SGOTM 17 - Fifth Element

[BLubmuz]

Four turns into the golden age as asked for.

3 turns away from guilds. new shot at stealing drama next turn. We might want to get more spies.

Micro is setup to generate 3 GPs in the next two turns. Add one specialist to Mainz next turn. Do not add it this turn. I think it was a misstake not to got for pacifism. it would only cost us 20 gold a turn since it is cheaper upkeep then organized religion. We could have gotten two more GPs. As you can see my micro was better then my fast calculations yesterday and our GPs are arriving two turns sooner.

Can you please put inside "spoil" the in game log?

We have 3 cities 1 turn away from a GP. I'm afraid it's too late to have the first GPerson from Aachen. Even if we fire now all the specialists in Mainz and Augsburg the first will arrive from Mainz. Less sure about the second, but let's assume Aachen will be the last. In any case it's a pure GM gene, so the only problem is the delay.

Reverse barracks and Xbow in Mainz.

Xbows are useful, and i like them, normally because they defend against maces. But with our UU they are less useful. It actually is a 12 strenght unit against mounted and melee while an Xbow is a 9 strenght unit against melee and 6 for the rest. Only in attacking cities the maces are superior, because they find LBs.

I think it's time to throw the dice to Hammer. I would alternate cats and WE, not use all siege as usual. Cat first, WE so all the 3 defenders are injured (hopefully) then cat, then see how it goes. The barb cities we can guess are normal spawned barb cities, which we can take or not. Being afraid of dom i think it's better let them there and just watch to not have troubles.

I do not see many units, at least not enough to start a war. When we start we need to keep enough defensive units in our coastal cities. We can't cross the ocean, but Sury does. He can arrive anywhere he likes and this is the reason for the trireme. Placed 1 SW of copper it will block galleys from moving W, or at least can attack them.

Florence, Aachen and Bridge must be protected. But this should not be a problem with all the units moving to be ferrried.

Now it's up to you. If you want to finish the GAge, do it. UT can play a long set if he so wish, to compensate his short one.

 

[Folket]

Aachen will spawn it's GM first.

 

[unclethrill]

So are you handing it off now or are you planning to finish out the GA?

 

[Folket]

I would be happy to finish the GA.

 

[Folket]

Can you please put inside "spoil" the in game log?
done

We have 3 cities 1 turn away from a GP. I'm afraid it's too late to have the first GPerson from Aachen. Even if we fire now all the specialists in Mainz and Augsburg the first will arrive from Mainz. Less sure about the second, but let's assume Aachen will be the last. In any case it's a pure GM gene, so the only problem is the delay.
Unless I have completely failed to understand the mechanics we are fine.

Reverse barracks and Xbow in Mainz.
will have a look

Xbows are useful, and i like them, normally because they defend against maces. But with our UU they are less useful. It actually is a 12 strenght unit against mounted and melee while an Xbow is a 9 strenght unit against melee and 6 for the rest. Only in attacking cities the maces are superior, because they find LBs.
xbow vs mace = 9v8, landsknecht vs mace = 12v12m, having one or two xbows to defend stack makes sense.

I think it's time to throw the dice to Hammer. I would alternate cats and WE, not use all siege as usual. Cat first, WE so all the 3 defenders are injured (hopefully) then cat, then see how it goes. The barb cities we can guess are normal spawned barb cities, which we can take or not. Being afraid of dom i think it's better let them there and just watch to not have troubles.
I would prefer to do some research I'm pretty afraid we do not have enough units yet.

I do not see many units, at least not enough to start a war. When we start we need to keep enough defensive units in our coastal cities. We can't cross the ocean, but Sury does. He can arrive anywhere he likes and this is the reason for the trireme. Placed 1 SW of copper it will block galleys from moving W, or at least can attack them.
The AI will not launch naval assaults if it can walk to teh enemy.

Florence, Aachen and Bridge must be protected. But this should not be a problem with all the units moving to be ferrried.
The AI will not launch naval assaults if it can walk to teh enemy.

Now it's up to you. If you want to finish the GAge, do it. UT can play a long set if he so wish, to compensate his short one.
I would be happy to play out the GA.

I will try to see what our chances are against hades hammer.

 

[Folket]

My tests show that our chance of taking the city is 0. longbows with 275% bonus are to strong for the units we have.

 

[Folket]

Ran more tests. Your most cost efficient way to fight the city would be 5 catapults and 6 elephants. With more units to clean up. No other units came close.

 

[BLubmuz]

Aachen will spawn it's GM first.

