Reduction in Citizen Complaint Process Time

[Ashburnham]

Point taken.

Let's just hope it stays that way..

 

[classical_hero]

Point taken.

Let's just hope it stays that way..

I do differ on this. I believe that all polls should be public. Remember that joining this game is voluntary. This would take out some of the risks with people who aren't a citizen from voting, but this would also mean that people could be harassed for the way they vote. If we are going to make all polls public, there must be measure taken to stop abuse, if we don't have rules already to stop that, then we should introduce them.

 

[Ashburnham]

But, that's just the problem. It's impossible to make a rule that says "don't be biased against a certain person" or "don't feel bad about someone who voted against you". There's no way to enforce a rule like that. The best way is to keep polls like that private, so that people can voice their opinions without the fear of reprisal.

 

[Cyc]

Sorry, classical_hero, it always seems to me that you begin a post with one point of view and finish the post with another point of view. You must be a Republican.

I still believe all polls should be public. I made the Trial Poll for DG5CC1 private as the majority of posters here felt that's the way it should be. I took a chance and it seems to have worked out well. I personally want to thank everyone that has voted in the poll thus far.

 

[blackheart]

Sorry, classical_hero, it always seems to me that you begin a post with one point of view and finish the post with another point of view. You must be a Republican.

Don't you mean a certain flip flopping Democrat?

 

[classical_hero]

Sorry, classical_hero, it always seems to me that you begin a post with one point of view and finish the post with another point of view. You must be a Republican.

I still believe all polls should be public.

Very clever. What do you really mean but that? I mean about how I change my view. Anyway, isn't that more a thing that John Kerry would do? Actually, since I am not an American citizen I cannot vote and if I could, I most probably not vote. You should try to think of me as either being a Liberal or a Labor. The party that is called liberal is on the exact opposite side of politics as most political liberals would be, just to confuse people.

Back on topic. There is a way to make a law that has exact punishment on those who voilate this law. I'm not that good thinking too much about legal matters (I prefer to look at things from a philosophical POV). I'm sure there is a way, but first we need to decide if all polls are to be private or not. To flip flop, I say all poll should be private.

 

[Cyc]

Bush flip-flops just as much as Kerry does. They're politicians. They're not supposed to have brains or backbone. I'm totally disgusted with the American political system. But I feel I would even vote for Daffy Duck before I'd re-elect GW Bush.

I don't know if I'd be able to describe exactly what I mean about the opinion reversals you can do in one post. It's like you start out with one opinion and as you continue writing, you morph it into the opposite POV. It's probably just me not reading well enough. I only said it as an observation, not as criticism.

And to be more precise, Public/Private Polling was never the topic of this thread.

 

[donsig]

What is the point of shortening the process? If it is only to ensure that CC's initiated in one term are completed in that term then you are all chasing a wild goose. What ever length of time you set for the completion of a CC one could still be filed close to term end that could not be completed in that term. I have never seen an important reason to complete CC's in the same term they begin. If we are to have faith our judiciary then that faith must carry over from term to term even if the composition of the court changes.

Justice herself is blind and rushing her alomg will only cause her to fall and trip helping none of us.

 

[Cyc]

What is the point of shortening the process? If it is only to ensure that CC's initiated in one term are completed in that term then you are all chasing a wild goose. What ever length of time you set for the completion of a CC one could still be filed close to term end that could not be completed in that term. I have never seen an important reason to complete CC's in the same term they begin. If we are to have faith our judiciary then that faith must carry over from term to term even if the composition of the court changes.

Justice herself is blind and rushing her alomg will only cause her to fall and trip helping none of us.

Well, my intent when shortening the total time of the CC process had nothing to do with CCs bridging one Term to another. At the time of posting this thread, I had no idea that this situation would arise. The fact that the process took 8 days was what brought this about. DaveShack's question initiated my investigation of the subject and I found an 8 day process a little too long (just for GP).

 

[classical_hero]

I don't know if I'd be able to describe exactly what I mean about the opinion reversals you can do in one post. It's like you start out with one opinion and as you continue writing, you morph it into the opposite POV. It's probably just me not reading well enough. I only said it as an observation, not as criticism.

Point taken. Maybe it is just the way I think. I can be destracted quite easily and lost track of what I am trying to say, or sometimes I do get confused as to how to make the point that I lose my focus.

And to be more precise, Public/Private Polling was never the topic of this thread.

Maybe you could start a poll about that. I think the options that would be available are.
1. Keep polls as they are. Public polls are for policy and Private polls are for people (thanks to DZ for that.)
2. All polls should be private.
3. All polls should be public.
So, would we make this a public or a private poll?

Back on Topic. If the time is shortened, what would happen if you needed extra time, would that be possible? What if that is the case all the time, wouldm't this discussion then be a waste of time? I would prefer that the time is not shortened.

 

[Sir Donald III]

Actually... I'm starting to think that there should be a reasonable "length of time" factor for CCs and JRs.

For JRs, having the Last Day of a term be a JR-Free day is good for simplicity. The only difference between that and bringing in the Next Term's Team is only 24 Hours. JRs initiated before the "last day of a term" should be completed by the sitting Court.

