AI ones.
Reason for skipping ones within major AI's territory: There is a diplomatic penalty for digging up a site within a major AIs territory and turning it into an artifact.

 

[Zaimejs]

I never knew you got a boost for building monuments elsewhere. I do the Raider's of the Lost Ark thing. Pillaging the globe for artifacts before returning home to claim mine. I try to park units on as many of them as I can until I get museums built.

 

[happyturtle]

If it's a tile your cities can work, and you're balancing whether to make it a landmark or an artefact, look at the age. The older it is, the more it's worth as a landmark, but for artefacts, all ages give the same culture/tourism bonus.

I think you get the first artefact out of an AI civ with no penalty, as long as you promise not to do it again.

 

[RegentMan]

When you take one artifact from the AI, you'll still get the red "You took our archeological artifacts!" negative line when you hover over, even if you promise not to do so again.

 

[GunJ]

When I unlock archeology I usually do this:

1. Review the entire map I uncovered at the time to see where the Sites are.
In the first wave I actively send my archeologists for sites located far far away from my lands (like different continents) - and preferably not covered by cultural borders of my competitors. Logic being - that I can dig them up with no diplomatic hit and in time before the competitor covers the site with their borders and/or sends an archeologist of their own - I wouldnt be able to reach those sites if I started the excavations near my empire.

2. Second wave goes for sites in neutral territory that are on my continent and in my vicinity - but still not located in my borders.

3. Depending on military situation (war/peace) I use any military or civilian units available to block the sites located in my borders and in the vicinity of my empire - to buy time to dig up everything else in points 1 & 2.

4. As a last wave I dig up sites in my empire - using the workable tiles to create monuments, and those located 3tiles away from the city to dig up artifacts.

5. Sometimes - if I do not go full tradition - I save up my "free cultural building in first 4 cities SP" - to create insta-museums (just make sure You pre-build 4 Opera Houses in your cities before You take the SP and voila - You get place for 8 artifacts without any hammers - learned this handy solution on CivFanatics).

On a side-note - I havent tried this yet - but do You guys think it would be possible to send let's say 5 archeologists to sites located in your competitors borders, time their work to finish the dig on the same turn - and say steal 4 artifacts, and finish by building the monument for them with the last archeologist ?

Afterwards on competitors turn - pledge to never again dig in their territory (why would You as everything is dug up)
Would it be a good way to raid a competitor civ for their artifacts while at the same time just slightly damage relations with them ?

 

[happyturtle]

Hmm... that 'dig them all at once' experiment sounds like something worth trying! Though you'd want to do it with 6 archaeologists so you can unlock this Steam achievement:

Losing My Marbles
Extract 5 Artifacts from the territory of another major civilization.

 

[joncnunn]

Hmm... that 'dig them all at once' experiment sounds like something worth trying! Though you'd want to do it with 6 archaeologists so you can unlock this Steam achievement:

Losing My Marbles
Extract 5 Artifacts from the territory of another major civilization.

Only 5 needed for this achievement. If your doing it from the same AI there's no point building the AI a landmark as it's not going to offset the 5X penalty from extracting.

 

[danaphanous]

I never knew you got a boost for building monuments elsewhere. I do the Raider's of the Lost Ark thing. Pillaging the globe for artifacts before returning home to claim mine. I try to park units on as many of them as I can until I get museums built.

This is exactly what I do. Upon researching archaelogy all my cavalry and lancers gallop off and sit on the ones in no-man's land that are within reach. I usually sit on the ones in my territory too, especially if I gave open borders just in case. If I have open borders I may even sit on the ones in my friend's territory.

1. Send them for ones within or near borders of AI first. If I dig one within I promise not to do it again (you don't get a hit the first time in my experience, only if you break the promise)
2. For the sake of efficiency I would start near me and once it is completed move the guard-horse farther out. Keep doing this until you've claimed all the possible ones and DO NOT FORGET to make museums on time.
3. Lastly, I turn the ones within city radius to landmarks. Why last? The culture does not get converted to tourism until a later tech, however, when it does the tourism boost is better than a mere artifact. Plus extra culture is always nice for policies in the mean-time.

Target numbers would be based on map size. I usually keep going until I get an even number and then try to max theming bonuses.

 

[Sherlock]

Does tourism do you any good at all if you're not going for a cultural victory?

 

[danaphanous]

yep, ideological pressure offense. As a warlike civ it reduces resistance in captured cities if you are more influential over them. If you are just trying to survive having strong tourism will reduce rival ideological influence and thus unhappiness to you.

 

[Halcyan2]

Do tourism do you any good at all if you're not going for a cultural victory?

Yes.

Ideological pressure helps avoid unhappiness in your cities (and causes unhappiness in the cities of civilization's following a different ideology).

Since the October 2013 patch, reaching levels of tourism gives you science bonuses via trade routes, lets your spies establish surveillance in just one turn, allows your spies to operate as if they were higher levels in other civ's cities or city state allies, and reduces population loss and unrest when you take control of cities.

I love Great Works and tourism but often turn off Cultural victory. Tourism is still very helpful and fun.

 

[HorseshoeHermit]

Do tourism do you any good at all if you're not going for a cultural victory?

It helps you fight ideological pressure which causes severe unhappiness, and it allows you to gain benefits in trade routes, spies, and conquest.

The difference in tourism influence levels you have over another civilization and vice versa determines the ideological pressure exerted by each on the other. When you've filled different percentages of the other's culture with your own tourism, and your ideology differs, it adds a marker of ideological pressure. This can be an annoying penalty in unhappiness. You may find it easier to compete with a player by applying tourism to his civ rather than 'fleeing' with cultural growth.

When you reach famiiliar, popular, and influential status your spies can establish surveillance faster, your city unrest time for conquest decreases, and you receive free science from trade routes connecting you to that civ.