SGOTM 12 - Regular
- Thread starter AlanH
- Start date
Flight in 4? WoW
You are the real hero PB. I might even forgive you not shipping over that 2nd army I had so carefully arranged all the transporst for. It would have been overkill anyway.
I think now comes the turn we discussed on page 1-3 of this thread? Whats still open?
You are the real hero PB. I might even forgive you not shipping over that 2nd army I had so carefully arranged all the transporst for. It would have been overkill anyway.
I think now comes the turn we discussed on page 1-3 of this thread? Whats still open?
archphoenix
Prince
- Joined
- Aug 17, 2005
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- 355
ideally only one turn left, and I think it comes to true without any unexpected.
PaperBeetle
Emperor
arch, you want to finish it off? I think there are three points of note here:
1) Joan has Espionage which will be a useful bargaining chip, and our wool deal has just ended, so you might want to renew it (although with so many scientists hired, few towns are in danger of rioting. Kyoto maybe).
2) I don't think there is any advantage to going to the big picture from the "entering a new era" screen. We may as well wait for the science advisor to ask what we should research next before going to the big picture. This is because our own free tech will be our most valuable trading tool, so there is no need to start trading until we get it.
3) Who do we want as our opponent? I suggest America. I spent some hours last night with my old Hittite COTM saves, testing how the candidates are chosen; I am quite sure that if we gift Abe Amsterdam, Lisbon, Karakorum and Tatu, it will be enough to give him comfortably more population than Joan. Gift during the interturn, before we dow him of course.
1) Joan has Espionage which will be a useful bargaining chip, and our wool deal has just ended, so you might want to renew it (although with so many scientists hired, few towns are in danger of rioting. Kyoto maybe).
2) I don't think there is any advantage to going to the big picture from the "entering a new era" screen. We may as well wait for the science advisor to ask what we should research next before going to the big picture. This is because our own free tech will be our most valuable trading tool, so there is no need to start trading until we get it.
3) Who do we want as our opponent? I suggest America. I spent some hours last night with my old Hittite COTM saves, testing how the candidates are chosen; I am quite sure that if we gift Abe Amsterdam, Lisbon, Karakorum and Tatu, it will be enough to give him comfortably more population than Joan. Gift during the interturn, before we dow him of course.
Some questions because I never did this:
So we try desperately for somebody to get Fission, Switch the prebuild, Gift our Cities to Abe, Try for MP with everybody. and declare war? After everybody has allied himself with us against the evil American Empire. (The way we do this reminds me very much of recent politics.) we just hold a vote getting elected?
So we try desperately for somebody to get Fission, Switch the prebuild, Gift our Cities to Abe, Try for MP with everybody. and declare war? After everybody has allied himself with us against the evil American Empire. (The way we do this reminds me very much of recent politics.) we just hold a vote getting elected?
archphoenix
Prince
- Joined
- Aug 17, 2005
- Messages
- 355
I can take it, in fact anyone can take it, since PB made such a full prepared situation.
this is detailed virtual move before acturally move.
1)renew wool
2)make sure we have establish embassies in all AIs.
press enter(inner turn)
2)age advance graphic appear and go on
3)sci advicer tell us we finish flight, go to big picture to see:
4)if we have fisson, no tech gift need.
4')if we haven't, give sci AI to get fisson.
4'')if we haven't fisson after 4', mm palace prebuild city, don't finish palace this turn, save and upload to discuss.
5)gift american Amsterdam, Lisbon, Karakorum Tatu.then DOW.
6)use all tricks to make as many AI polite to us.
(ROP, MPP, vs american, gift techs, trade WM, gift golds,gpts and luxs)
7)switch palace prebuild to UN.(the last step, which can't return big picture.)
8)when choose appear, click byz(ourself).
9)win diplomatic victory.
this is detailed virtual move before acturally move.
1)renew wool
2)make sure we have establish embassies in all AIs.
press enter(inner turn)
2)age advance graphic appear and go on
3)sci advicer tell us we finish flight, go to big picture to see:
4)if we have fisson, no tech gift need.
4')if we haven't, give sci AI to get fisson.
4'')if we haven't fisson after 4', mm palace prebuild city, don't finish palace this turn, save and upload to discuss.
5)gift american Amsterdam, Lisbon, Karakorum Tatu.then DOW.
6)use all tricks to make as many AI polite to us.
(ROP, MPP, vs american, gift techs, trade WM, gift golds,gpts and luxs)
7)switch palace prebuild to UN.(the last step, which can't return big picture.)
