spells you do NOT use
- Thread starter scutarii
- Start date
well smoke takes too long turn into burning forest, the fire has a too short duration and the new-forest forest growth is too long.
maybe FireI + windI can be combined into:
-burning => the forest burns immediatly
-gives +50%resistance to fire to the caster, 100%chance wearing of.
fair winds could be better with having no chance of disapearing.
maybe FireI + windI can be combined into:
-burning => the forest burns immediatly
-gives +50%resistance to fire to the caster, 100%chance wearing of.
fair winds could be better with having no chance of disapearing.
It would be really cool if the burning lasted a bit longer. Especially for the Clan. Is it possible to have a wonder like "Everburning Flame" that stops all flames in your territory from disappearing? Or transforming them into another terrain feature like "Everburning Flames" that can only be extinguish by a spell connected to the water II instead of water I. Or Clan of Ember could get a special version of a flame that burns as long as the caster stays on the tile.
Lord Katana
Warlord
- Joined
- Jan 22, 2009
- Messages
- 178
As in Shadow II??? Why
it's a must have spell... Ever fought against a stack of 80 longbowman huddled up in a city? How else are you gonna survive attacking them?Or am i missing something here?
edit: read all posts, tesb had same thoughts
As in Shadow II??? Why
catapults, fireballs, or ships. 80 longbowmen usually means there is at least 100% cultural bonus, which shadowwallk does nothing against, so you gotta pound it down anyways.
And first strikes? Blur.
I always thought that blur was much more useful than shadowwalk...
shouldn't they be inverted ?
shadowwalk is learning to not be seen.
blur is more difficult, it is not be clearly seen even if one see you.
(blur is a bit strong : 1 lvl spell, on 1unit, can affect a whole stack + can counter up to 5 promotions per defending unit)
If it were only available for recon or marksmen, it might be better.
Or if blur negates only defensive strike Or if it has a random chance to work, Or if it negates up to 1-2-3 FS, not all...Etc Or if it gives +10% +20% +40% against archer or against drill-promoted units...etc
dance of blade adds : +1FS chance
Blur : negates all FS : negates dance of blade + negates all the Drill promotion line + innate FS chances of Archers.
shouldn't they be inverted ?
shadowwalk is learning to not be seen.
blur is more difficult, it is not be clearly seen even if one see you.
(blur is a bit strong : 1 lvl spell, on 1unit, can affect a whole stack + can counter up to 5 promotions per defending unit)
If it were only available for recon or marksmen, it might be better.
Or if blur negates only defensive strike Or if it has a random chance to work, Or if it negates up to 1-2-3 FS, not all...Etc Or if it gives +10% +20% +40% against archer or against drill-promoted units...etc
dance of blade adds : +1FS chance
Blur : negates all FS : negates dance of blade + negates all the Drill promotion line + innate FS chances of Archers.
I agree, compared to death III, the T3 elemental spells was useless for a long time. 4 very Strong summons has been beaten by 4 very strong summons plus masses of still strong spectres.
however, since the 4 masterys, the situation has changed. of course, master of necromancy is the untouchable best school and should be the first one youre aiming for. the point is, you dont need it twice. 1 master of necromancy is absolutely enough. but if you have the chance to build up a second mastermage, for gods sake, plz let him be a master of elements (or make a destroyer of your first one). stacking fire- or airnodes is AMAZING, especially if you have a staff of the winds or the fire affinity staff.
a really strong virkuul +
her elemental horde +
4 SHOOTING STARS!!! +
fire/air elementals for less promoted archmages +
(tons of strenght for your favorite unit)
are truely devastating. t3 elementals are all but useless if well used.
edit: oh, and wraths and spectres are useless when youre trying to destroy your opponents army in the open field cause of the fear promotion. that can be very annoying. (its good when defending a city, but it will still not bring a decision...)
however, since the 4 masterys, the situation has changed. of course, master of necromancy is the untouchable best school and should be the first one youre aiming for. the point is, you dont need it twice. 1 master of necromancy is absolutely enough. but if you have the chance to build up a second mastermage, for gods sake, plz let him be a master of elements (or make a destroyer of your first one). stacking fire- or airnodes is AMAZING, especially if you have a staff of the winds or the fire affinity staff.
a really strong virkuul +
her elemental horde +
4 SHOOTING STARS!!! +
fire/air elementals for less promoted archmages +
(tons of strenght for your favorite unit)
are truely devastating. t3 elementals are all but useless if well used.
edit: oh, and wraths and spectres are useless when youre trying to destroy your opponents army in the open field cause of the fear promotion. that can be very annoying. (its good when defending a city, but it will still not bring a decision...)
