Scenario: Build no military, wait to be invaded

[cabert]

Ok, good tale so far!
I agree on the tech trading, in fact cyrus often does trade tech, isn't he?
IMHO you can even initiate the trade.

Too bad the small chinese city didn't flip yet (it would give you one good soldier!). Try to build up some culture in tarsus, since you put the bomb there! How about temples/monasteries?

 

[jerVL/kg]

1510AD: According to the Foreign Advisor, everybody we've met now knows everybody else, except Peter & Sally haven't met yet. Monty has dropped to Cautious, for some odd reason. We may have hope of invasion yet!

Sally is still Annoyed, and has a 2nd caravel in the water sniffing us out. Maybe he's the one to invade us? He's up on tech, but dead last in points, and probably needs more land...

Mao now has Alpha, but will only trade chump change for Lit. Didn't know Literature was worth only 200 beakers!! Monty is down Theo now, dunno why that didn't appear before! Everyone has Civil Service but us.

Mao says ho ho ho, he has Cho-Ku-No. Oh yeah? Then how come I haven't seen one yet, eh Mao?

Bactra's about to grow, so whip Courthouse (was due in 7) Costs 2 pop, but whatever.

WE'RE IN SECOND PLACE NOW!!!

1520AD: 2nd Silk Plantation now online, but Mao doesn't want it. He must have his own supply. Initiate trade 6gp => Ivory, so he can invade us with more War Elephants. Cash flow is now back in the green!! (112/+1)

Still...we wanna get started on Spiral Minaret ASAP, so raise science to 70%, Divine Right now due in 3 turns. (Susa will finish Market & grow in 3 turns, too.) Cash flow 112/-24, but we'll be able to ease back next turn, or the next.

Gordium needs production BADLY...but choose to build cottage instead. Worker being shipped w/ extra warrior to start on a mine.

Monty has Theology now!

1530AD: Hinduism, of all things, spreads in Sidon. Pers queues up Jewish Missionary, followed by Hindu Missionary.

1540AD: A Persian Revolt has taken place in Hangzhou!


It's about freakin' time, guys!! They don't flip, though.

We can drop science down to 60%, DR still in 1, cash flow 66/-7.

1550AD: Divine Right is in. Start Compass, due in 3 turns @ 50% science, 59/+4. I'm gonna leave it alone for now.

Susa starts Spiral Minaret, due in 23 turns...God knows if we'll make it!!

Speaking of which...Monty & Peter don't have DR yet. Mao & Sally do, God knows for how long. I'll bet most of them have Nationalism by now, or at least are working on it.

Spices connected! We are soooo happy now!!

 

[jerVL/kg]

1560AD: Mikhail Lomonosov (who the hell?) is born in Persepolis. We've got a Chinese caravel in the waters, too:



None of our cities are making enough beakers to justify an Academy yet, but Micky will teach us Phillosophy. Which makes me think...we need new civics. BADLY.

And since nobody's bugged us to trade DR yet, I'm gonna have to break the rules AGAIN and take the initiative...ok. Trades made:

PETER = Divine Right for Civil Service / Drama / 60gp
MONTY = Divine Right for Feudalism / Metal Casting (couldn't get his gold)
MAO = Literature for 140gp, all he will give us.
Micky discovers Philosophy.

REVOLT TO: Bureaucracy, Serfdom, Pacifism (hey, it suits us!) Upkeep drops from 34 to 30 gold! Hit enter...

1570AD: Mao dials us up immediately and asks for Open Borders. Of course I decline, but...since this *does* count as an AI-initiated trade, I ask to negotiate. Turns how he doesn't have Philosophy!! Trade it +20gp for...Machinery! YAY, WINDMILLS! And WATERMILLS! And...that's about it.

I don't wanna alarm anyone, but.........





WE ARE NOW IN FIRST PLACE!!!!!!!!

Unfortunately, I bollocksed up good here.
Totally forgot, Organized Religion gives us Missionaries w/o Monasteries. (JM in Pers got cancelled.) More importantly...it gives us +25% building bonus. Doesn't matter for most of our core cities, but Spiral Minaret is now due in 30 turns (was 22) and our low producing cities which are building Courthouses, have gone from 40 to 60 turns.

