Red_Phoenix
Chieftain
- Joined
- Sep 18, 2010
- Messages
- 3
Well, recent archaeological evidence suggests city-building started quite early in the stone age - when we were still in an Ice Age. Some of the earliest homes may have been built of mammoth bones and hide. Trade thrived, even more so when the ice started melting.
If it were possible to program, I would move the start date of Civ back into the Ice age. Focus on stone-age techs and buildings for awhile, let the planet thaw, mammoths hunted to extinction but new resources appear (or not? stone age conservation, anyone? wonder how that would've changed history) and then offer the player to convert all their cities into settlers and relocate, taking the modified terrain into consideration.
More realistic starting of the bronze and iron ages would also be good. They should be started by random events. However, the random events should be separate from the less essential random events. You get a chance of entering the bronze/iron age specifically, in addition to getting a chance of a random event occurring, and if one does, than the computer goes on to decide which one.
In order to enter the early bronze age, you must have access to copper and either tin or arsenic. You must also be able to produce hot enough fires for some creative metalsmith to chance upon the combination. More metalsmiths - possibly just creating jewelry with copper - increase your chances of entering the bronze age. If you have copper / arsenic, you are likely to enter the bronze age sooner than those with tin but not arsenic.(Some copper naturally contains some amount of arsenic, and metalsmiths are likely to notice that copper is stronger, make the connection, and start adding arsenic on purpose.) However, there is an unhealthiness penalty for using arsenic. Copper / tin is thus a more advance bronze-age technology that obsoletes copper / arsenic in civilization that have enough tin. Also, the game should differentiate between surface copper (most likely with more copper down below) and copper that cannot be accessed without substantial digging. Civilizations with surface copper are more likely to beat their neighbors to the bronze age.
Having neighbors / trading partners increases your chances of entering the bronze age. It is possible to skip copper / arsenic and proceed directly to copper / tin, especially if you have neighbors / trading partners / other known civilization who have already entered the bronze age. If a bronze age civilization attacks you, that should dramatically increase your chances of stealing the idea from them sooner rather than later.
In order to enter the Iron age you should have iron ore and the ability create even hotter fires. It's more common than copper. It should be possible to skip the bronze age and enter directly into the iron age. In fact, civilization lacking copper should have a much higher probability of entering the iron age before their bronze age neighbors, since they are looking for a way to compete with said neighbors. Again, if your neighbors / trading partners / enemies have entered the iron age, you are more likely to discover it too.
Don't get either? Well, at least you get to research some advanced stone age techs instead. Aside from their use of Obsidian rather than metals, the Aztecs were quite advanced. You can actually do a fair bit with Obsidian - it can be very hard and sharp. Having a lot of Obsidian, and not knowing any bronze or iron age civilizations, may reduce your chances of making it to the bronze age. Still, Native Americans in the Amazon basin managed to create terra pretta - a sort of manmade, superrich soil - which we still can't do today.
I get rather tired of building the same thing city after city. Buildings should be customizable. For example, building options should be based on what materials you have available - e.g. wood, various stones, concrete, metals, adobe, etc. If you have stone, you get to build stone walls. If not, you can build wooden walls, but for a much lower defensive bonus, subject to replacement if you ever find a source of stone. Building material should impact random events. Wooden buildings are more susceptible to fires, hurricanes, and tornadoes, but more resistant to earthquakes. Stone buildings are more resistant to fires, hurricanes, and tornadoes, but unless they have steel supports, more vulnerable to earthquakes. The size / grandeur of the building should be customizable as well. And why not let cities have patron gods / patron saints for whatever religion / religions are present? Rather than have wonders, being the first to build a really, super grand temple to a particular patron god or saint should be a prerequisite for certain positive random events caused by the awe your people and others feel toward the temple (or whatever). Over time, the grandness required to compete with other civilizations increases.
Rather than giving civilizations leaders with traits, civilizations should acquire traits through their actions. For example, if you focus heavily on culture and your cities, on average, produce a certain amount of culture per turn, you get the creative trait. Neglect culture, and you can lose the trait.
I also think you should have more fine-grained control over your capital city than other cities. In fact, early on, your cities aside from your capital should be almost like other civilizations - sharing your culture but doing their own thing, maybe even attacking you - capturing a portion of you population as slaves or forcing you to pay tribute (but not able to relate to other civilizations except through you). However, as communications improve and your capital becomes more clearly dominant, they fall more under your control - first to acting like vassals, then to allowing you to pick what they build but not assign the citizens to work different tiles / be specialists - and finally to a more fine-grained control. War with another civilization may temporarily unite separatist city-states of your civilization. Still, I think, for the capitol, it would be really great to have extra fine-grained control. Even when nearby cities / cities on your continent are under your relatively complete control, further / overseas cities should automatically be colonies. If they don't revolt and spin off before the invention of better communications technologies and faster travel, they become part of your civilization.
Also, most religions should get along with each other well, except for monotheistic religions. Each monotheistic religion competes with all other religions. Polytheistic religions, Buddhism, Taoism, and Confusionism, have a tendency to merge / coexist relatively peacefully.
I'm not sure how easy it would be to program all that, but I think it would make the game funner / more realistic, even if a bit less balanced.
Regarding horses - say having access to the "horse resource" just gives you the ability to build stables, and the stables are required by any city that does not have free-ranging horses nearby to build horse units.