You seem convinced. I'm not. Looking F1 it has less GPPs, so less overflow. So it should be 2nd or 3rd. But it's not a big deal, aside the fact that it's the weaker of the 3 chosen cities - but the purest. I hope to be wrong.

I would be happy to finish the GA.

Go ahead, if you can do it today, the better.

About Hammer, do your tests and if you see that it's at risk, bring 2 more units. But I'm afraid they can spawn a new defender, so these units can be evened. It's why i'd prefer to launch now.

About Xbows, surely a couple to defend stacks is useful. I would just point out that they are less effective having Landshk. But probably being protective they are still effective. In other words, they are OK.

Lastly, i won't bet my head on the fact that "The AI will not launch naval assaults if it can walk to teh enemy." Would you?
I remember to have seen small annoying stack land... just to disturb, but actually to delay your invasion. But maybe i'm growing older...

 

[Folket]

We have 3 more elephants in goldfoot, shall we tranport them to Hades for the attack?

 

[BLubmuz]

Ran more tests. Your most cost efficient way to fight the city would be 5 catapults and 6 elephants. With more units to clean up. No other units came close.

OK, so use the units there to block the productive tiles and possible reinforcements. Bring a treb and more units.

 

[Folket]

We have 3 turns until guilds. Knights should be more reliable to war elephants with their 10 STR. I suggest I just continue to ferry units and then build 3 knight for the attack.

 

[Folket]

K, so my decision is to not use units in goldfoot. Build knight when able and play my four turns. I will pause if anything that I did not expect happens.

I will give you 15 min to respond.

 

[BLubmuz]

We have 3 more elephants in goldfoot, shall we tranport them to Hades for the attack?

From Goldfoot? no, absolutely. We need to start the real war ASAP or we finish to face rifles. OTOH we need to take that damn city. But we must be balanced. I see you're completing a treb in Timbu, use that. I also see 2 cats in Gao and there's still the unpromoted sword in Anvil. With those we can have some hope.

Then the west should be open.

 

[BLubmuz]

We have 3 turns until guilds. Knights should be more reliable to war elephants with their 10 STR. I suggest I just continue to ferry units and then build 3 knight for the attack.

Knights are great against LBs, but it's a suicide of expensive units. Try to test with what we have now or in 1 turn, then decide.

 

[Folket]

From Goldfoot? no, absolutely. We need to start the real war ASAP or we finish to face rifles. OTOH we need to take that damn city. But we must be balanced. I see you're completing a treb in Timbu, use that. I also see 2 cats in Gao and there's still the unpromoted sword in Anvil. With those we can have some hope.

Then the west should be open.

Yes, I agree it is to slow. We have split our forces to much. If we had the units in glodfoot in Hades it would have fallen. I will send all new units to Hades.

My tests show that after 5 catapults we will loose less then 2.5 STR 8 attackers when we take the city. With determination we should have those units build pretty soon. The catapults are already in place.

 

[Folket]

Knights are great against LBs, but it's a suicide of expensive units. Try to test with what we have now or in 1 turn, then decide.

As I said before our chances now are 0. Swordmen are to weak. They have 57% chance of leaving the defender unharmed.

 

[BLubmuz]

Yes, I agree it is to slow. We have split our forces to much. If we had the units in glodfoot in Hades it would have fallen. I will send all new units to Hades.

My tests show that after 5 catapults we will loose less then 2.5 STR 8 attackers when we take the city. With determination we should have those units build pretty soon. The catapults are already in place.

The forces in Goldfoot is what we need to have a chance to keep the city if attacked.

I don't understand your last sentence... maybe some wrong pronoun?

I'm thinking to swords as 4th or 5th attackers. I'm sure the WEs can do a decent damage, but to try to keep at least one alive we can use some sword after some cat and WE.

In any case, we need to solve the problem before to concentrate to Khmer. I suspect there's an isolated AI in the NW corner and we need to know how to reach it. In the best case we can be forced to build a city to build galleys to slowly ferry units.

 

[Folket]

I will not attack unless tests show we have a good chance of winning.

I'm also thinking there is a isolated AI somewhere as there is so much empty territory behind Hades.

 

[Folket]

1470
our second spy manage to steal drama. I decided to start 6 theatres at once.
great merchant.
1480
our spy in Japan got caught.
Great engineer and great scientist.
1500
Great scientist in China.

A longbowman attacked out of Hades. We should have enougbh to defeat the two remaining and a spearman that appeared.