So I'm gonna have to reload last save & try again. Won't cost us anything, of course. We also have LOTS of new stuff to build, thanks to all our new techs! Forges...Theatres...even Angkor Wat if we want it! So, no biggie.

But that's the end of tonight's turnset. I did get Oblivion today, but haven't opened it, because it's the Collector's Edition which was twice the price of the regular edition, and says it comes with a 112-page Pocket Guide to Tamriel (plus some extra stuff I don't care about...ooh, a coin!) I check w/ my friends to see if the *regular* edition also has the guide, but none of them have bought it yet. What's wrong with those people??!?

However...Oblivion is very tempting. I just might say hell with it, and crack open the box, and see what's inside. And if you don't hear from me for several weeks...well, you'll know what happened.

So just in case, I'm posting the savegame as well. Hard to believe, but this game is actually winnable, despite lack of military...we could easily raise a decent standing army, if need be. Feh! Monarch ain't so tough...

NOTE: The save is from one turn earlier, before I made that stupid civic swap. (at least, I hope so)

Have fun with it, guys! And I promise, I will TRY to get another turnset in tomorrow!! I promise, I'll try!

Seeya later!

 

[jerVL/kg]

Ok, good tale so far!
I agree on the tech trading, in fact cyrus often does trade tech, isn't he?
IMHO you can even initiate the trade.

Yeah, well as you will read, I've violated that rule numerous times already.

Too bad the small chinese city didn't flip yet (it would give you one good soldier!). Try to build up some culture in tarsus, since you put the bomb there! How about temples/monasteries?

I haven't been paying attention to Tarsus, though I should. Still needs cottages/mines plus some infrastructure. Got theaters now, so Culture should now rise dramatically! Dunno if it's enough for a Culture Victory, may be too late for that, but we'll see...

As for the Chinese city...it's gonna flip any minute now...but I've got an archer/warrior combo all ready to replace the garrison, and whatever "good" soldier we get from them will be deleted. However, I *might* change my mind...

Like I was saying, this game is now eminently winnable. None of our neighbors seem hellbent on invading us, and we could raise a *real* army quickly if we want to. I'm almost thinking, that might be the way to go.

But I think I'll wait for the horns of war to sound before working on any extra military, at least for the moment. After all, this is an important experiment!

 

[cabert]

for the time being, you've seen that when
*isolated,
* with closed borders, and
* no aggressive actions,
you don't get invaded too soon.

Now is the time to choose a way :
* diplomatic? I don't think so (you're pretty alone and not that big)
* cultural? too late maybe, don't know quick speed datelines
* conquest? heeee, didn't you say you wanted to be pacific??? anyway, too hard to make it from there
* domination? could be done, but not pacifically. Want to try a go with a settler near the others?
* time? seems absurd (one AI will find the way to space before that)
leaves Space as sole possible victory. And i think you may make a try for this.

 

[jerVL/kg]

for the time being, you've seen that when
*isolated,
* with closed borders, and
* no aggressive actions,
you don't get invaded too soon.

This is true. I've also noticed that closing off borders prevented Sally & Mao from making contact until very late. Didn't hurt Mao, but Sally got P3WND.

Of course now, with caravels (who don't respect OB) sniffing our port cities...they're probably thinking, "WTH?? This empire is guarded by ARCHERS?!? It'll be so eeeasy to steamroll them over!"

Now is the time to choose a way :
* diplomatic? I don't think so (you're pretty alone and not that big)
* cultural? too late maybe, don't know quick speed datelines

Diplo would be tough, we'd have to start buttering up our rivals, which means Open Borders, Defensive Pacts, paying tribute etc...we might just build the UN, to see what happens. Mao is likely #2, and he doesn't seem to be well liked yet.

