Some more Diplo questions

[WackenOpenAir]

If i have 10 great scientists to bulb and they will complete for example 8 techs.
Will i be able to get all those 8 techs in a single turn ? Or do i need 8 turns for that ?

Same question for great writers and policies

Assuming the first answer is "yes in 1 turn", if i bulb my way past a while era, say going from industrial to atomic, that means you only once lose 2 turns on the council rather than twice ?

Finally, do i read the information correctly that the first council takes 30 turns regardless what era it is ?
(since printing press is required for scientific theory and that is the first wanted industrial tech i dont think it is feasible to get it in a later era, but i just want to be sure)

 

[komodowaran]

If i have 10 great scientists to bulb and they will complete for example 8 techs.
Will i be able to get all those 8 techs in a single turn ? Or do i need 8 turns for that ?

Same question for great writers and policies

Assuming the first answer is "yes in 1 turn", if i bulb my way past a while era, say going from industrial to atomic, that means you only once lose 2 turns on the council rather than twice ?

Finally, do i read the information correctly that the first council takes 30 turns regardless what era it is ?
(since printing press is required for scientific theory and that is the first wanted industrial tech i dont think it is feasible to get it in a later era, but i just want to be sure)

1. i don't know sure, but i think it's limited to one from GS and one in turn transition and rest just stacks up in overflow, so if your smart u need 4 turns for it using 2 gs every turn

2. u can use any amount of writers for any number of policies in a single turn (normaly 8 turns afther hermitage)

3. im not sure about this but i think if one civ is already in modern by the time one player discovers all the time is lower

 

[inthesomeday]

If you keep bulbing over and over it'll keep giving you whatever tech you already have selected, so like if you have a tech queue and you bulb eight scientists usually it'll give you the first tech easy, then the next one will require another scientist despite having 1 turn left on it and having the whole blue circle filled up, and it will go on like this, with each proceeding tech requiring a scientist. But you can bulb them all in one turn; say I'm making a high amount per turn for the last eight turns, like right after research labs, and I don't have railroad tech, then I could usually bulb there pretty easy in one turn with a couple of scientists from like fertilizer tech.

 

[beetle]

^^ After you have bulbed one tech and now the dial show full and one turn left for the next one -- bulbing another GS just goes to waste. If you have multiple techs available, you could bulb one GS in each, but I think you might still lose lots of beakers to overflow. In any case, you won't get more than two techs per turn.

Great Writers are not subject to overflow cap, so they can all be bulbed on the same turn. One thing I cannot figure out though is why sometimes the last turn of a Golden Age is optimal -- but other time the turn the Golden Age ends is the best turn to bulb. Not much difference, but enough that it bugs me!

How are these “Diplo” questions?

 

[WackenOpenAir]

How are these “Diplo” questions?

You got me there i guess
They are because i was investigating the possibility of bypassing a whole era and thus a 2 turn delay on the UN vote.


So if i get it right:
If i have have 0 beakers stored, 500 per turn, 4000 per scientist:

techs cost 3000, i use 1 scientist, get 1 tech and next turn will have 1500 in store. use 2 scientists, get 2 techs, next turn have 0 in store, wasted 2500.

techs cost 4000, i use 2 scientist, get 2 techs, next turn start at 0 and wasted 500

techs cost 4500, i use 2 scientists, get 1 tech, next turn am 500 short of the next one.

Thats a @$%^#, basically means 1 tech per turn.

Thanx for helping !

 

[phillipwyllie]

You only get the tech if the bulb amount is greater than the cost of of the selected tech which can be done multiple times a turn. Note that overflow is capped at 5*bpt or cost of last tech researched whatever is greater/lesser(can't remember).

Great Writer bulbs can be stack as mentioned earlier. In fact it is recommended you do this on the last turn of a World's Fair buff.

 

[danaphanous]

I know saving scientists and writers is standard practice for fast win times, but tbh I don't do this. I hate having them sit around and usually either create a work or academy near my best city if it is early. If I feel the return will not exceed the current bulb value I often immediately bulb. (Q: do they cost maintenance?) If I produce a scientist right before research labs or during a time my science is rapidly climbing I may wait for it to stabilize at the higher amount before spending but never very long. It just feels like poor game design to encourage units to sit around like that.

