score games

[TractorBoy]

A question for Peets.

When did you last play a vanilla score game?
I havn't been able to play one for six weeks because the workers are not working as they should. If you have the patience to play a fourty hour game then fair play to you!
I posted on the bug forum on the 3rd of November and they are struggling to sort it out, when the Hotfix was done for G&K they messed up the vanilla workers and ofcourse the G&K game will take priority. To be honest I can't see it being fixed in a hurry.
In the days gone by (pre steam), we had a choice whether to accept a patch or not, now the choice has been taken away from us. Some people say the two games are very similar, but as far as I am concerned they are completely different because one of them has Religion as a strong game influence (enough said).

 

[Peets]

I think my last game was in August. Been playing GW 2

 

[Denniz]

I am not a programmer and I am not a very creative type of personality. I understand vexing's point of view in that he would like areas of the HOF site to reflect more truly the skill factors of the games we participate in, to that end I would have thought the Date summary table would be the easiest place to start.

Civ4 did things that way. One thing we have learned is that it is very, very difficult to compare games across tables. With Civ5, we have been trying to do something new. The tables now included Leaders and Map types (along Difficulty, Map Size, Victory Condition and Speed) which hopefully makes the individual tables more comparible. The idea being that one gold medal is equal to any other. More below...

For a start the summary tables still show an old scoring system and have not been updated to reflect the scoring system implemented in the middle of this year, they still show settler and Deity as being equal.

Adding Diffculty factor to VVV was a good addition as there should be some differentiation. I wasn't thinking of the main HOF Summary tab as being a comparsion as much as a overview. So I didn't think about adding a difficulty factor there. I would agree that highlighting the higher difficulty Medals may be something we lack. I am not sure that map size should be a factor since the medals are earned against comparible settings. The Summary tab would definately need something to make it viable as a front page.

As well as a points total, I would have thought there is plenty of space to have a gold, silver and bronze section alongside. Maybe it could be made to look more colourfull and then installed as the opening screen!

I am not sure what you mean by "gold, silver and bronze section". What would those show? How would you make it more colorful?

I don't know what others think but I like the Veni Vidi Vici as it is, If I play well enough to pick up a silver and a bronze from one submission, I wouldn't like to see those and any subsequent medals split into different areas.

I tend to be cautious about changing the VVV. I don't want to unbalance it. I welcome suggestions, though.

EDIT
The opening screen has allways shown the competitive Deity games, I can understand why this was implemented, but does it really show off the HOF to it's true potential?

1 - Only nine Deity games have attracted enough participants to warrant a Gold Medal.
2 - To the casual guy taking a first peek, he may think; "Oh! they only play Deity on here and I havn't reached that standard yet". Or he may think; "I play Deity but there isn't enough interest" In both of these cases it could be these guys first and only look at the HOF score boards.
3 - The prince scoreboard is a far better opening screen because the participation is far greater (doesn't that say something), and it would appeal to more players.

I thought about making which difficulty that shows be random. But wasn't sure that would be better. What we can show is dependent on space. The summary doesn't really highlight what a table is so Deity has been the default for obvious reason.

With more data we might have more options. Let me finish the G&K stuff and we'll what ideas come in and have another look at it.

 

[TractorBoy]

I thought about making which difficulty that shows be random. But wasn't sure that would be better. What we can show is dependent on space. The summary doesn't really highlight what a table is so Deity has been the default for obvious reason.

Everyone wants to crack the Deity Hoodoo, but in all seriousness what % of people play Deity for pleasure? I honestly can' t see it as a good advert for the HOF. I can play Deity on any map, on any size and achieve almost any victory condition I choose but I prefer the medium levels and I am sure I am not alone! Don't get me wrong, I am not blowing my own trumpet, I am just trying to point out that civfans should be welcomed! If you want to welcome them then don't show something that they know they can't achieve! I am different, If I saw something way beyond what I have ever done before then I would be chomping at the bit to beat it (sometimes I fail amidst a wall of tears), but lets face it how many people are like me. You just need participants.
I was talking privately with a very knowledgale guy recently and he had no idea what the VVV contained, and get this: the guy has medals on the site!!
Denniz; We are all so very different in character and in order to attract as many as possible you need to give us underdogs a fighting chance!
.

 

[Denniz]

Everyone wants to crack the Deity Hoodoo, but in all seriousness what % of people play Deity for pleasure? I honestly can' t see it as a good advert for the HOF. I can play Deity on any map, on any size and achieve almost any victory condition I choose but I prefer the medium levels and I am sure I am not alone! Don't get me wrong, I am not blowing my own trumpet, I am just trying to point out that civfans should be welcomed! If you want to welcome them then don't show something that they know they can't achieve! I am different, If I saw something way beyond what I have ever done before then I would be chomping at the bit to beat it (sometimes I fail amidst a wall of tears), but lets face it how many people are like me. You just need participants.
I was talking privately with a very knowledgale guy recently and he had no idea what the VVV contained, and get this: the guy has medals on the site!!
Denniz; We are all so very different in character and in order to attract as many as possible you need to give us underdogs a fighting chance!
.

I don't disagree but how would you go about doing what you ask? Everyone wants their name on the main page. Deity represents the highest level of achievement.

I couldn't tell whether you were in favor of random difficulty or something else unspecified. If you have any suggestions to improve the HOF site, please be specific.

 

[Peets]

Denniz; We are all so very different in character and in order to attract as many as possible you need to give us underdogs a fighting chance!
.

TractorBoy or used to be ColinTH, you are far from an underdog.
If you combine your two scores then you have almost double of the next high score player. And if you check the tables, you almost never played the same game with your two accounts which means you are dominating all the smaller map games.
You indeed must have a lot of free time

 

[TractorBoy]

I thought about making which difficulty that shows be random. But wasn't sure that would be better. What we can show is dependent on space. The summary doesn't really highlight what a table is so Deity has been the default for obvious reason.

Random is far better than any of my sugestions, random that coincidentally takes in the gauntlet scores would be a very good advert especially on the G&K!

With more data we might have more options. Let me finish the G&K stuff and we'll what ideas come in and have another look at it.

Some 'new' characters are advocating all sorts of changes to your VVV without ever having paticipted in the vanilla HOF. We have put the hours in, please don't change the scoring implementations that have helped us real FANATICS decide which direction we take in our search for medals!
Do as you will with the G&K but make your mind up quickly because people don't take to kindly to being told that their medals/points have been devalued on a whim!

EDIT
If the consensus of opinion says that there should be no settler, no chieftan, no score games and no dual games, then put it to a vote and implement it for the G&K, but you need to make a decision quickly before civfans get annoyed that their efforts have been unrewarded.

Good luck

Colin.