For CCs, because of the length, I would tie it to the elections. A good guide is:
If the CC is filed once the Nomination threads are closed, (i.e. during Elections themselves,) the Current Team may have the JR on Merit/No Merit only, the Investigation Thread will not begin until Regular elections AND any Judiciary Runoffs are Resolved, and the Trial Poll will not be posted until the new term "oficially" begins. The said Investigation thread will be conducted by the new Team as opposed to the Old.

If a CC is filed after the Regular Elections are complete, then ALL action should wait until the new Judiciary takes office.

And, if a CC is filed before the Nomiantion threads are closed, then the Curerent/Old team should stick to the CC for its entire duration, even should that duration extend beyond their normal term.

In other words, stick judicial terms to Actions within certain deadlines. Let us not have "Unfinnished business" at the end of each term. Each Judiciary should complete the business that is assigned to them within their Term. As an example, JR19 and CC1 would have been retained by the Term 2 Court, but JRs 20 & 21 and all subsequent Actions would have been taken up by the Term 3 Court.

 

[Cyc]

Two excellent posts in a row. Thanks classical_hero and SD3.

So, would we make this a public or a private poll?

Good question. That ranks right up there with Virgin Mary and the Immaculate Conception.

Back on Topic. If the time is shortened, what would happen if you needed extra time, would that be possible? What if that is the case all the time, wouldm't this discussion then be a waste of time? I would prefer that the time is not shortened.

The times/days I stated were minimal times/days. They could only be achieved if there were no complications and one poll followed its predecessor with out delay. So if more time were needed for any reason, I see no problem taking more time.

In other words, stick judicial terms to Actions within certain deadlines. Let us not have "Unfinnished business" at the end of each term. Each Judiciary should complete the business that is assigned to them within their Term. As an example, JR19 and CC1 would have been retained by the Term 2 Court, but JRs 20 & 21 and all subsequent Actions would have been taken up by the Term 3 Court.

I have no problem with this really, or your entire post. It all works for me. As long as everyone always gets a fair shake in the Judicial process, I'm happy.

 

[Black_Hole]

Bush flip-flops just as much as Kerry does. They're politicians. They're not supposed to have brains or backbone. I'm totally disgusted with the American political system. But I feel I would even vote for Daffy Duck before I'd re-elect GW Bush.

I don't know if I'd be able to describe exactly what I mean about the opinion reversals you can do in one post. It's like you start out with one opinion and as you continue writing, you morph it into the opposite POV. It's probably just me not reading well enough. I only said it as an observation, not as criticism.

And to be more precise, Public/Private Polling was never the topic of this thread.

tsk tsk tsk, and you call yourself an american?
Bush isnt as much of a politican as Kerry is, and he doesnt flip flop nearly as much. Bush is more of a family guy, and most importantly is a republican (come and get me stuck)

Now onto the actual CC buisness,
I do think it would be nice to shorten the CC process, but there is no way we can really without giving justice the full time to work. If we shorten the polls then less people will vote, if we shorten the discussion then less people will have time to voice their opinon, no matter what we shorten it will also hurt the process

edit: a possibility might be somehting like waht SD3 said, but have a rule about no filing CCs(and possibly JRs) x amount of days before the end of the term. Most likely a nice number would be 8 for CCs and 3 for JRs

 

[Sir Donald III]

Well, we shouldn't have a "Blackout" period, especially for CC's. Just make it so that CCs filed during or after an Election and JRs filed afterwards are recorded in the Log and pased to the Next Court. Kind of like:

The Judiciary has received CitName's Request for a JR regarding Mattertype.

However, due to the imminent end of the term, we will have to table this JR as this term's bench will not have the time to compelte it. The JR will be taken up by Next Term's Judiciary.

For the JRs, at least, I would also encourage the incomming CJ to create the new term's thread ASAP so that carried-over JRs (and CCs) can be logged in the "inbox" ASAP.

 

[Strider]

Citizen Complaints SHOULD NOT be reduced in time, if anything it should take longer. To make it shorter would be unfair to both the defendent and prosecution.

 

[Cyc]

For the JRs, at least, I would also encourage the incomming CJ to create the new term's thread ASAP so that carried-over JRs (and CCs) can be logged in the "inbox" ASAP.

Well, I can see having the next Term's Judicial thread setup completely a day before the Term begins, but I believe if it was setup anytime before that, some Justices may feel the need to write Judicial Reviews before their Term started. I don't thinkthere's any need to rush this.

 

[Cyc]

Citizen Complaints SHOULD NOT be reduced in time, if anything it should take longer. To make it shorter would be unfair to both the defendent and prosecution.

Holy cow! A post that's very much on topic! Call 911. "Ethel, I'm coming..." :suicide:

 

[Black_Hole]

Citizen Complaints SHOULD NOT be reduced in time, if anything it should take longer. To make it shorter would be unfair to both the defendent and prosecution.

if it takes any longer it will end of being 10-15 days, it could end up being half a month
this will just make the argueing go on longer and longer, i really thing it could be slightly shortened, but unless we revamp the system there is no way to really do this