[NFP] RNDY, and its change on NFP

[Lily_Lancer]

The RNDY will grant a naval unit upon built.

The problem is, which unit will it grant?

It is said that it provide the "strongest" unit you can build. The rule is the following:

1: It grants the unit with the highest combat strength, ignorant of resource limits. It looks ranged strength for ranged units and melee strength for melee units.

2: When multiple units have the same strength, it grants the unit with the largest range. So it always grants a ranged unit if you can build both melee and ranged units of the same strength. It'll grant missile cruiser if nuclear submarine is also available.

In NFP, the melee navy gets enhanced, causing some changes.
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1: Now it'll give you trireme if you're also able to build quadrireme. Before it gives you quadrireme.

2: Now it'll give you caravel if you're also able to build Sea Dog. Before it gives you Sea Dog.

 

[Sostratus]

Naval units are a total disaster and they have never had a coherent vision of what they are supposed to do outside of exist for the sake of having them.
The way they applied resource consumption to them also flies in the face of balance (they provide little utility for that cost.)

Personally i think the RNDY should just pick a ship class (naval melee probably) and stick with giving you that, like how the hippo works.

 

[kaspergm]

Naval units are a total disaster and they have never had a coherent vision of what they are supposed to do outside of exist for the sake of having them.

The idea of "melee" and "ranged" naval units is a real thorn in my eye. I think things would work much better if naval unis in early game are only melee, and then once cannons are invented they get the option to do both ranged and melee attack. (Not sure if this could be modded - could one steel the code from the Immortal here?)

 

[Sostratus]

The idea of "melee" and "ranged" naval units is a real thorn in my eye. I think things would work much better if naval unis in early game are only melee, and then once cannons are invented they get the option to do both ranged and melee attack. (Not sure if this could be modded - could one steel the code from the Immortal here?)

You can absolutely add ranged attacks actions to otherwise melee units while maintaining the melee action. I have modded a ship this way before.

In loose Civ terms there are 4 Major jobs for the navy:

1. Killing ships on the open water
2. Killing land units
3. Attacking coastal cities
4. Protecting or pillaging trade/coastal improvements

The only reason to do #1 is to be free to engage in 2-4. Galleys and Quadriremes that aren't byzantine are wholly incapable of #2. #3 is very difficult without frigates or battleships. #4 is irrelevant since Civ6 economies are hydrophobic.

Anyways, I don’t mind that we have 3 classes of naval units but their strength in relation to each other is all over the place. I would prefer if it was more defined and resource usage brought in line with both that and the actual utility of a navy in this game. Is using 1 unit of oil on a missile cruiser worth giving up a modern armor? Etc.
Personally I think it should be a semi triangle where naval melee loses to ranged, which loses to raider, which loses to melee. However, only ranged would use resources (except maybe the ironclad using iron for the aesthetic) and in exchange it would sort of be the best ship, sort of like how Knights beat up everyone else.
Ranged would also be markedly more expensive to maintain and build.
Maybe you don’t need 3 kinds of ships but I do think with capital ships you need a production efficient counter.
None of that matters though since you need to get people to make navies in the first place.

 

[The googles do nothing]

The one advantage Land Melee has over ranged is that it can take cities. Naval that doesn't really matter because Land Units at sea can attack and take cities.