As for Cultural...well, I've never actually TRIED to win by Culture, it's always happened by accident. I do know, for Cultural, you need multiple religions for those +50% Cathedrals, more than 2 certainly. Plus, you need to build a helluva lot more Wonders than we've managed. We can take a stab at it, but it will be rough going.

* conquest? heeee, didn't you say you wanted to be pacific??? anyway, too hard to make it from there
* domination? could be done, but not pacifically. Want to try a go with a settler near the others?

Wasn't there a "Cuban Isolationists" succession game that suddenly transformed into a Conquest Victory? Anyhow, don't think *I* personally have time to start waging war on ppl, takes WAY too much time, but if someone else wants a go at it...as for sending out more settlers, that kinda violates the isolationist/pacific mindset. Maybe if there's some unclaimed land not too far away...but I doubt there is. We'll need galleons anyway, and that's at least 2 techs away, down an entirely different path than what we're following.

* time? seems absurd (one AI will find the way to space before that)
leaves Space as sole possible victory. And i think you may make a try for this.

Space Race is disabled. I got sick of every game turning into a freakin' Space Race, so I disable it every time now. So Time might be the way to go! (I've yet to win that way, anyway.)

 

[jerVL/kg]

Speaking of invasion...I wonder if the AI takes into account what techs you know, when they're looking at your military? They might see archers & warriors, but know we could upgrade to longbows/maces/spearmen at any time....

I know for a fact, there have been times when I scouted out a country guarded only by longbows & pikes, only to see them magically upgrade to muskets & grenadiers when my troops finally marched in!

 

[cabert]

oups for space race

at least you'll know WHEN you finally get invaded...

 

[siberfox]

1560AD: Mikhail Lomonosov (who the hell?) is born in Persepolis.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mikhail_Lomonosov

BTW, very nice story

 

[jerVL/kg]

Ok guys, the next set of turns is complete. However, I have about 80 screenshots to wade through (finally found a way to SS the trade window, it's cumbersome but workable) and there are quite a few action-packed turns to write up...no, we didn't get invaded, but I think we increased the possibility by at least a small amount! Anyway, it might not be until tomorrow before I start posting the turns, but I'll do what I can to get at least *something* done tonight. We also finally know where all the other civs are!!!

And no, I haven't opened Oblivion yet.

 

[jerVL/kg]

Ok, here we go. First, the goals for this session.

1) Trade for as many techs as we can, as fast as we can. Yeah, it's against the rules, but we need to backfill. Might as well reach for tech parity while we still can.

2) Try, at least, to build SOME semblance of a military force. Again, violates the rules, in fact goes against the whole point of this experiment -- but with Aggressive AI's sniffing our borders, we at least want them to think twice before attacking. We don't have to go nuts, just a few more Immortals (which I'm pretty sure are obsolete already, but we can still make 'em) and perhaps some War Elephants & Catapults...we do have ivory after all!

3) Finish the Spiral Minaret, research Nationalism & try to grab the Taj Mahal before anyone else. With luck, we'll pop a GE in Susa and rush it (though the chances are very low.) We also need to get Paper ASAP, so we can trade maps and see what the world actually looks like!

Ok. First, to fix that civics snafu. Research: TIME TRAVEL 2, due in -1 turns. RELOAD....

 

[jerVL/kg]

1560AD: (eerie music...swirls of mist...faces of old men transforming into babies...Captain Sulu, did the reverse thrusters fire?)

Yawn, stretch. Feel like I was here yesterday What was I doing? Oh yeah, civics. Swap to Bureaucracy/Serfdom...but leave Organized Religion alone. Call me crazy, but somehow I think we need the building bonus more than the GPP points. REVOLT...

1570AD: And then something happened that The One Ring did not intend...helloooo, Nappy!!



I'm surprised, coulda sworn it would be Louis XIV. Probably for the best, because otherwise I would have had to resist the urge to immediately muster an invasion force and crush that smug bastard off the face of the globe. Of course, Nappy's not much better...I always like to wipe out his puny civilization, usually late in the game when I'm feeling bored and want some action. But with Louis, it's personal. (Long story.)

