SGOTM 23 - Unallocated

Sun Tzu Wu · Aug 12, 2016

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Sun Tzu Wu · Aug 12, 2016

Continued:

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Sun Tzu Wu · Aug 12, 2016

None of the AIs can research Music and at least some of them have Drama or Literature, which are either or prerequisites of Music, so first to Music must have already been awarded.

Sun Tzu Wu · Aug 12, 2016

Someone else needs to take the next turn set. Musketeers and Cannons will fun against medievil units!

ikotomi · Aug 14, 2016

Taking the save.

Sun Tzu Wu · Aug 14, 2016

Please build a few more (2-3) spies, put them all in our Rheims gift city, finish off Hatshepsut with a small stack, give Churchill our gift city, do a few turns of 100% espionage, and steal both Guilds and Banking from Churchill. That will enable us to research Replaceable Parts right after we complete Printing Press, which we are researching now at 00% research to save up wealth for we can resume 100% research towards Steam Power and finally Liberalism for Railroad.

We probably want to complete Railroad ASAP, even though we may think it will take us longer to achieve a Conquest Victory. We can then complete The Orient Express at our leisure and use railroads to speed up our conquest.

We should soon be at war with nearly all AIs to hasten our Conquest Victory.

Good luck ikotomi!

Sun Tzu Wu · Aug 14, 2016

Since our research rate is fairly good now, we can probably whip more heavily than before. When I was playing, I tried to minimize our whipping to improve our research rate. I don't think we have to worry about that so much anymore.

Also, I think the one research diversion we could take is Nationalism to run Nationhood and draft 3 Musketeers each turn.

ikotomi · Aug 14, 2016

Need to work out some issues with my install, but was wondering if diplomatic victory is feasible. To my understanding, you need 75% of the vote, with the religion spread to all civs. That mean's we want 1 large vassal with religion spread, and manipulate them to vote for us, while we have less than 75% of the religious vote. I'll try to take a look at it when I have civ running again, but I'm thinking it's still quite a bit simpler to go for conquest.

Sun Tzu Wu · Aug 14, 2016

Yes, Religious Leader Dplomatic Victory is feasible; 75% is victory threshold. There are two issues though:

1) In a practical sense, we must first become the Apostolic Palace Resident in order to select the Religius Leader Diplomatic Victory motion. It may take as long as 50t after The Apostolic Palace completion for the next Resident election to be held. An AI AP Resident is unlikely to select RLDV when we would be close to winning. However, there may still be a bug that can cause the AP Resident vote occur as early as 14t after the previous such vote.

2) RLDV can normally be selected only every 10t, 20t when there is an intervening Resident election. This means we might have to wait as much as 19t after The Orient Express is completed. The bug above could speed this up, except we would always need to wait at least 10t after a Resident election. Due to the bug, a RLDV vote could be called 11t, 12t, 13t, and 14t after the last Resident election.

Even if we could take advantage of the RLDV bug, I'm sure a Conquest Victory would be significantly faster. There is no way that medieval units can hold versus attack by our Cannons and Musketeers. Even now, we could attack all AI empires simultaneously and wipe them out quickly. We just need to make simultaneous attacks on all their border cities and repeat as borders shrink. Plus both Cannons and Musketeers ignore Walls and Castles.

ikotomi · Aug 14, 2016

Quite a bit to process. I'll be building libraries in Thebes and Alexandria so that they can both work scientist specialists and up the great person rate. Still working on the city micro here, but cities with courthouses that aren't popping a great person soon will be working great spies for the +4/+4 beakers/espionage. I think Muskets are a little higher priority to get than cannons for now because of 2 Mov, and we have a pretty big round coming.

We might not be able to give Lyons to Churchill, as he already has 4 cities and we ran into an issue with Hatty before with only 4 cities. We do have to worry a bit about her taking back cities with Horse archers when we declare war on her. I'll be moving a couple muskets back to defend.

Also think we want to invade churchill soon anyways for the off continent trade routes. I'll either work on sending our galley stack back north, or building a few more galleys.

