Sidar - is it possible to get a lvl 6 out of the bat?

Kamen Rider

Chieftain
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Mar 30, 2010
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With charismatic (28 needed), all I seem to remember are:
2 from form of the titan
2 from command post
2 from theocracy
2 from conquest
2 from apprenticeship
10 from ride of the nine kings

Still can't reach 28.

If I go altar of lunotar, how much exp can one get?

(And is it a good idea to get Valor and leave a barbarian spawning nest alone for xp farming?)
 
Try building an alter of lunourt.
2 from form of the titan
2 from command post
2 from theocracy
2 from conquest
2 from apprenticeship
18 from altar

28 =)
 
Problem with the altar is that Sidar does not have any bonus for the priest specialists.
 
Sidar priests can't turn into shades?

o_O

No, I believe he he meant that Sidar priests and great priest specialist aren't any better then those from other civs.
Sidar priest units can Wane as good as other level 6 units.
And btw, isn't level 6 at 26 xp without Charismatic ?
 
No, I believe he he meant that Sidar priests and great priest specialist aren't any better then those from other civs.
Sidar priest units can Wane as good as other level 6 units.
And btw, isn't level 6 at 26 xp without Charismatic ?
I don't get the post then. Why would I care about great priests? All I want are a bunch of level 6 units.

Hrm, 26? I tried it on world builder and it seems to be on 26. Or maybe I was just being blind.
 
I don't get the post then. Why would I care about great priests? All I want are a bunch of level 6 units.

Hrm, 26? I tried it on world builder and it seems to be on 26. Or maybe I was just being blind.

Well, in order to build Altar pieces you need to generate 6 great priests, and to generate great priest you need to assign a lot of priest specialist. And since they are no better then priest specialists from other civs, you're not taking benefit from better specialist Sidar have.
And level 6 is at 26 for non-charismatic leaders and 20 for charismatic ones. 28 is level 7 for charismatic leaders.
 
Well, in order to build Altar pieces you need to generate 6 great priests, and to generate great priest you need to assign a lot of priest specialist. And since they are no better then priest specialists from other civs, you're not taking benefit from better specialist Sidar have.
And level 6 is at 26 for non-charismatic leaders and 20 for charismatic ones. 28 is level 7 for charismatic leaders.
PIMPIN! I can literally produce A great specialist per turn with A sidar-sabathiel!
 
It's more like 4/turn, actually. Download Wildmana when you get bored of winning - Wane requires lvl6 AND 26xp in WM.
 
Or don't play the Sidar with a Charismatic leader. FfH2 isn't balanced for unrestricted leaders.
 
If playing as a charismatic leader you could set it up for 2 level 6 units/turn. 1 Altar city making priests, one horse city making horsemen. If the Empyrean holy city is in the Altar city then you'd need to tech up to priesthood for altars and not get evil civs automatically declaring on you. Still need to go to Religious Law to get theocracy in play, Warfare to get conquest and form of the titans (probably Military Strategy as well to get command posts if you don't have a Great Commander) and Way of the Wise, then Honour to get Empyrean. Still should be able to get the priest city up and running around the mid game.

Luckily after that the first city supercharges the run for the second city, which needs you to tech to warhorses. Luckily you should already have Horseback riding in order to get, and probably teched to Bronze working in an effort to survive the early game. With the Empyrean holy shrine you'll have Sun and Spirit mana, so make a quick run to divination then build a Law and Mind node. Then the tower to get Warhorses for free. While that is going on tech Smelting and Iron Working. Send shade engineers to the second city to bolster its production to crank out ride of the nine in a short time.

Its hardly a foolproof strategy since it relies on founding the empyrean, building form of the titan, generating 5 great prophets and 2 great commanders(or being organized) and finally the ride of the nine kings. While you're doing all this you'll be pretty fragile, a main reason why it is better to go for empyrean shrine rather than have the auto war declarations that come with the fifth altar. Although it does also mean that in an emergency your best two cities can crank out a super elite garrison force. Setting up a shade assembly is quite fun, but basically any type of victory is a cake walk from there as your technology gradually dwarfs the opponents.

The easiest victory to go for after the assembly line completion is probably cultural. Adding two great artists per turn to your cities adds up fast.

Well, in order to build Altar pieces you need to generate 6 great priests, and to generate great priest you need to assign a lot of priest specialist. And since they are no better then priest specialists from other civs, you're not taking benefit from better specialist Sidar have.

It's worth noting though that the altar itself ends up supercharging those priest specialists beyond what the Sidar bonuses do. An altar V great prophet will be adding 4 hammers and 5 gold. An altar VII one will be adding 5 hammers. Altar boosted priests and great prophets aren't exactly weak specialists.
 
True, but they are no better then for any other nation. And it takes a while to get them good.

Last time I played the alter only gave extra hammer from priests and happiness.
 
Guys, you don't need to produce lvl 6 units off the bat, just make sure 4 of your cities keep producing 1 adept/priest per turn and you will be getting 4 specialist/turn when you close the XP gap (i.e. when enough turns pass).
 
That works, but of course there is a certain amount of overhead spent supporting those units while they mature. The longer it takes, the more units you have sitting around and the more the strategy costs. Shortening the process saves money, and of course the logical extreme is to shorten the process to zero by producing units that can immediately be waned - thus eliminating the overhead entirely.
 
I am not debating the value of XP-yielding wonders (i.e. Form of the Titan) or civics (I usually end up running Theocracy and Apprenticeship), however I usually find myself mass producing Adepts since they are more versatile and have the potential to be much more useful in combat than Priests, which significantly lowers the value of the Altar for me. I still try and build it for the Priest GP bonuses, though.

Since it is not possible to get lvl6 units right away in vanilla without Unrestricted Leaders and the Altar, you may see where I am coming from with this.
 
while it is slightly easier for Malakim or Amurites to get high level units "from the bat" as it were, I can see a Sidar nation building up the Altar, and then Switching to the veil (or merely buiding savants) as being useful.

However, such a strategy is FAR alternative and extraneous to the actual strengths of the Sidar. It might be easier for the Sidar (in terms of opportunity costs) to simply raise an army of adepts than to actually try for the Altar.

But yes, a Sidar leader with the Spiritual Trait, using an army of ritualists, can get level 6 units fairly consistently.
 
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