Louis has Music, HR, Compass, Machinery & Construction. He's down Theo, so I immediately make a straight trade of Theology = Construction. Yay, we can cross rivers now! Except we have no rivers to cross!

This is interesting...apparently, Peter declared war on Nappy at some point:



This is the sort of thing that's both intriguing and irritating about the game. All these civilizations on far-flung continents, engaging in their own trade relations and their own battles, and we know nothing about it until we meet them, and even them we don't know much. Like, the time I discovered a new continent with Frederick, Julius Caesar and Genghis Khan. Frederick was at war with Genghis, in fact was systematically wiping his empire off the face of the map, crushing one city after another. What started the war? What words were spoken? Was it deliberate, or was it over a mere misunderstanding?

No matter. I renegotiate the trade w/Sally, now 4gp for cattle. Check the Foreign Advisor -- apparently due to our rampant tech trading, Sally now has a -4 "traded with worst enemy" penalty with EVERYONE! Everyone is Cautious with us, except Sally of course. Monty, strangely enough, is Pleased with everyone except us & Sally (Cautious). Nappy is Pleased with Monty & Peter (strange that last one, considering Peter declared war on him) and hasn't met Mao & Sally yet. Peter's Pleased w/Monty & Nappy, Cautious w/Mao & us, hasn't met Sally yet.

Do lots of micromanagement and mess with the build queue in all cities (wrote it all down, but too tired to type it all out right now...gotta finish this and get some sleep!!) Manage our cash flow to break even @ 272gp.

Oh yeah, don't forget the Philo/Machinery trade with Mao:



(So glad I finally figured out how to SS that!)

Give everything another look-over, everything looks good, close eyes and hit ENTER...

 

[jerVL/kg]

1580AD: Right off the bat, Nappy demands tribute. (220 gold, I think it was...messed up the SS.) We politely say thanks, but no. Don't hit your ass on the way out the door. Nappy's upset, but still only Cautious:



Decide we need Forges, in Susa & in Persepolis. Still 22 turns from the Spiral Minaret, but a Forge will speed that up by at least a turn. We're again #1 over Mao, 1255 points to 1227. Cash flow 272/-2 @ 50% science.

Sidon worker is finish...pair workers into teams of 2 to get things done more efficiently. (I always do this by mid-game...does anyone else?)

1590AD: Monty asks for open borders again. Of course I decline, but decide to open the trade window to see what -- Aw, CRUD!!!!!



Someone PLEASE tell me if that's a bug or not...

Lots of civs swap to Vassalage and/or Theocracy. Are they ganging up on us? That would be so cool!! Like the time I paid off all my buddies to crush Mansa Musa, just for fun. So many units on the field, from so many armies, it looked like an MMORPG! Then I did it again in another game. WHEEEEE!!! Here's your freakin' spaceship, Mansa! RIGHT UP YOUR BEHIND!!

Speaking of which, I am soooo glad Mansa isn't in this game. I don't mind him so much as others, but he's been in every single game I've played (except the one where *I* was Mansa) and it's a relief to not have to deal with him. I'm actually regretting disabling Space Victory -- we could totally cruise to that Spaceship. (Is there a way to reset it mid-game? A cheat, perhaps?)

1600AD: Tarsus, of all things, is building a CROSSBOW. How the hell did that happen?? Oh yeah...I had queued an archer for Hangzhou, but forgot Machinery obsoletes archers. Great. Now we're down an archer, and there's nothing we can do about it. In the scientific field, this would invalidate the experiment and they would cancel all funding immediately.

There's no hammers in the xbow yet, though, so I happily cancel & queue up Theatre (1) / Harbor (3) / Forge (8). Think about doing the forge 1st, but we need the health. And theatres only take 1 turn?? Oh yeah...Creative. Nice trait, that. Usually theatres are always the first thing I build!

Nappy's caravel is sniffing our flank, so is Sally. Mao & Peter sniffing at the north. I don't see an Aztec caravel anywhere. He must have finished the Roadblock.