 

[Folket]

Spoiler :

Here is your Session Turn Log from 1460 AD to 1500 AD:

Turn 206, 1460 AD: Confucianism has spread in Pisa.
Turn 206, 1460 AD: Aretas III (Great Merchant) has been born in Aachen (Quartermaster)!
Turn 206, 1460 AD: You have constructed a Rathaus in Florence. Work has now begun on a Confucian Monastery.
Turn 206, 1460 AD: You have constructed a Lighthouse in Kumbi Saleh. Work has now begun on a Library.

Turn 207, 1470 AD: You have discovered Drama!
Turn 207, 1470 AD: You have discovered Guilds!
Turn 207, 1470 AD: Guglielmo Marconi (Great Engineer) has been born in Augsburg (Quartermaster)!
Turn 207, 1470 AD: Enrico Fermi (Great Scientist) has been born in Mainz (Quartermaster)!
Turn 207, 1470 AD: The borders of Pisa have expanded!
Turn 207, 1470 AD: Qin Shi Huang adopts Caste System!
Turn 207, 1470 AD: Qin Shi Huang adopts Mercantilism!

Turn 208, 1480 AD: A Holy Roman Spy 1 (Mainz) has been stumbled upon while operating near the Japanese city of Nagoya!
Turn 208, 1480 AD: Prague has grown to size 9.
Turn 208, 1480 AD: Prague has become unhealthy.
Turn 208, 1480 AD: Augsburg has shrunk to size 9.
Turn 208, 1480 AD: Augsburg will become healthy on the next turn.
Turn 208, 1480 AD: Florence has grown to size 10.
Turn 208, 1480 AD: Niani has grown to size 6.
Turn 208, 1480 AD: Walata has grown to size 8.
Turn 208, 1480 AD: Suryavarman II has 70 gold available for trade.
Turn 208, 1480 AD: Qin Shi Huang has 210 gold available for trade.
Turn 208, 1480 AD: Quartermaster adopts Slavery!
Turn 208, 1480 AD: Ulm will grow to size 12 on the next turn.
Turn 208, 1480 AD: Djenne will grow to size 9 on the next turn.
Turn 208, 1480 AD: Gao will grow to size 7 on the next turn.
Turn 208, 1480 AD: Kumbi Saleh will grow to size 5 on the next turn.
Turn 208, 1480 AD: Pisa will grow to size 5 on the next turn.
Turn 208, 1480 AD: You have constructed a Theatre in Augsburg. Work has now begun on a Landsknecht.
Turn 208, 1480 AD: You have constructed a Barracks in Mainz. Work has now begun on a Crossbowman.
Turn 208, 1480 AD: You have constructed a Theatre in Ulm. Work has now begun on a Trebuchet.
Turn 208, 1480 AD: You have constructed a Theatre in Gao. Work has now begun on a Barracks.
Turn 208, 1480 AD: You have constructed a Theatre in Pisa. Work has now begun on a Rathaus.
Turn 208, 1480 AD: You have constructed a Theatre in Hades Anvil. Work has now begun on a Confucian Monastery.
Turn 208, 1480 AD: Barbarian's Longbowman (7.20) vs Quartermaster's War Elephant 6 (Augsburg) (8.00)
Turn 208, 1480 AD: Combat Odds: 37.3%
Turn 208, 1480 AD: (Extra Combat: -20%)
Turn 208, 1480 AD: Quartermaster's War Elephant 6 (Augsburg) is hit for 18 (82/100HP)
Turn 208, 1480 AD: Barbarian's Longbowman is hit for 21 (79/100HP)
Turn 208, 1480 AD: Barbarian's Longbowman is hit for 21 (58/100HP)
Turn 208, 1480 AD: Barbarian's Longbowman is hit for 21 (37/100HP)
Turn 208, 1480 AD: Barbarian's Longbowman is hit for 21 (16/100HP)
Turn 208, 1480 AD: Barbarian's Longbowman is hit for 21 (0/100HP)
Turn 208, 1480 AD: Quartermaster's War Elephant 6 (Augsburg) has defeated Barbarian's Longbowman!
Turn 208, 1480 AD: While defending, your War Elephant 6 (Augsburg) has killed a Barbarian Longbowman!