Calavente,
your comparison is faulty.
If they meet each other then blur is better.
If they meet other opponents then blur is better if the opponent has more then one FS chance otherwise dance of blades are better. Also dance of blades seems to have a confusing effect as well.
your comparison is faulty.
If they meet each other then blur is better.
If they meet other opponents then blur is better if the opponent has more then one FS chance otherwise dance of blades are better. Also dance of blades seems to have a confusing effect as well.
Shadowwalk as useless, really?
Once you know it affects city defense and not terrain, it is one of the best early/mid game spells around. One mage can bypass the defenses for the whole stack, and the rest can soften up the defenders with fireballs. Really, until you hit mega-culture cities in the late game, shadowwalk is indispensable for city assaults.
And as for T3 summons, what else would you use Archmages for? I think everyone should have a story about when they discovered the true power of water elementals. Mine was when I took out a stack of 150 mithril champions in a hill city with just Hemah, a handful of Stygian guard escorts, and the tower of elements (I was playing as Keelyn, before the Summoner nerf. Three turn puppets FTW!). What other single unit can do that? What other spell?
EDIT: whoops, there was a second page. Still, I :heart: water III
EDIT2: I should probably add something to the discussion. Spells I don't use: All the life spells, all law, entropy III, Air III (summons are supposed to lose, not win), air I. All the others have a pretty useful niche. Oh, and body III. Flesh golems are neat, but there are much more fun and less micro-intense ways to win.
Once you know it affects city defense and not terrain, it is one of the best early/mid game spells around. One mage can bypass the defenses for the whole stack, and the rest can soften up the defenders with fireballs. Really, until you hit mega-culture cities in the late game, shadowwalk is indispensable for city assaults.
And as for T3 summons, what else would you use Archmages for? I think everyone should have a story about when they discovered the true power of water elementals. Mine was when I took out a stack of 150 mithril champions in a hill city with just Hemah, a handful of Stygian guard escorts, and the tower of elements (I was playing as Keelyn, before the Summoner nerf. Three turn puppets FTW!). What other single unit can do that? What other spell?
EDIT: whoops, there was a second page. Still, I :heart: water III
EDIT2: I should probably add something to the discussion. Spells I don't use: All the life spells, all law, entropy III, Air III (summons are supposed to lose, not win), air I. All the others have a pretty useful niche. Oh, and body III. Flesh golems are neat, but there are much more fun and less micro-intense ways to win.
I didn't say shadiwalk was uninteresting but just :
blur is better than shadowalk.
AND
Blur (and shadowwalk) are very powerful spells, maybe a bit too much.
Folket :
My comparison was not faulty at all.
if you have dance of blades and I have blur :
I negate all your "dancing blades" + I negat any FS you have, either by the unit or by commando or drill promotions !
blur is better than shadowalk.
AND
Blur (and shadowwalk) are very powerful spells, maybe a bit too much.
Folket :
My comparison was not faulty at all.
if you have dance of blades and I have blur :
I negate all your "dancing blades" + I negat any FS you have, either by the unit or by commando or drill promotions !
first: currently shadowwalk has all the effects blur has. (that is why blur gets obsoleted by shadowwalk)
second: when you look at the second page of 'making a new spell system part II: spells' thread you will see that current discussions will be obsolete with wildmana 9.0 (sephi posted the new buff system in spoilers)
second: when you look at the second page of 'making a new spell system part II: spells' thread you will see that current discussions will be obsolete with wildmana 9.0 (sephi posted the new buff system in spoilers)
does it ?
I can't say. I never looked at it especially in WM. In base FFH it "just" negates defense % from buildings. maybe in Wm it also negates FS...
It was already powerful. Now it seems it is even more powerful.
Maybe blur and shadowwalk only on recon units or with a chance of success might be more balanced, or with a
reduction to compensate the fact that you move slowly in the shadows...Shadowwalk sucks ass. I can't believe you are actually saying it is now OP with blur attached. It still sucks. Worthless spell.
How to win an invasion
1. smash the SoD in the open field, smash their navy
2. bring 4 catapults, naval bombardment ships
3. win
notice the lack of the need for shadowwalk.
