SGOTM 18 - BadCiv

[Tall German Joe]

yeah but barbs/animals while settling... i know we're safe within borders, but outside of that?

NEVERMIND NO BARBS

ther'es no barbs.

 

[Tall German Joe]

so boak, you're playing the turns. what are your thoughts here.

 

[boak]

we can only single whip the worker if its 59/60, but the overflow will go into the next worker, and then we can whip again after 1 turn.

yeah thats what i thought double whipping was.

 

[boak]

so boak, you're playing the turns. what are your thoughts here.

on what exactly? i already posted what i thought we should do next.

 

[Tall German Joe]

yeah thats what i thought double whipping was.

usually double whipping refers to whipping 2 pop away at a time, useful in high food cities for controlling your population under the happy cap. in our case, we don't need to do this because a.) we have extra happy cap, and thus can afford 2 whips, and b.) we can't regrow right away, since our planned build order, afaik, is worker->worker->settler, so its better to work the tiles as long as possible.

 

[Tall German Joe]

on what exactly? i already posted what i thought we should do next.

i suppose you did, just curious if you wanted to comment on any of the discussion since then...

 

[boak]

I don't really have the game experience to really add much to the stuff that's been brought up since then so I'm happy to go with whatever the general consensus is.

I check this thread a bunch every day and if I feel I have something to add I'll always make a post but yeah if things are a little over my head (which will prob happen a lot) I won't have much to say.

 

[boak]

im goin to bed soon but i'm not workin for the next 4 days so i'll play some turns when i get up

 

[Sodavich]

I think it'd be a good idea to claim the chokepoint/dyes/pigs spot first before New Flood Central. It would leave us the option of pressing west, which seems vital to have, even if we do decide later to not piss of Joao. Besides, a hill city there would make a gorgeous defensive chokepoint.

Like others have mentioned, the stone clams site doesn't seem that imperative.

Shall we send the warrior to scout our southeast?

 

[johns5]

agreed with sodavich

 

[boak]

I think it'd be a good idea to claim the chokepoint/dyes/pigs spot first before New Flood Central. It would leave us the option of pressing west, which seems vital to have, even if we do decide later to not piss of Joao. Besides, a hill city there would make a gorgeous defensive chokepoint.

Like others have mentioned, the stone clams site doesn't seem that imperative.

Shall we send the warrior to scout our southeast?

yase.

should we scout along the coastline or closer to the mountains? im thinking coast since theres a better chance of finding a cool coastal spot for a city

 

[Sodavich]

yase.

should we scout along the coastline or closer to the mountains? im thinking coast since theres a better chance of finding a cool coastal spot for a city

I would suggest a path that scouts the flood plain to see if there's a resource there for New Flood Central. Personally I think the mountains are a little more important -- it seems important to know whether we're open on both sides or boxed in entirely! Besides, we'll probably have time to see the coastline before the settler is done, right?

 

[johns5]

yeah a coastline city is at least 2 settlers down the road, if not more, so no need to scout it now

 

[boak]

yeah that makes sense i guess. the first settler is what like 25 turns away?

 

[johns5]

Nah we can get one sooner with whipping & chopping. Joey and Drach are better at the micro stuff than I am but here's one way to do it:

First 5 turns: Let the current worker finish.
T6: We'll have BW by that point, so revolt to Slavery and move the worker onto a forest tile during the anarchy.
T7, T8: The worker starts chopping. Put two turns of work into the next worker (24 total)
T9: Double-whip the worker in progress for 60 , which will finish the worker and have 36 surplus.
T10: The second worker pops out. Maybe have him move into position on another forest to start chopping. Set the city (now size 2) to work the Wheat tile and Gold tile for a net production yield of 10 . The first worker finishes chopping for another 30 , Settler is now 36 + 10 + 30 = 76/100 complete.
Then the settler will finish slow building in 3 turns.

maybe wait until someone else can doublecheck my numbers

 

[johns5]

to add to that thought, that settler should probably go to settling chokepoint city, then we might want to build a warrior or something next so some jerk doesn't just walk into our city and steal it (and we don't get the for having no garrison). also gotta get a granary at some point too.

 

[johns5]

regarding foreign trade routes--

I notice there's a pretty big river network, and all the other AIs start with sailing. If we defog a river route that connects us to another civ, do we get the benefit of trade even without the tech?

 

[Tall German Joe]

Nah we can get one sooner with whipping & chopping. Joey and Drach are better at the micro stuff than I am but here's one way to do it:

First 5 turns: Let the current worker finish.
T6: We'll have BW by that point, so revolt to Slavery and move the worker onto a forest tile during the anarchy.
T7, T8: The worker starts chopping. Put two turns of work into the next worker (24 total)
T9: Double-whip the worker in progress for 60 , which will finish the worker and have 36 surplus.
T10: The second worker pops out. Maybe have him move into position on another forest to start chopping. Set the city (now size 2) to work the Wheat tile and Gold tile for a net production yield of 10 . The first worker finishes chopping for another 30 , Settler is now 36 + 10 + 30 = 76/100 complete.
Then the settler will finish slow building in 3 turns.

maybe wait until someone else can doublecheck my numbers

we don't have math, so the chop is only worth 20. also, we only get 10, not 12, the turn we double-whip. so, it'll take 1 more turn to get him out that way.

 

[Tall German Joe]

after thinking about this, i think it makes the most sense to double whip the settler, not the worker. since we can't regrow between builds, we might as well milk the fact that we have a lot of tiles for as long as possible. so, i propose:

1-5.) slow build worker, 0 OF
6.) revolt into anarchy
7-11.) slow build worker, chop finishes on 10, 8 OF
12-15.) second worker builds road 1W of cap then moves 1 SE of the choke and roads there. first worker chops again. cap builds settler for 3 turns, double-whip, 8+36+60+10 = settler + 14 OF into a granary.
16-17.) chop finishes, 1 turn into a granary working floodplain + wheat, whip again, 14+8+20+30 = granary + 12 OF, which could go into a warrior or barracks.

the only difference is the amount of overflow when the settler completes; this way gives 8 more i think. ofc, if we have copper in BFC, all these turn #s would change, as would whether we double-whip or not... would be so sick if we had a copper on a plains hill or grassland river in our BFC...

as far as scouting goes, I want to see the floodplains but i also want to see the coast to the SE... gotta be there for a reason.

 

[Sodavich]

as far as scouting goes, I want to see the floodplains but i also want to see the coast to the SE... gotta be there for a reason.

sure, but i doubt it's urgent. if it is, we won't know until animal husbandry or bronze/iron working anyway.