Speaking of which, agricultural technology could be more detailed. Say "wheat" , rather than being restricted to one tile, is something that grants you access to technologies relating to the cultivation of wheat, and affects the sort of farms you have available - you can put "wheat" farms on any appropriate terrain. And you do get to steal it from neighbors; only need a few seeds, after all.
If it were possible to program, I would move the start date of Civ back into the Ice age. Focus on stone-age techs and buildings for awhile, let the planet thaw, mammoths hunted to extinction but new resources appear (or not? stone age conservation, anyone? wonder how that would've changed history) and then offer the player to convert all their cities into settlers and relocate, taking the modified terrain into consideration.
More realistic starting of the bronze and iron ages would also be good. They should be started by random events. However, the random events should be separate from the less essential random events. You get a chance of entering the bronze/iron age specifically, in addition to getting a chance of a random event occurring, and if one does, than the computer goes on to decide which one.
In order to enter the early bronze age, you must have access to copper and either tin or arsenic. You must also be able to produce hot enough fires for some creative metalsmith to chance upon the combination. More metalsmiths - possibly just creating jewelry with copper - increase your chances of entering the bronze age. If you have copper / arsenic, you are likely to enter the bronze age sooner than those with tin but not arsenic.(Some copper naturally contains some amount of arsenic, and metalsmiths are likely to notice that copper is stronger, make the connection, and start adding arsenic on purpose.) However, there is an unhealthiness penalty for using arsenic. Copper / tin is thus a more advance bronze-age technology that obsoletes copper / arsenic in civilization that have enough tin. Also, the game should differentiate between surface copper (most likely with more copper down below) and copper that cannot be accessed without substantial digging. Civilizations with surface copper are more likely to beat their neighbors to the bronze age.
Having neighbors / trading partners increases your chances of entering the bronze age. It is possible to skip copper / arsenic and proceed directly to copper / tin, especially if you have neighbors / trading partners / other known civilization who have already entered the bronze age. If a bronze age civilization attacks you, that should dramatically increase your chances of stealing the idea from them sooner rather than later.
In order to enter the Iron age you should have iron ore and the ability create even hotter fires. It's more common than copper. It should be possible to skip the bronze age and enter directly into the iron age. In fact, civilization lacking copper should have a much higher probability of entering the iron age before their bronze age neighbors, since they are looking for a way to compete with said neighbors. Again, if your neighbors / trading partners / enemies have entered the iron age, you are more likely to discover it too.
Don't get either? Well, at least you get to research some advanced stone age techs instead. Aside from their use of Obsidian rather than metals, the Aztecs were quite advanced. You can actually do a fair bit with Obsidian - it can be very hard and sharp. Having a lot of Obsidian, and not knowing any bronze or iron age civilizations, may reduce your chances of making it to the bronze age. Still, Native Americans in the Amazon basin managed to create terra pretta - a sort of manmade, superrich soil - which we still can't do today.
I get rather tired of building the same thing city after city. Buildings should be customizable. For example, building options should be based on what materials you have available - e.g. wood, various stones, concrete, metals, adobe, etc. If you have stone, you get to build stone walls. If not, you can build wooden walls, but for a much lower defensive bonus, subject to replacement if you ever find a source of stone. Building material should impact random events. Wooden buildings are more susceptible to fires, hurricanes, and tornadoes, but more resistant to earthquakes. Stone buildings are more resistant to fires, hurricanes, and tornadoes, but unless they have steel supports, more vulnerable to earthquakes. The size / grandeur of the building should be customizable as well. And why not let cities have patron gods / patron saints for whatever religion / religions are present? Rather than have wonders, being the first to build a really, super grand temple to a particular patron god or saint should be a prerequisite for certain positive random events caused by the awe your people and others feel toward the temple (or whatever). Over time, the grandness required to compete with other civilizations increases.
Rather than giving civilizations leaders with traits, civilizations should acquire traits through their actions. For example, if you focus heavily on culture and your cities, on average, produce a certain amount of culture per turn, you get the creative trait. Neglect culture, and you can lose the trait.
I also think you should have more fine-grained control over your capital city than other cities. In fact, early on, your cities aside from your capital should be almost like other civilizations - sharing your culture but doing their own thing, maybe even attacking you - capturing a portion of you population as slaves or forcing you to pay tribute (but not able to relate to other civilizations except through you). However, as communications improve and your capital becomes more clearly dominant, they fall more under your control - first to acting like vassals, then to allowing you to pick what they build but not assign the citizens to work different tiles / be specialists - and finally to a more fine-grained control. War with another civilization may temporarily unite separatist city-states of your civilization. Still, I think, for the capitol, it would be really great to have extra fine-grained control. Even when nearby cities / cities on your continent are under your relatively complete control, further / overseas cities should automatically be colonies. If they don't revolt and spin off before the invention of better communications technologies and faster travel, they become part of your civilization.
Also, most religions should get along with each other well, except for monotheistic religions. Each monotheistic religion competes with all other religions. Polytheistic religions, Buddhism, Taoism, and Confusionism, have a tendency to merge / coexist relatively peacefully.
I'm not sure how easy it would be to program all that, but I think it would make the game funner / more realistic, even if a bit less balanced.
Regarding horses - say having access to the "horse resource" just gives you the ability to build stables, and the stables are required by any city that does not have free-ranging horses nearby to build horse units.
Speaking of which, agricultural technology could be more detailed. Say "wheat" , rather than being restricted to one tile, is something that grants you access to technologies relating to the cultivation of wheat, and affects the sort of farms you have available - you can put "wheat" farms on any appropriate terrain. And you do get to steal it from neighbors; only need a few seeds, after all.