When you bombard cities, you don't bombard the culture first, so shadowwalk doesn't get to be like, "ok, now that the cultural defense bonus is gone, now I can reduce it 10 or 25% more by using shadowwalk to skip past the still standing and complete walls" So if your first round of bombardment takes off half the defenses, then shadowwalk is now half of suck, which makes it double suck.
I would much rather shadowwalk removed the city invasion penalty for recon units. It's only a return of 25%, but that's 25% you can still use after you used your catapults or fireballs or frigates to remove all defensive bonuses.
How to win an invasion
1. smash the SoD in the open field, smash their navy
2. bring 4 catapults, naval bombardment ships
3. win
notice the lack of the need for shadowwalk.
When you bombard cities, you don't bombard the culture first, so shadowwalk doesn't get to be like, "ok, now that the cultural defense bonus is gone, now I can reduce it 10 or 25% more by using shadowwalk to skip past the still standing and complete walls" So if your first round of bombardment takes off half the defenses, then shadowwalk is now half of suck, which makes it double suck.
I would much rather shadowwalk removed the city invasion penalty for recon units. It's only a return of 25%, but that's 25% you can still use after you used your catapults or fireballs or frigates to remove all defensive bonuses.
It is normal that if you chose a situation where blur applies no bonus, dance of blade is better...
that's a non-argument.
and if you are fighting ships with ships, airI is better than dance of blades(that applies only to living units)...
but do you know many stacks without at least 1 unit with drill promotion ? or a stack without any archers ?
NeoMega : you are supposing :
1) you have access to many catapults/fireballs, enough to raze the city defense in 1turn.
or you have a sea access to the city. (blur+shadowalk needs at most 1mage+ 1adept, while 4-6fireballs needs 4-6 mages... much more economical.)
2) the ennemy city has lot of cultural defense ; if there are more building defense than CD, 1"shadowwalk" has more effect than 1 fireball or 1 cat.
3) you are at war with the guy.(a shadow, in friendly territory, with shadowalk is.... wow, incredible !, any defense due to archer range, walls, palisade, dungeon, barracks.. it is a LOT of +10%, +20%)
and then, even if you took out 80% of the defense, leaving 20%, half being building defense, 10% defense less is still nice. It's maybe not worth a lvl2 spell, but it is still nice.
In the end I think blur is OP (especially as a lvl 1spell).
shadowwalk is either worth a low quality lvl2 spell, or worth a normal lvl1 spell, but is counted as lvl2.
Shadowwalk combined with blur in 1spell is OP, but because blur is OP, not because of shadowwlak, but because of blur.
that's a non-argument.
and if you are fighting ships with ships, airI is better than dance of blades(that applies only to living units)...
but do you know many stacks without at least 1 unit with drill promotion ? or a stack without any archers ?
NeoMega : you are supposing :
1) you have access to many catapults/fireballs, enough to raze the city defense in 1turn.
or you have a sea access to the city. (blur+shadowalk needs at most 1mage+ 1adept, while 4-6fireballs needs 4-6 mages... much more economical.)
2) the ennemy city has lot of cultural defense ; if there are more building defense than CD, 1"shadowwalk" has more effect than 1 fireball or 1 cat.
3) you are at war with the guy.(a shadow, in friendly territory, with shadowalk is.... wow, incredible !, any defense due to archer range, walls, palisade, dungeon, barracks.. it is a LOT of +10%, +20%)
and then, even if you took out 80% of the defense, leaving 20%, half being building defense, 10% defense less is still nice. It's maybe not worth a lvl2 spell, but it is still nice.
In the end I think blur is OP (especially as a lvl 1spell).
shadowwalk is either worth a low quality lvl2 spell, or worth a normal lvl1 spell, but is counted as lvl2.
Shadowwalk combined with blur in 1spell is OP, but because blur is OP, not because of shadowwlak, but because of blur.
russelcoight
Chieftain
- Joined
- Jun 24, 2010
- Messages
- 17
I don't like some of the buffs you gotta micro manage however most are rank 2 and you can afford to leave a mage on auto cast.
I think all the spells have niche uses. So they wont all be useful all the time. Though i wish water walk extended to the stack , thats probably the only spell ive had trouble getting much use out of (for a rank II).
I think all the spells have niche uses. So they wont all be useful all the time. Though i wish water walk extended to the stack , thats probably the only spell ive had trouble getting much use out of (for a rank II).
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