Revising the polling standards

[DaveShack]

Let's not have any artificial boundries on what can be changed by this effort. If it touches both Con and CoL then we can deal with that.

 

[Cyc]

ZZZzzz...

*yawn* Twenty posts later.....

So. What have we learned? Anyone care to recap the progress in THIS thread?

Haven't we discusssed this before? Is an Official poll binding? Can an Official bind a poll? Are Official pole bindings bound to be bettter?

Sounds to me like we're just as close to the 2 or three main subjects in this debate as we were 6 Demogames ago.

What's the deal?

 

[donsig]

• Contrary to common belief, it is quite possible to make a decision without using a poll. The criteria for deciding something without a poll is a clear preponderance of public opinion for a particular course of action.
• A poll does not have to be "posted by an official" to be binding.
• The last poll on a subject supercedes previous polls on the same subject.
• Despite appearances, any poll which is biased, incorrectly stated, or improperly interpreted cannot be binding. Saying a poll is binding is not enough to make it binding. The people must be able to make an informed decision, implying they must have enough information available to make the decision, and the information for the decision must be current. This also means that changes in circumstances or information ought to render existing binding decisions non-binding, or at least priompt their reconsideration.
• Polls may not be used contrary to other provisions of the rules. In particular, an amendment is the only way to change the law and a JR is the only way to interpret a law.

I would be very happy to have us replace the current wording (referendum and initiative) with a cleaned up version of the above principles.

Why change the words? They crux of the issue is to decide if there should be any distinction at all between polls posted by officials and those posted by citizens. It would appear that you are arguing there should be no difference. I can live with that - we validate or invalidate each poll based on the poll itself and not who posted it - and we do not have one set of standards for officials and another for citizens.

I agree with the first point on your list and I think our constitution doe sa good job of making this clear - but the role of opinion polls is murky. In my reading of the constitution, an opinoin poll is a decison and therefore binding (unless a higher decision form is used afterward).

I also agree with the second point. In my reading of the constitution this point is very clear since citizen initiatives (which can't be posted by officials) trump any other decision. We definately need to insert the word *binding* into this constitutional clause to clarify things.

I agree with the third point and think the constitution makes this point clear.

I agree with point four but don't think we should put too much about this in the constitution, other than that polls should be fair and clearly written, etc. Specific polling standards are difficult to write and so should be in the CoL or even lower form of law since they will most likely need to be revised. The idea of having an official validate polls is ok but I think we've vested too much power in the Censor. The idea of pre-certifying a poll (sort of like we do with amendments and the judiciary) is a good one.

I agree with the first sentence of point five. I do not agree that the judiciary is the sole means of interpreting our laws. Citizens should be able to ensure a binding interpretation or clarification via a citizen's initiative. This game has shown that the judiciary has its limits and cannot always be depended upon to render a decision.

 

[Eklektikos]

What's the deal?

That disagreements over the polling process are the CFC Demogame's very own equivalent to death and taxes?

 

[ravensfire]

Sorry folks, we hit a deadline at work and were NOT READY for it. Needless to say, much burning of the midnight oil commenced. Sorry - I was really hoping to continue this in a timely manner.

I am, however, back, and will continue this.

As I departed into the realm known as Overtime, I was going to post a poll about the scope of private/public poll. That poll will go up now, as described in my earlier post (first option).

-- Ravensfire

 

[ravensfire]

The second poll has been posted!

In addition, a discussion post on official vs binding has been posted to start discussion on that issue.

-- Ravensfire

 

[ravensfire]

Reminder note added for citizen's poll vs official's poll discussion. Can an official post a citizen's poll in an area they govern? Should there be a distinction between those two polls? Should there be any limitations on when a Citizen's poll can be posted (ie - poll of last resort when official rebuffs)?

-- Ravensfire