Turn 209, 1490 AD: Aachen can hurry Trireme for 1⇴ with 26ℤ overflow and +1⇤ for 25 turns.
Turn 209, 1490 AD: Prague can hurry Knight for 1⇴ with 33ℤ overflow and +1⇤ for 10 turns.
Turn 209, 1490 AD: Vienna can hurry Galley for 1⇴ with 28ℤ overflow, 16ℴ added to the treasury, and +1⇤ for 10 turns.
Turn 209, 1490 AD: Nuremberg will become unhealthy on the next turn.
Turn 209, 1490 AD: Nuremberg can hurry Grocer for 3⇴ with 22ℤ overflow and +1⇤ for 10 turns.
Turn 209, 1490 AD: Augsburg has become healthy.
Turn 209, 1490 AD: Augsburg can hurry Landsknecht for 1⇴ with 21ℤ overflow and +1⇤ for 54 turns.
Turn 209, 1490 AD: Mainz can hurry Crossbowman for 1⇴ with 37ℤ overflow and +1⇤ for 32 turns.
Turn 209, 1490 AD: Ulm can hurry Trebuchet for 1⇴ with 10ℤ overflow and +1⇤ for 26 turns.
Turn 209, 1490 AD: Djenne has grown to size 9.
Turn 209, 1490 AD: Djenne can hurry Knight for 2⇴ with 30ℤ overflow and +1⇤ for 23 turns.
Turn 209, 1490 AD: Timbuktu can hurry Knight for 2⇴ with 48ℤ overflow and +1⇤ for 13 turns.
Turn 209, 1490 AD: Gao can hurry Barracks for 1⇴ with 20ℤ overflow and +1⇤ for 40 turns.
Turn 209, 1490 AD: Goldfoot can hurry Granary for 1⇴ with 19ℤ overflow and +1⇤ for 10 turns.
Turn 209, 1490 AD: Kumbi Saleh has grown to size 5.
Turn 209, 1490 AD: Kumbi Saleh can hurry Library for 2⇴ with 12ℤ overflow and +1⇤ for 11 turns.
Turn 209, 1490 AD: Hades Anvil can hurry Confucian Monastery for 1⇴ with 12ℤ overflow and +1⇤ for 20 turns.
Turn 209, 1490 AD: Tokugawa has 7 gold per turn available for trade.
Turn 209, 1490 AD: The borders of Ulm are about to expand.
Turn 209, 1490 AD: Qin Shi Huang won't trade Paper
Turn 209, 1490 AD: Nuremberg will grow to size 11 on the next turn.
Turn 209, 1490 AD: Ulm will grow to size 13 on the next turn.
Turn 209, 1490 AD: Florence will grow to size 10 on the next turn.
Turn 209, 1490 AD: Niani will grow to size 4 on the next turn.
Turn 209, 1490 AD: Hades Anvil will grow to size 3 on the next turn.
Turn 209, 1490 AD: You have trained a Galley in Vienna. Work has now begun on a Grocer.
Turn 209, 1490 AD: You have trained a Landsknecht in Augsburg. Work has now begun on Globe Theatre.
Turn 209, 1490 AD: The borders of Ulm have expanded!
Turn 209, 1490 AD: Quartermaster's Golden Age has ended...
Turn 209, 1490 AD: Carl Friedrich Gauss (Great Scientist) has been born in Beijing (Qin Shi Huang)!

Turn 210, 1500 AD: Vienna can hurry Grocer for 4⇴ with 13ℤ overflow and +1⇤ for 10 turns.
Turn 210, 1500 AD: Nuremberg has grown to size 11.
Turn 210, 1500 AD: Nuremberg has become unhealthy.
Turn 210, 1500 AD: Augsburg will become unhealthy on the next turn.
Turn 210, 1500 AD: Ulm has grown to size 13.
Turn 210, 1500 AD: Ulm can hurry Trebuchet for 1⇴ with 26ℤ overflow and +1⇤ for 25 turns.
Turn 210, 1500 AD: Bridge can hurry Castle for 1⇴ with 19ℤ overflow and +1⇤ for 10 turns.
Turn 210, 1500 AD: Florence has grown to size 10.
Turn 210, 1500 AD: Florence can hurry Confucian Monastery for 1⇴ with 40ℤ overflow and +1⇤ for 33 turns.
Turn 210, 1500 AD: Niani has grown to size 4.
Turn 210, 1500 AD: Walata can hurry Barracks for 1⇴ with 14ℤ overflow and +1⇤ for 21 turns.
Turn 210, 1500 AD: Pisa can hurry Rathaus for 2⇴ with 26ℤ overflow and +1⇤ for 18 turns.
Turn 210, 1500 AD: Hades Anvil has grown to size 3.
Turn 210, 1500 AD: Tokugawa has no worst enemy.
Turn 210, 1500 AD: The borders of Timbuktu are about to expand.