8)when choose appear, click byz(ourself).
9)win diplomatic victory.
socralynnek
Civ & Hattrick addict
I especially like number 9) ;-)
Looks perfect guys!
Looks perfect guys!
Taxpayer'sMoney
Warlord
- Joined
- Oct 12, 2004
- Messages
- 206
Just a thought that came into my head: when gifting the towns to America ensure that the towns gifted do not cut off our supply to valuable luxuries, or break our trade routes.
And on who will be our opponent - it's always a mystery to me. I once played a (unsubmitted) GOTM where I was going for a diplo win and arranged all my alliances against the civ with the biggest land area and only discovered that they weren't my opponent. I then reloaded and arranged all my alliances with the civ that was my opponent the last time only to find that this time round a different civ was my opponent. Go figure!
And on who will be our opponent - it's always a mystery to me. I once played a (unsubmitted) GOTM where I was going for a diplo win and arranged all my alliances against the civ with the biggest land area and only discovered that they weren't my opponent. I then reloaded and arranged all my alliances with the civ that was my opponent the last time only to find that this time round a different civ was my opponent. Go figure!
Well I read the CIV Lexika just yesterday and it said roughly:
Candidates are all teh following CIVs:
-The one that own the UN (us)
- any Civ which owns 25% of the world population
- any Civ which own 25% of the world Land
(BTW thats at most 7 candidates, I really wonder, how the AI would vote then.)
If only one Civ is a valid candidate (as probably in most real games is the case) then the opponent will be the Civ with the most popuplation(!).
Thats the reason why gifting cities is works.
Candidates are all teh following CIVs:
-The one that own the UN (us)
- any Civ which owns 25% of the world population
- any Civ which own 25% of the world Land
(BTW thats at most 7 candidates, I really wonder, how the AI would vote then.)
If only one Civ is a valid candidate (as probably in most real games is the case) then the opponent will be the Civ with the most popuplation(!).
Thats the reason why gifting cities is works.
Taxpayer'sMoney
Warlord
- Joined
- Oct 12, 2004
- Messages
- 206
But there are only ever two candidates voted on in the election?
I understood the Civipedia, that there can be multiple candidates if the fulfil the criterias.
This is of course very unlikely. But I guess, when you create a custom game, where you start 4 Civs and give each one city of equal size and to one of them the UN. You will then find if you start a vote, that all Civs are valid for election. It should definitely work with 3 Civs.
But in our game only we are qualified (France did'nt get above 10% even after taking out Korea and Persia. But since there need to be at least one more candidate for it to be a valid election, this one is chosen by population size. So we either go up against France (not good, they are well liked) or boost some other Civ up to overtake Joan.
This is of course very unlikely. But I guess, when you create a custom game, where you start 4 Civs and give each one city of equal size and to one of them the UN. You will then find if you start a vote, that all Civs are valid for election. It should definitely work with 3 Civs.
But in our game only we are qualified (France did'nt get above 10% even after taking out Korea and Persia. But since there need to be at least one more candidate for it to be a valid election, this one is chosen by population size. So we either go up against France (not good, they are well liked) or boost some other Civ up to overtake Joan.
archphoenix
Prince
- Joined
- Aug 17, 2005
- Messages
- 355
actrual move:
renew wool
no new embassy.
change polices in kyoto to all engineers;
enter
inner turn:
fisson!
gift many many. all polite expect sumeria.
drive american's troop, and lincoln DOW to us!
draw all vs to american.some AIs gracious.sumeria become polite.
change palace to UN.
expected, but we are over voted. like this.
this is record:
Game: SGOTM 12
Your team: Regular
Your name: archphoenix
Date submitted: 2007-07-10
Software Version: C3C 1.22
Game date: 1250 AD
Player race: Byzantines
Firaxis score: 8594
Jason score: 8432
Time played: 217:13:01
Game status: Diplomatic Victory for Byzantines
Submitted save: Theodora of the Byzantines, 1250 AD.SAV
ok, now we are feel free to see the myst 950AD victory......
edit:
ok, it is 1050AD with 63pages. i wait someone read and extract the spirit.
the only thing I know is they capture paris as their FP city.
renew wool
no new embassy.
change polices in kyoto to all engineers;
enter
inner turn:
fisson!
gift many many. all polite expect sumeria.
drive american's troop, and lincoln DOW to us!
draw all vs to american.some AIs gracious.sumeria become polite.