Sun Tzu Wu · Aug 15, 2016

I agree that Musketeers can take cities with relative ease against medieval units, especially due to their two plot movement. There will be Musketer losses, especially against fortified CG2 and CG3 Longbowmen. Musketeers will definitely need Cannon support when the AI acquires Gunpowder and begins to build Musketmen defending units. In my opinion, we have enough Musketeers now; we need more Cannons. Cannons will allow us to send out dozens of smaller stacks that can threaten every AIs border cities simultaneously.

We now have two super healers; our third Great General can attach as a third super healer. We can spread these super healers across back areas of our front were more the seriously damaged units can regroup and heal. For lightly damaged units, they can either heal in a newly captured city or with a Med1 or Med2 unit.

Sun Tzu Wu · Aug 15, 2016

Churchill will take Lyons, because it is less that 9.5 plots from his nearest city to it. The AIs will always take such a city, unless they are under economic distress (when they offer 3W rather than the normal 5W multiples in economic trades).

Yes, we should attack Churchill ASAP. In fact we should attack (DoW) every AI that is currently bordering us. That will help bring our Conquest Victory time to more cloesly match our The Orient Express completion time.

Sun Tzu Wu · Aug 15, 2016

For the attack on Churchill, we should build new Galleys in Copper City, Double Fish and other northern coastal cities. The galleys near Istanbul will take too long to move to our northern coast.

We might also built a couple Triremes to defend our galley stack, if we see enemy Triremes; or just build more galleys and only load units in ports and stay there until the following turn when we land land units.

If we keep the galleys in the channel (moving them 1N and then 1S each turn), we can move two units per galley across the channel. If the galleys start in our port on the channel, the galleys will need to move 2 plots across the channel and two plots back, thus they will move only half as many units across the channel.

ikotomi · Aug 15, 2016

Ok, lot of micro just for one turn. I retook Lyons from Hatty, Churchill won't take it (anarchy?). I took out Russia's stack, but lost our first cannon at 90% odds. I don't think I'll split this stack to take out Churchill, and just use our reinforcements from the cities to supply our overseas invasion force.

Lyons gets 1 culture per turn because of religion. Does it get the 1 culture before player turn it comes out anarchy?

Sun Tzu Wu · Aug 16, 2016

Don't worry about our culture. AIs will take our cities that are heavy in our culture.

Oops, I forgot. They will not take a city on another land mass unless they have 3 or fewer cities. He probably has four cities now. When we capture one he will take Rheims (he gets down to 3 cities).

For now, just put 4-5 spies in his city closest to our capital and sent a Islamic Missionary to convert for the religious espionage boni.

Sun Tzu Wu · Aug 16, 2016

The 9.5 plot rule only applies to cities on the same land mass.

haphazard1 · Aug 16, 2016

Finally back home and online again

There is much to catch up on, including this thread. Hopefully within the next day or two I can get up to date again, assuming I can stay out of the hospital for a while.

(Not that they didn't treat me well there, everyone was quite professional. But I have seen FAR too much of that place over the past few months.)

How are we doing? I saw a mention of possible deadline extension in the maintenace thread. So much to get caught up on....

haphazard1 · Aug 16, 2016

OK, read through the thread. War, war, and more war, with still more war on the menu. :lol:

But progress sounds good, especially on the tech aspect.

How do the votes stack up for the AP? Are we at risk of problems such as forced peace or "return city to X" votes? Another reason to deal with Churchill soon.

Religious victory is possible as a fall back option, but it is complicated as has been pointed out. Conquest will certainly be simpler, although it might take more time if everything lined up perfectly for the religious votes. I think conquest is the safer option to plan for.

Sun Tzu Wu · Aug 16, 2016

haphazard, sorry to hear about your health issues. I do hope they are temporary and that you are in good health again.

I agree with the points you have made.

ikotomi is probably still playing his turn set.

Sun Tzu Wu · Aug 16, 2016

How does everyone feel about the deadline extension proposed in the maintenance thread? AlanH said from the beginning that there would not be one.

I don't think we need absolutely need an extension, but we do need to speed up our war efforts.

SGOTM 23 - Unallocated

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Dancing Bear

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