Somehow, I mistakenly cancelled the Jewish Missionary in Pers! Queue it to the top again, will only take one turn. Susa & Pers forges will complete simultaneously now.

1610AD: Angkor Wat is BIADL. (Turns out it's Russia.)

Notice for the first time time that Persepolis has turned into a hammer MONSTER:



Well, that's Bureaucracy for ya. Strange, how Bureaucracy in the game makes things actually happen faster. Isn't that unrealistic? Shouldn't it be the other way 'round?

Speaking of "round"...

1620AD:


PETER HAS WON THE AMAZING CARAVEL RACE!!!!! Way to go, Peter!!! You are the official winner of ONE! MILLION! DOLLARS!!

(Peter hugs his barren wife, then tearfully tells Phil Keoghan and all the other contestants: "This experience was so amazing, it really opened our eyes to new cultures and new ideas, and made us think of options that we never thought were possible, but now, all I gotta say is...ADOPTION, HERE WE COME!")

(Meanwhile, Monty bitterly tells The Early Show that CBS must have paid off the AA pilot to open the door and let Team Peter on the same plane as them, just so they'd have an exciting finish...too bad Monty, you might as well admit that your Reality TV career is all but over, you flash-in-the-pan wannabe.)

In other news, The Hagia Sofia is BIADL (China, of all places.) I had queued it up in Susa (switched Spiral Minaret to Pers, which can finish in 11 turns now) but now I realize, yeah, I was kidding myself about that one.

Check trades...now Mao is WFYABTA. Peter will trade, but we have nothing to offer. Sally is still our worst enemy.

Hit ENTER...

[NOTE: I just realized most of the Screenshots aren't cropped yet. I'll have to fix that before continuing, but will likely fall asleep before finished, so...STAY TUNED EVERYONE!]

 

[jerVL/kg]

(Had a dream last night that all of Mao's empire was overrun by barbarian cities. Then we took over, but Toku invaded and destroyed all of us. Kinda weird, since Toku isn't in this game. Then I was at the Hollywood Hilton, covered in 2 dozen hot Playboy Playmates, who...uhh, maybe I shouldn't share that part. Anyhow, here's the rest of the turnset, which I'm posting as the laundry washes my bedsheets.)

1630AD: Out of the blue, Sally decides to imitate Marlon Brando:



Since it's my experience that an offer phrased like this, especially with an Annoyed AI, is a one-time deal that must be accepted now or we'll lose it, I agree. Hey, he's offering gold at least. Sure enough, opening the trade window later shows he still won't trade bubkiss with us -- "worst enemy" and all that.

Monty's caravel is back, sniffing at Susa now:



Someone asked me once, "If you're on an island, and you're building a military defense, how do you know where your weak point is?" I told 'em, "If there's an AI unit stationed right outside your city, or an enemy caravel just sitting in the waters...THAT is your weak point." Now, I ask myself...what does it mean when there's caravels hanging out by every city in your empire??

Nappy asks for OB, we decline of course. He's not WFYABTA yet, thankfully.

Forgot to mention earlier that we ran a deficit for several turns while researching Nationalism. Now drop science back to 50% (508/+3; might as well start building a bank account) and Nat is due in 7 -- all in all, we saved 1 turn by running a deficit for a little while.

1640AD: Monty & Nappy still sniffing about. Count the food tiles at Bactra and decide they need a windmill, instead of a mine. Build one. Workers irrigate the rice at Sidon, while others build a watermill for Arbela & improve the road network. Bactra is now Jewified...all of our cities are Jewish now.

Decide we really do need a 2nd galley after all, so Susa starts one.

1650AD: Mao, at last, is working to connect the sugar that we bollocksing missed:



Bactra starts forge. Still very low producing town, will take awhile. Borders pop, but doesn't catch extra fish & ivory yet. We'll get there. Monty now has Nationalism, and everyone but us has Music. Cavalry will be landing any day now!!

1655AD: MONTY DEMANDS TRIBUTE! Well, it's about time, Monty!!



It's a measely 120 gold, and under normal circumstances I'd say yes, just to get him off my back...but, rules are rules. Thanks Monty, but no. BTW did you at least get a cameo in that Mel Gibson movie about your life?