change palace to UN.
expected, but we are over voted. like this.
this is record:
Game: SGOTM 12
Your team: Regular
Your name: archphoenix
Date submitted: 2007-07-10
Software Version: C3C 1.22
Game date: 1250 AD
Player race: Byzantines
Firaxis score: 8594
Jason score: 8432
Time played: 217:13:01
Game status: Diplomatic Victory for Byzantines
Submitted save: Theodora of the Byzantines, 1250 AD.SAV
ok, now we are feel free to see the myst 950AD victory......
edit:
ok, it is 1050AD with 63pages. i wait someone read and extract the spirit.
the only thing I know is they capture paris as their FP city.
PaperBeetle
Emperor
Thank you arch.Well I wasn't expecting that result! I thought we would get some abstentions, and maybe even a vote or two for the Americans. After all, were so mean to them all
For the record, I think I have seen votes where the were more than two candidates. I suppose it would come about easily in a 1CC; the human build UN so is a candidate. Meanwhile the AI expand unhindered, so the strongest civ on each continent should get 25% pop.
Now, does "pop" in this instance mean number of citizens, as we would normally count them, or total population as recorded under the city name in the city screen, and summed in F11? In my experiments with my Hittite saves, I became about .. er .. 55% sure that it means total population, as measured in tens of thousands. The formula connecting the two is as follows...
per city, p = 1000 * (5 * c * (c+1) + f),
where p = population, c = citizens, f = food gathered.
So a size 12 city with full food has population 1000*(5*12*13 + 40) = 820k.
But I picked those four cities because they would be enough to beat France whichever way it is measured.
Jippiejeihea!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
And we solidly beat klarius, so we are 2nd!
I guess the other teams were as afraid of the last interturn so they just let it be handled as part of the normal turnset.
But seeing how the game went, and what we were able to accomplish transportwise, conquering France for a FP might have been easier then we thought at that time. But lets see what we can skim from the other teams thread, to optimise our strategy
And we solidly beat klarius, so we are 2nd!
I guess the other teams were as afraid of the last interturn so they just let it be handled as part of the normal turnset.
But seeing how the game went, and what we were able to accomplish transportwise, conquering France for a FP might have been easier then we thought at that time. But lets see what we can skim from the other teams thread, to optimise our strategy
Team Ivan seems to have miscalculated who their exponents are. but from the discussion how that happened we can learn.
According to Eldar the sum of all city sizes is counted to calculate Population.
Another interesting tidbit from other peoples threads:
Its possible to get second tier tech when you don't have all first tier. Don't know about probabilities though. maybe I test it out using our pre-IA save.
According to Eldar the sum of all city sizes is counted to calculate Population.
Another interesting tidbit from other peoples threads:
Its possible to get second tier tech when you don't have all first tier. Don't know about probabilities though. maybe I test it out using our pre-IA save.
nice finish, glad you made it before the ballgame is called
Main points in our game were the early capture of Paris (even quite premature though in second attempt only), the dedication of our capital to worker factory duty and the excessive use of food rich metropolises as science farms.
Also I'm glad we abstained from taking potentially uncorrupted but also unfertile lands like Rome, Inca and Persia.
I prepared some data (I had some more time, you know...
):
Sorry, I did not update your data yet...
Paris so early certainly was a good idea. Would you have done so too, when you hadn't captured the GLH? We were thinking about it, but refrained, because the immense task of transporting enough units there seemed worth less then conquering 3 of our neighbours for similar effect? Maybe we misjudged that one.
As for Conquering Incas or Persians, it allowed us to use our limited military might as effectively as possible. But I think you may be right excessive Science farming earlier in the game might have been a good thing.
As for Conquering Incas or Persians, it allowed us to use our limited military might as effectively as possible. But I think you may be right excessive Science farming earlier in the game might have been a good thing.
Taxpayer'sMoney
Warlord
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- Oct 12, 2004
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Congratulations guys. Well played to you all, especially the hardcore of Kulko, Soc, PaperBeetle and arch. Was fun reading your exploits. I hope I'll be lurking when Team Veteran brings home the laurels in SGOTM 13.
Taxpayer'sMoney
Warlord
- Joined
- Oct 12, 2004
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- 206
Oh dear! I am not going to be able to persuade PaperBeetle to go to the cinema for the next couple of weeks. He won't budge from his computer terminal until he's read every word of every SG thread! I shall have to visit him from time to time to provide him with food and water...
