[Religion and Revolution]: Interesting Graphics / Features we might use

[raystuttgart]

I am currently experimenting / wildly working on protoype features.
One of those features I call "Wild Animals in Water".

For that feature I am using graphics from Saibotlieh (and others).

However, I am not really happy with the outcome so far.
Logic (or AI) is not my problem but I am a bit disappointed with the graphical aspect.

I mean, the graphics I have found are fantastic but ingame the great graphics of the water animals are hardly visible due to the water surface ...
(When these Water Animals fight you see a bit more.)

I have posted some screenshots of the Humpback Whale from Saibotlieh, so you can see the differences.
(The scaling / sizes does not fit yet and most pedia entries are also still missing.)

NifScope: The Graphics look awesome.
Colopedia: The Graphics still look good.
Ingame: Hardly anything is to be recognized. (Exept during fights.)

I wonder if there is anything that could be done so more of these wonderful graphics can be seen ingame ...

 

[Androrc the Orc]

I am currently experimenting / wildly working on protoype features.
One of those features I call "Wild Animals in Water".

For that feature I am using graphics from Saibotlieh (and others).

However, I am not really happy with the outcome so far.
Logic (or AI) is not my problem but I am a bit disappointed with the graphical aspect.

I mean, the graphics I have found are fantastic but ingame the great graphics of the water animals are hardly visible due to the water surface ...
(When these Water Animals fight you see a bit more.)

I have posted some screenshots of the Humpback Whale from Saibotlieh, so you can see the differences.
(The scaling / sizes does not fit yet and most pedia entries are also still missing.)

NifScope: The Graphics look awesome.
Colopedia: The Graphics still look good.
Ingame: Hardly anything is to be recognized. (Exept during fights.)

I wonder if there is anything that could be done so more of these wonderful graphics can be seen ingame ...

It seems to me that one major cause of this is that the Civ4Col sea texture is darker than the Civ4 sea texture, making it harder to see underwater portions of the creature. This isn't an issue in the Civilopedia because it uses Civ4's sea texture.

Other than that, one alternative is to make a greater portion of the whale's body be overwater.

 

[orlanth]

It seems to me that one major cause of this is that the Civ4Col sea texture is darker than the Civ4 sea texture, making it harder to see underwater portions of the creature. This isn't an issue in the Civilopedia because it uses Civ4's sea texture.

Other than that, one alternative is to make a greater portion of the whale's body be overwater.

I extracted the water.dds from the Civ4 fpk and tried it, it didn't look like that made a big difference but I'm not sure I suppose it may be because Civ4Col uses better shaders to get the nice sparkling effects on water surfaces, that simply means things underneath are a bit harder to see. I agree it could work to elevate the nif if you want more visible above the waves (in nifskope, open the first NiNode then select Translation and increase Z). But OTOH it'll be realistic if they're submerged much of the time and more visible when they fight, so that's not bad

 

[raystuttgart]

But OTOH it'll be realistic if they're submerged much of the time and more visible when they fight, so that's not bad

Well yes, that is true.

I was just a bit disappointed, when I compared how the graphics looked in the ingame screenshots from Civ4 and ingame with Civ4Col ...

I will simply continue working on the logic.
(I don't want to change the water graphics and I am not a graphics specialist anyways.)

I guess the other modders will forgive if my features are not perfect from a graphical perspective.

 

[Androrc the Orc]

I extracted the water.dds from the Civ4 fpk and tried it, it didn't look like that made a big difference but I'm not sure I suppose it may be because Civ4Col uses better shaders to get the nice sparkling effects on water surfaces, that simply means things underneath are a bit harder to see. I agree it could work to elevate the nif if you want more visible above the waves (in nifskope, open the first NiNode then select Translation and increase Z). But OTOH it'll be realistic if they're submerged much of the time and more visible when they fight, so that's not bad

Nice that you tested it out You didn't need to take Civ4's water texture though, Civ4Col already has it, but it only appears if the map wraps. And I agree with you on your last point.

 

[raystuttgart]

Hi guys,

I present the Orca.
(I did not create the graphics myself but found them in Caveman 2Cosmos.)

It does not have animations, but it is working well otherwise.
(I still need to work on details like balancing, sizing / scaling, pedia, ... )

Also the logic (DLL) of the feature is still heavily in work.

 

[raystuttgart]

And here goes the Great White Shark.
(Again, I did not create the graphics myself but found them in Caveman 2 Cosmos.)

It does not have animations, but it is working well otherwise.
(I still need to work on details like balancing, sizing / scaling, pedia, ... )

 

[raystuttgart]

I am trying to create the animal Anaconda.
(The graphics are again from Caveman 2 Cosmos.)