Spiral Minaret is VERY close to finishing, so I move workers to the forests at Pers for emergency chopping, if needed. I really, really don't want to chop those forests, though...Pers is working both of them for hammers, and the city's at the health limit too. Plus, they are both suitably located for an invading army to hide in, so we gotta leave 'em there, folks!

Great Person due in Susa next turn!!

1660AD: Well, it's about FREAKIN' TIME...Hangzhou FINALLY flips to us!!!



We inherit...a longbow. Great, just...great. Decide to swap him with the archer in Tarsus; but now the experiment's results will be truly suspect, since we have nine cities but only 8 archers to guard them. We do have that extra warrior, though, so he guards Hangzhou as well. BTW, here's what the Hangzhou city screen looks like:



Wow! I mean, look at all that...NOTHING!! Jesus Christ, Mao, couldn't you have at least built, ya know, a lighthouse or something??

The badly wounded garrison, meanwhile, waits on the edge of our closed borders for the galley to take them home...or the sweet angel of death...whichever. (How'd they get injured anyway? Was it all the rioting?)



In other news, Ananda the Great Prophet is born in Susa. He'll teach us Music, but I've already got Rhythm and Soul, so who needs it? Think I'll build the Temple of Solomon instead...


__________________________________________


(BTW, how come there's no movies for any of the shrines? Did somebody miss a deadline?)

Queue Granary, Courthouse in Hangzhou. They don't have many coast tiles to work, so no lighthouse yet. Very low production in this town! May have to build a workshop, instead of cottage. Hangzhou also stole the oasis from Bactra, which buggers up their food count now, so I have the worker tear down the just-completed windmill and build a mine instead. They just *barely* have enough food to work both the workshop and the mine!

Cash flow is now 526/+6!! Bumping up science to 60% will make it 526/-14, with Nat due in 2, but I decide NOT to run a deficit for now. Monty beat us to Nationalism, but I think we can still win the race to build the Taj Mahal. One turn won't make a difference...(yeah, like Theology. Heh.)

All in all, fairly eventful turn.

1665AD: Like the 3rd hour of "Gone With The Wind", nothing interesting happens.

1670AD: Again, it's like "Out Of Africa" -- nothing interesting to report.

According to the Foreign Advisor, everyone now knows everyone else, and in fact everyone has Open Borders with everyone else, except Natty & Sally, and...us.

 

[jerVL/kg]

1675AD: Nationalism done. We have entered the Renaissance Era!

Research Paper next, due in 3 turns @ 50% sci, 545/+7. Bumping up to 70% will finish Paper in 2 (545/-33) but, for some odd reason, that would add a turn to building the Spiral Minaret. Sometimes the machinations of this game baffle me...anyhow, I leave it as it is.

Notice one more dye needs plantationing, but as we can chop the SM in one turn (if need be), I don't move the worker yet. Hold breath, hit ENTER...

1680AD: Watch as various "such and such builds such and such, so-and-so converts to what-is-called" messages appear, wait for the dreaded "Spiral Minaret built in distant land" message...it doesn't come. Whew! One worker team can now be dispatched to hook up the final dye plantation:



Tarsus finishes its forge. We have a number of options here...however, one of them is NOT the Forbidden Palace. We're missing a Courthouse! (Need 6, only have 5 built.) Look around the other cities to see who can build one fastest, but they're all busy doing other stuff. So let's look at other options:

Hermitage (12) -- pretty much only useful for culture, and now that Hangzhou's flipped at last (and it doesn't look like we'll be going for a Cultural Win after all) I'd rather put it somewhere else more useful. Perhaps on a border city, like Gordium or Pasargadae. Versailles (30) -- see no reason to build this at all, it's just a unique Forbidden Palace and takes for freakin' EVER to build. And finally, Taj Mahal (26). Now, this city could use some Wonders in it. Pers & Susa can build it faster, though. Decide to make no decision until next turn...