That said, I'm curious how big of a difference the tactic actually makes on win times. What is a "good" finish time for a SV on immortal or deity? I never have a problem winning every time with my straightforward play so I've never given it much thought but I'd be curious how many years I'm off the "good" times playing my way. I think my first Deity game was an 1850 SV. Usually I'm finishing closer to 1870-1900 now with my more loose, wider playstyle getting sidetracked by fun wars and stuff. Is this "bad" or "ok" for these levels? AI usually is pretty far behind but that's not saying much.

 

[WackenOpenAir]

have a look at the long list of GOTMs to see the winning victory dates for different difficulties, and victory conditions.

The GOTMs usually have a favorable start position so these are representative for if you would restart your game until you have a start you like, not so much for real random starts.

Generally between turn 200 and 250 is a good victory date for almost every victory condition on normal sized maps and game speeds.
Conquest is faster if the conditions are right.

yes, you pay maintenance for the great scientists i think. In late game, gold however is rarely much of an issue and even then, its insignificant in comparison. For example you need about 50k beakers to reach Atomic. It is normal to research about 15k of those the standard way and get 35k of them from your final scientist push.
It can be good however to use scientist earlier for key techs depending on your strategy and victory condition. For example a tech that will give you an important unit or gets you into a next age where you can get rationalism, an ideology or other important stuff.

Using scientist to get to the key science techs like plastics faster is about equal to saving them till after. You get the boost from the science buildings 8 turns earlier, which is the same as what you lose in value by using the scientist before instead of after building those buildings.

Very much has been written about this topic already though, so if you do a bit of search, you will find much more info than i can tell you here.

I would advise you to give the GOTM a try. Even if you dont feel the need to do competitions, it is nice to start a game where you know its a proper and winnable map and you can afterwards see what other players did differently.
The games usually have 100s of downloads and only like 50 submissions, so theres plenty of players doing just that.

 

[WackenOpenAir]

Im a little nervous if im planning this right. You all know what this is about, so the turn number is fictitious. Someone please confirm if im understanding it all right

Research Printing Press on interturn 263-264 while both i and the world are in renaissance.
Get T-30 counter on T265.
add 4 turns for host votes on renaissance-industrial and industrial-modern.
Have T-2 counter on T297.
Get atomic age from free tech on t297.
Host vote on interturn 297-298
host resolve on interturn 299-300 with a t-1 time on the UN i asume.
UN on interturn 300-301.
Victory recorded on t300

Can i fit it closer together ?
What happens if my UN vote falls together with my age change, meaning i have a T-1 counter on my turn and then go into atomic age ?

 

[inthesomeday]

If this is the question I have a little bit more experience; I know for a fact the era of the congress/UN changes with the era between votes, so why should the UN foundation be any different?
However it won't become the UN until half the players in the entire game have reached the atomic era or one has entered the information era, which is usually hard to do in 30 turns from printing press unless you have a sizable tech lead already and then run straight from printing press into the top vertical info tech, I think it's called ecology.

 

[fyar]

Wacken, I think your victory will be on turn 311 in that hypothetical circumstance. On turn 263, two civs must've proposed resolutions for the World Congress to vote on. So after 30 turns (plus all the "interturn" votes on new hosts for each era), you still have to vote on those resolutions. Therefore, on turn 300 you'll have that vote, and then the World Leader vote will be next, just 10 turns later.

 

[IronfighterXXX]

host resolve on interturn 299-300 with a t-1 time on the UN i asume.
UN on interturn 300-301.
Victory recorded on t300

You must add 10 turns before WL vote.

What happens if my UN vote falls together with my age change

Unfortunately it means another WC session and Wl vote delayed another 25-20 turns.

 

[WackenOpenAir]

Oh so basically at best i can win 13 turns after i have destroyed all but 1 and gotten myself into Atomic

 

[WackenOpenAir]

Oh so basically at best i can win 14 turns after i have destroyed all but 1 and gotten myself into Atomic

Good thing i asked, thanx

Another question about the interturns:
If i have 2 cities reaching the requered GPP for a scientist on the same interturn. How do i know which city will produce it and which will get its counter +100 ?

Oops that must have been the reply button instead of the edit button.

 

[IronfighterXXX]

Oh so basically at best i can win 13 turns after i have destroyed all but 1 and gotten myself into Atomic

AFAIK you have to destroy all but 2, because it's somehow rounded.