I am using the graphics from the Screenshot, but the game is crashing every time I try to place an Anaconda ingame.
(Colopedia isn't working either.)

I currently simply can't figure out, what goes wrong.
I am almost sure, that it is some problem with the .nif.

Edit:
I have attached the graphics.
Maybe somebody can take a look.

 

[AbsintheRed]

Both the orca and the shark are way too big
You should rescale them
Also, are you sure that sharks should be threats to ships?
Whales are orcas are potentially okay, I'm not so sure about sharks

 

[raystuttgart]

Both the orca and the shark are way too big

I know.
As I already said, I haven't taken care of the scaling yet.
(That is details, I will do later on.)

Also, are you sure that sharks should be threats to ships?

They are not. (They have only 1 Point Strength.)
The only Ship they will attack is the very weak Fishing Boat.

 

[AbsintheRed]

I know.
As I already said, I haven't taken care of the scaling yet.
(That is details, I will do later on.)



They are not. (They have only 1 Point Strength.)
The only Ship they will attack is the very weak Fishing Boat.

Oh, okay, then everything sounds great!

 

[raystuttgart]

I present the Alligator.
(Again, I have found the graphics in Caveman 2 Cosmos.)

It does not have animations, but it is working well otherwise.
(I still need to work on details like balancing, sizing / scaling, pedia, ... )

 

[raystuttgart]

And here we go with the Jaguar.
(Again, I have found the graphics in Caveman 2 Cosmos.)

This time it does have animations (of Panther).
(I still need to work on details like balancing, sizing / scaling, pedia, ... )

I would like to have another button though ...

 

[raystuttgart]

And here we have the Lynx.
(Again, I have found the graphics in Caveman 2 Cosmos.)

It does not have animations.
(I still need to work on details like balancing, sizing / scaling, pedia, ... )

This time, movement looks really ugly because of the missing animations ...
(Trying to use animations of Panther causes CTD.)

Edit:
I have attached the graphics so maybe somebody could take a look.

 

[raystuttgart]

And here we go with the Cougar.
(This time I have found the graphics in JAnmials.)

This time it does have animations (of Panther) again.
(I still need to work on details like balancing, sizing / scaling, pedia, ... )

Maybe the graphics could need some improvements.
(I'd also like to have a better button.)

 

[Willi_Tell]

Will gaining Combat Experience Points from fighting animals be limited?
In Civ4, EP gained from fighting Barbarians is limited to max. 10 EP. For RaR, I would even propose a limit of 5 EP (means 2 promotions) from fighting vs. animals.

I'm asking this because the (surviving) Natives can otherwise gain some really dangerous promotions very early and easy - and this may cause serious impact in behalf of combat balance.

Spoiler :

As mentioned (and already implemented) by Ray, I did an overhaul on promotions not long time ago.
Thereby one of my main intentions was making it harder for the native to raid European Colonies. As an example: "City Raider I-III" was replaced by "Close Combat I-III". So Natives will no longer have any combat bonus against cities, but they can be quite strong against gun-/melee-units in the countyside when owning these tree new promotions.

IMHO it is already not a piece of cake for the Europeans to win against regular Native Warriors in high numbers. Highly promoted Natives would simply trash the Europeans back to the Sea...

 

[raystuttgart]

I'm asking this because the (surviving) Natives can otherwise gain some really dangerous promotions very early and easy - and this may cause serious impact in behalf of combat balance.

Natives and Animals won't fight each other.

Otherwise almost all animals will be killed before you meet them.
(Animals will be relatively rare and their max number is limited by the map.)

Just wait a bit until I have finished my feature.
(I still have some coding ahead. )

I will introduce and explain the feature then.

At the moment I first need to get all the graphics working.
(As I said, the logic is not the problem for me.)

 

[raystuttgart]

And the last 4 for now.
(I have enough Animals for the different Terrains now.)

Wolf, Grizzly, Polar Bear and Black Bear.
(Taken from JAnmials.)

They have animations and also otherwise work perfectly.

I would have liked to use the much better looking graphics for bears from Caveman 2 Cosmos, but they all don't have animations ...
(It will probably already be a hard fight to get the help needed for the other missing animations.)

 

[Schmiddie]

Is there an easy way to remove all animals from the game for those who don't like animals?

 

[raystuttgart]

Is there an easy way to remove all animals from the game for those who don't like animals?

I implement it as Game Options.
(One for land animals, one for sea animals)

But if you wanted to totally remove them, you could also delete the XML for Units and UnitClasses of the animals.
(No animals would be spawned anymore, no matter what you select for the Game Options.)

Edit:

It is still the choice of the team if this feature will get part of the public Religion and Revolution.
I will do nothing else than implement it in my private version and offer it to the team, once it is finished.
If the team does not like the feature, that is no problem.