According to Lord McAuley, we are the #1 wealthiest civilization in the world! "An Unknown Civilization" is #7 -- which means Hatty. What is UP with Hatty in this game? We haven't even met her yet!

1685AD: Well, fiddlesticks...



Like I said before, Monty's been a Wonder Freak this game! Highly unusual. And also unusual that he built it so damn fast...he must have GE'd it!

Mao (now Pleased) asks for Open Borders, I politely say no. I do renegotiate the Ivory trade and get 7gp per turn now. Techwise, he still says WFYABTA.

Speaking of trades...totally forgot to shop Nationalism around. Peter's the only one who will still trade and doesn't have it, and when I open his dialogue window he says something very peculiar:



Ya know, if that's all I had to brag about, I'd keep my mouth shut. Anyhow, I ask him what he wants for Nationalism, and...OH BABY!!!



Actually, adding up the beakers shows that *he's* the one getting the sweet deal here. No matter...I happily accept ("Cha-CHING!" he says) and we are now at tech parity with ALL the other civs! Except for Guilds, but we'll get that soon enough!

National Epic completes in Susa. Start catching up on basic infrastructure (Harbor, Market, etc.)

SPIRAL MINARET DUE NEXT TURN!! NO CHOPPING REQUIRED!!!

1690AD: Ok, last turn of this report. And it's a busy one. First, You-Know-What completes in You-Know-Where:



Susa also gets a 17gp refund for NOT completing it.

Persepolis is now unhealthy (toldja we needed the forest) so queue up Harbor (1) / Theatre (1) / Hindu Monastery (2) / Jewish Monastery (2) -- that's it, as far as infrastructure goes. They'll have to start on military next. Switch city governor to "Max Beakers", which slows growth a bit (17 turns) and adds 2 scientists & a priest as specialists, but doesn't slow down the build time at all. (Ain't Bureaucracy grand?)

Paper done, start researching Guilds -- bump science to 60%, we're now nearly in the green @ 691/-1, very nice! Due in 4 turns.

Here's what cottage-spammed Arbela & Sidon now look like:



Think I'll leave the remaining jungles, merely for aesthetic purposes. We can't work some of those jungle tiles, anyway.

Since we have Optics now, Susa queues a Caravel (2) followed by Harbor (2), Jewish Monastery (2) -- mess with the buttons, but nothing comes of it, so I leave it alone. (We gotta focus on getting those Monasteries done...Scientific Method is just around the corner, and we're about ready to switch out of OR pretty soon.)

The forever unworkable fish near Sidon are now within our borders, so 2 Work Boats are ordered up.

And, finally...start trading MAPS.

Only Mao & Peter will trade, the rest don't like us enough. Mao wants 100gp (guess he knows a straight trade won't suit him) so I pay it. Peter wants our own map + 110gp, and I accept. At long last, we can see where we are in relation to everyone else in the world:





As expected, Saladin really got shafted on the land. In fact, it's worse than I thought. I mean...Jesus.

Some interesting items to note:



Monty is right off our SE coast. If an invasion happens, it'll be from there. He's just as close with Hatty, though. He might invade her instead. Hatty always gets invaded sooner or later...if not by me, then by someone else!

We also get a glimpse of what the war between Peter & Nappy may have been about:



Checking resources, we see that Hatty has Copper & Marble, which explains why she beat us to The Sistine Chapel, but doesn't explain why she's built so few Wonders this game. (Especially compared to Monty!) She also is the one who founded Islam -- again, very unusual for her first religion to be so late. (Of course, it was Sally who grabbed the Buddhist ring first, and then those pesky non-Spiritual Persians hogged HinJewism...) Nappy owns both Confucianism and Taoism, which actually is typical for him.

Mecca (Sally) is directly to the north of Pasargadae -- no wonder it's been feeling cultural pressure. Sally also has copper & marble, and lots and lots of tundra. (If this weren't a pacifist game...) I don't see Stone ANYWHERE.

Number of military units built this session = zero.

Graphs & summation in next post...

