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Spec Ops doubts, Ideas and strategies.

Discussion in 'Civ6 - General Discussions' started by Ticio, Jul 24, 2020.

  1. Ticio

    Ticio Warlord

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    Then they should try to make it more useful. If the unit has no real use or purpose they should give it one, as right now there is no reason for it to exist.

    If Ranged units are better at distant attack and sometimes even exploring, why skirmishers?

    if light calvary is better for scouting, razing and moving behind enemy lines (no ZOC), why skirmishers?


    As it seems, you could remove the whole skirmisher class and it would be okay, nothing would be lost.



    I read in the past some complaints about how limited variation was with land units. I'm personally pretty okay with the amount of land units we have now, but I cannot help but feel that Spec Ops (and the previous skirmishers units) have potential to give something more and new.


    Something that could make them feel a unique land unit, with a real purpose... or at least turned them useful to some degree!
     
  2. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    I disagree on this point to some degree. LC cannot attack then move which is a skirmish action (although they were mounted skirmishers) Skirmish rough terrain use is good. Yes LC are pretty handy to the point of why would you separate them from your main force, they are great pillagers which skirmishers are not. Skirmishers do attract attack amd are hard to catch. They are misdirection troops, even as scouts they are great at this but with shoot and move they get a sting in their tail. The main issue is skirmishers are too expensive (so you just use your upgraded scout if it survives that long) and they are more vulnerable to ranged than they should be.
    Primarily I find them invaluable for drawing fire . It seems you do not do this nor use them to draw troops away.

    And here I completely disagree, it is half there and works quite well, too vulnerable to ranged but suitable vulnerable to LC.
    The thing is, you do not need them but they can be useful and can in fact be more useful than not having them at times. But you have to use them in that way for a while to appreciate this.
    Their target priority status is great but their vulnerability to ranged is just wrong.

    100% agree they are not right, just think people misunderstand their use.
     
  3. Ticio

    Ticio Warlord

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    You are totally right when pointing the ambush ability. Is a very good ability that help make constant harrasment!

    I was refering more to the purpose of pillaging and going behind enemy lines to do this. After I discovered that Skirmishers (mainly Spec Ops) do not ignore ZOC I just realized that LC is better to this purpose.
    With the promotion to raid only for 1 movement and ignoring ZOC they can go pillaging everything and still have movement to scape.

    Meanwhile Special Ops have to wait to pillage (as it consumes all their movement), and they can barely scape as they have to go throught ZOC.

    This is the main reason I got frustrated with Special Ops, I'm okay with them being bad at pillaging, but then why they gave them the "Paradrop ability" if they will die 2 turns after without doing anything?
    Do not give them this kind of ability if you do not want me to use them in enemy territory!!

    For this reason I proposed these changes, let them has they are (except for paradroping taking a turn of movement), but if they manage to pillage, make it count (floods and radioactive releases) so enemy has to invest units to their bases, or let them be "assassins" that have a purpose on battle taking great generals out of the field (like snipers).


    But it is true that used as you say they have more useful, is just that they have a lot of potential but it is not use :(
     
  4. AsH2

    AsH2 Prince

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    Have you tried to take out embarked units?
     
  5. Ticio

    Ticio Warlord

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    Like with regular attacks or using the "Priority target"? Neither of them, but do they do different damages?

    That also make me wonder if the "prioty target" ability also let you target embarked units that are supported by a naval unit!
     
  6. Galvatron

    Galvatron Warlord

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    That's quite alright, I can assure you that native English speakers have as much trouble interpreting the written word in such cases... As it happens I had a few confrontations this week on the internet in that vain.

    What I mean to say is that they should be entirely different unit lines. You should be able to train spec ops, and, skirmishers and they should be different unit types. They shouldn't share the same promotion tree, and they shouldn't perform the same role.

    Yes, that's precisely my problem. The reason why they're not worth their price, imho, is that they're half spec ops, and thus need to be expensive, and half skirmisher, and thus need to be cheap. They both need to be cheaper and more expensive simultaneously, because they're trying to do two opposite roles at once.


    I'm pretty sure it does, doesn't it?
     
    Ticio likes this.
  7. Ticio

    Ticio Warlord

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    That's quite an interesting point!

    For sure making 2 different units able to perform 2 specific tasks would be better.

    And about the "priority target" being used on water, I really do not know... my game was in continental map so I did not have the opportunity to check. Maybe I can try today!
     

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