Some Religious Hero Stuff

[Fafnir13]

Just a couple of things I've been thinking about recently.

First off, I was thinking that perhaps the religions could do with national heroes. What I mean by that is a hero particular to the religion that every nation following said religion can build. The purpose of these heroes would be to lessen the disincentives that exist when it comes to following someone else's religion. Currently, the founder gets the holy and has a better chance of snagging the heroes before most have a chance. This makes a good portion of the game a dash to get the religion you want. Sure, you can always switch to a different religion should you lose the race, but that's not always desirable.
Then there's the AI. They happily follow along after whatever is available, meaning your heroes often have free reign to stomp everything in sight. I recently had a game where I had my Hyborem facing off against an AI Mardero. It was quite nifty and made me feel sad how rarely I get to see hero on hero action. Giving a few more chances for hero creation would help with that.
Anyways, some limits on said heroes might be that they can't be built until the main religious hero has been built and you can't build them if you're the one who built that hero. They would also be less powerful than the prime hero, perhaps more akin to a Grigori adventurer.

The second thing I was thinking about involves the end-game religious heroes, currently comprised of Meshabber of Dis and the Mithril Golem. Will the other religions ever be getting units along a similar design? Okay, more specifically, could the Octopus Overlord religion pretty please get a buildable Octopus? Krakens don't count, puny little things that they are. To make it really unique, it could instead be a ritual that summons one out in the ocean/along your coast somewhere. For extra fun, make it repeatable. Ther are the Overlords after all. Okay, I'm reaching there, but I do like that religion so very much.

 

[Brokenbone]

Re: National heroes for a religion, hey, why not? Just as Aristocracy has its Royal Guards which'll leave if you change your civics, maybe some midgame national units (3 or 4 of them) with tree/ocean/hell/earthy/holy/sun/shadow attributes, depending, would be viable. Might be a lot more fun in cases than the generic Paladins or Eidolons.

Re: endgame heroes for other religions, such as OO, Cthulu rising from the ocean would be a riot. Still, the Avatar of Wrath is the one who makes a huge number of living units lose their marbles (Enraged), some non-copyright infringing squid-headed giant rising from the ocean with maybe a Fear promotion, waterwalking, and some other goodies to start might be fun.

I guess FoL could get a jumbo treant (boring), not sure about the rest of the religions. Jumbo Azer (a big flying sun?) for Empyrean, some nasty invisible HN shadow thing for Esus, I guess something angelic for the Order (maybe Sphener already fulfils the role of "big angel", though Sphener's not 100%comparable to Meshabber / Mithril Golem).

Anyhow, part of the theme of recent (past 12 months) updates has in my mind been simplifying troop options, cutting pikemen, reimagining crossbowmen, unifying what used to be summoners vs. mages, etc. Maybe adding religious unit differentiation runs contrary to that design, still may be fun.

 

[Caradoc]

What if the religion heroes were to shift their allegiances depending on score, perhaps with some bonus to the owner of the shrine?

Anyway, Sureshot has some Avatar units that might be good for your national heroes.

 

[Fafnir13]

What if the religion heroes were to shift their allegiances depending on score, perhaps with some bonus to the owner of the shrine?

I can imagine nothing more terrifying then some of the heroes I've had turning on me...and nothing sadder when the AI loses them on the next turn. You know it would happen.

 

[MagisterCultuum]

I personally would still really like Religious heroes to defect to another civ of the proper reigion instead of being disbanded. (Of course, once they were made rebuildable if they abandoned you this became less necesary.)

 

[Justicar333]

Rather like this ideal. Some religions, particullary OO could use a few more toys. Okay I'm partial to Cthulu, he's just fun. xD

How about something like the beastie from Hellboy 2 for FoL? Near as I can gather it was the last of a race of some type of nature giants, and its essence caused things to bloom vibrantly.

 

[Fafnir13]

I can imagine such a unit having an effect similar to the war machine, except it would plant trees where ever it goes. Your stack of elves would never be without forest cover again!

 

[rusty217]

I can imagine such a unit having an effect similar to the war machine, except it would plant trees where ever it goes. Your stack of elves would never be without forest cover again!

A late game hero for FoL that autocasts bloom and is very strong?

Brilliant idea!

 

[Mesix]

I like the idea of having the religious heroes stay alive and become loyal to another player of that religion rather than disbanding. This would create a real drawback to swithing religions. Imagine having Bambur up to 150 exp and then having him turn against you because you decide to switch to Octopus Overlords.

I also think that heroes should not be able to become Sidar shades either. This would create an exploit around the drawback of switching religions. Heroes seem like powerful personalities who whould not be so apt to just wane out of existence.

 

[Psychic_Llamas]

nore should heroes be able to be disbanded

 

[mtagge]

Uhmmm, the religions do have national heroes. They just take a while to groom. The high priest are all national units and pretty beefy to boot, plus depart on religion switch.

Unless you had a specific proposal for national religious heroes?

 

[Fafnir13]

I'm talking about units that can't be rebuilt once killed and get the hero promotion. You know, heroes. I don't really have any specific ideas, other than that they might just be less powerful versions of Rosier, Saverous, Vallin, Bambur, etc. Or they could be completely unique.
I'm just looking for ways to make following someone else's religion less of a downer.
And get Cthulu into the game, a version of him at least.

 

[ultimaterez]

And get Cthulu into the game, a version of him at least.

Yes, you would want Cthulu in the game, wouldn't you. No, a giant army of Stygian Guards lumbering across the ocean casting tsunami on everything in range and devouring poor, innocent townspeople just isn't enough for you, is it...

 

[Caradoc]

I personally would still really like Religious heroes to defect to another civ of the proper reigion instead of being disbanded. (Of course, once they were made rebuildable if they abandoned you this became less necesary.)

Rebuildable? I missed this before. Are you saying that if I lose Yvain by adopting RofK I can rebuild him when I change back to FofL?

 

[stp]

Yes, if he abandoned you and you manage to switch back and build him again before anyone else does. At least I think so, I've never actually tried.