 

[jerVL/kg]

Graph - Score:


Not too shabby! Normally you don't see a SPIKE like that w/o a Golden Age. Cottaging all those jungle tiles really did the trick!

Graphs - GNP & Mfg Goods:



We are P3WNing the competition utterly in both of these.

Graph - Crop Yield:


Pulled out in front. What's with the great big dip in Mao's yield? Drought? Plague? Locust Storm?

Culture graph has not changed significantly. As for Power...well, better to avert your eyes:


(Actually not as bad as I thought...how come it's going UP when we've built no military for centuries??)

Demographics:


As before, don't understand why the Graph Screen shows us #1 in GNP, while this one says we're dead last. At least our Life Expectancy has improved. We must be very healthy!

Top 5 Cities:


And finally, Victory Conditions:


I'm pretty sure we're out of luck regarding Cultural, Susa just never got any good culture in time. (Chasing Wonders and all that.) We could easily cruise to a Time Victory, though.

What's next? Well...a few thoughts.

Monty has NO RELIGION. We should consider beelining Astronomy, pack a galleon full of missionaries, and dump 'em on his land. That would of course require Open Borders, but we could always renege on that later. Once Jewism takes hold in his land, he'll likely convert immediately. (This of course means he might not invade us...but I've heard stories of "Mad Dog Monty" invading even when Friendly, so...who knows?) Peter is running Organized Religion, so we can try spamming missionaries there, too. Everyone else has Theocracy.

Astronomy would also be good to open trade routes between us and the distant civs. We're okay on happy/health resources, right now, but that won't last. We *really* need to make contact with Hatty, see where she's at in the game. She might be ahead of us, for all we know. But, I doubt it.

The Liberalism beeline is still open...nobody else has Paper yet, so we're actually ahead. Would kinda like to pick up Guilds/Banking first, though. (Forget about Military Tradition.)

Constitution? Well...dunno what benefit Representation will give us at this point. I usually skip right over it and head straight for Democracy, anyway. As for Wonders, there's no more left until the late Renaissance era. We have no copper, so Statue of Liberty is probably out. Too bad, our specialist-happy society could use it. Might be able to "buy" it with Universal Suffrage, though! We should definitely grab Eiffel, and also Broadway/R&R/Hollywood. Don't see any point in building the Pentagon, and the UN could actually make us LOSE the game, since Mao is much more liked than us! I also don't see any point in building the 3 Gorges Dam. Susa will likely get Ironworks eventually, but it's not on a river. Only Persepolis is.

But anyway...as before, don't know when I'll be able to play next. And this time for real; other stuff has come up (mostly work-related) that's gonna demand most of my attention for a long time. Also, Oblivion. (Still haven't opened it yet.) All our neighbors seem reticent to invade us, anyway -- and the joy of watching Cyrus's nice little society get UTTERLY CRUSHED has kinda faded as time goes by.

So here's the save, if anyone wants to play around with it. How 'bout a Conquest Victory, folks? Anyone wanna try?

Cya...

 

[Helmling]

The best reason to build the dam is to keep anyone else from having it.

 

[ArmoredCavalry]

I love the dam, free power. and as far as I can tell, the AI gets dettered by artillery, whereas you don't care. you can go straight for plastics, enter the modern era, and with state property (the size of your empire is eating away at your finances) or a GE you get free power.

 

[Helmling]

I rely on Universal Suffrage to nab the late-game wonders (now anyway, didn't do this in the game I'm writing about). I get the key tech--Mass Media, Plastics, Robotics, etc.) and then drop science to 0%. Rake in the cash for a couple of turns and then buy the wonders. Yeah, it slows down science by up to 10 turns, but it shaves dozens of turns off these late-game wonders and they can be well worth it. The dam is hard to beat. Instant, free power with no meltdown concerns and no health effects. It's a must-have for me. Dam + Space Elevator = Assured Victory.

 

[Villabongo]

i played on the saved game,your civ was really good however by the time i built oxford university, mao declared and i was a gonner. Also i noticed saladin and napolean signed defensive pacts and Hatpetshut was extremley strong.