*Spoiler2* - Gotm19-Ottomans - Full Map - Mag+Grav

[Romulus]

Originally posted by Moonsinger
Well, my game isn't as excited as you guys. There wasn't much happened since my last report, except that I destroyed Rome and took control of all 8 luxuries.

PS: So far, I find it odd that no one used suicide galley to head for the other island before 1000BC.

I did at 850bc....do I get "extra credit"?

 

[Ambiorix]

My first report can be found here.

Okay, here's an idea : rather than just rambling about my terrible efforts at this level, how about a practical excercise ? After all, we ARE looking for ways to flatten the learning curve for people-who-might-be-interested-in-participating-in-GOTM, aren't we ?
I've uploaded my game at 790AD (176K), download it if you want (PTW 1.14).

The situation in 790AD is as follows : Rome and Carthage are furious beyond repair : too much warmongering and deal-breaking from my side, I'm afraid. The rest of the world is furious or annoyed as well, but still willing to trade (money talks).
I have the first 6 techs of the MA ('we are backwards'), 1211g +92gpt, and quite some luxuries.

Question to those who play higher up on the Olympos : how would you try to get this game back on the tracks again, and do you think the way I handled it made sense ?
To the others who are not that high on the Olympos yet : I just find this a nice example of how far you can get by trading.

Here's what I did :
Get education from India for spices, dyes, map and 126g, making him polite.
Sell education to Rome for map and 212g.
Get Banking from Egypt for silks, dyes, map and 328g, making her polite.
Sell banking to Carthage for Music Theory, map and 1g.
Get Astronomy from China for silks, dyes, map and 440g
Get navigation from India for silks, map and 256g
Sell banking and astronomy to Rome in return for gunpowder, ivory and 11g
Get Chemistry from Carthage in return for astronomy, map and 172g
Get physics from India for 51gpt and 7g (still seems cheaper than getting it myself)
Sell physics to Spain for mettalurgy and map
India is the only one who has Theory of Gravity but doesn’t want to trade. So sell physics to Carthage (for 172g), Rome (for 97g) and Egypt (303g), to get the price of ToG down and our own cash up.
Now we can get Theory of gravity for 18gpt and 661g.
Sell Theory of Gravity to Egypt for military tradition and 25g

This means I’m not in debt to any nation except India (silks, dyes, spices and 69gpt). I make a wild gamble and decide to sign a pact against them with Egypt, who is quite willing. I get Spain into the pact in return for Theory of gravity. I’m not sure if it’s wise to do or not, but I get Carthage along on my side in return for mil. tradition and theory of gravity. I wonder how the other civs will react, but Carthage and Rome seem to be without salpeter, and all civs would lose at least 1 active trade agreement with Egypt (which may be good or bad for them) according to F4. Still, I gain a lot. I decide to switch to full military unit production for defense. Suppose I’ll see an occasional galleon with an Indian knight or two…
I now have all middle age techs, except magnetism, economics, printing press, democracy and free artistry. Treasury has 42g, +102gpt. Small detail : need to hook up salpeter, but at least I *can*. To close the turn, I sell spices to China for 6 gpt, and dyes to Spain, also for 6gpt. I could get printing press in 9 turns, but decide to leave sciene on zero – I’ll need my income to build an army.

What do you think ??
Maybe this isn't the best educational example, but how about adding more 'practical excercises' like this, with .sav's from top players ??

 

[Ambiorix]

On another note : in GOTM18 Cracker clearly spelled out the connection between rivers and cashflow. If you look at this map, Egypt and China are almost without rivers, while India seems to have ample. that corresponds well with these civ's position on the tech ladder. If you combine this with the hints cracker gave about city-placement preferences of the AI, you can go some distance already in predicting a civ's future.

 

[hotrod0823]

Looks like a good bit of trading except for breaking the 20 turn deals with India. It may hurt your chances of any future gpt deals with the other civs and may never be able to trade with India again.

Was getting the gpt back worth killing your rep with the other civs for quite possibly the rest of the game?

 

[Ambiorix]

Originally posted by hotrod0823
Looks like a good bit of trading except for breaking the 20 turn deals with India. It may hurt your chances of any future gpt deals with the other civs and may never be able to trade with India again.

Was getting the gpt back worth killing your rep with the other civs for quite possibly the rest of the game?

Well, nobody has joined India in the war, and they are going down fast. The other civs still trade with me for hard cash (no gpt) and luxuries. I got magnetism shortly after, btw, so I could enter the spoiler thread. I turned my own science to zero, sent a couple of galleys with Sipahi over to india, and took one of their smallest cities, triggering my golden age. I now (1000AD) have 2049g +247gpt and that basically could buy me all techs I want (haven't yet, though).
Further more, declaring war on India caused the 'inverse war weariness' amongst my citizens, which was a big surprise.

The story is unfolding as we speak. (Does this sound like CNN or what ? ). I'm producing lots of sipahi now, and plan to steal a tech from Hannibal, hoping he'll declare war on me.

My main point is that I considered the game lost in 340AD, while now I'm having lots of fun again.

 

[hotrod0823]

Absolutely,

Making trades like that is the most fun IMO but I never break the 20 turn deals. Personal preference and the year or so playing SG's where such deals are . Not sure if taking out India will help your rep or not. It very well could.

The reason I mentioin it is that in a recent SG game a player attacked Arabia early and broke a lux deal 10 turns into it. From then ~1000BC until about mid way through the game no one would have gpt deals that were reasonable. It made getting deals to work that much harder.

Good luck!

 

[LKendter]

170AD - Our free tech is engineering (got to love 1.21) and we use that to get Feudalism. We get Sun Tzu from our first leader.

190 AD to 770 AD - The Republic of the Ottomans enjoys a quite time of rebuilding military and infrastructure. First contact is made with Spain in 320AD. They give us contact with the rest of the world for Engineering (I really love 1.21 scientific). The biggest shock is the fact that we have saltpeter. We go into almost pure military mode looking forward to Siphai. The way of the scientist is abandoned in favor of cash for upgrades to Siphai.


810 AD to when AD - The domination wars begin.
810 AD to 980 AD - The first Carthage war begins and that gives me a golden age. During the fighting Murad I appears and we get Bach's Cathedral. With the war weariness problem I am happy to get 2 extra content people. During this time we get the excellent news that our future foes are weakening themselves as Egypt declares war on India. We sign peace as Carthage as been banned from our continent. We get Printing Press, Navigation, Theory of Gravity, Magnetism and $70. We thank Carthage for introducing us to the age via "pointy stick research".
The industrial age will begin with operation Rome, as I got the Carthage city right across the ocean on the Roman island.

 

[Greebley]

My previous turns

I realized I completely forgot to note that Rome declared war on me in my previous post. It was so not significant (as April Ryan might say). So there was a war with Rome which started soon before. Not that I saw any Roman units or anything. Perhaps great hordes of roman troops armed with blunderbusi were eaten by a giant squid. Who knows? Not I

I decided this next entry meant I needed to wait for this spoiler even though I am still in the ancient age:

610 BC: Success! My galley has crossed the sea and contact with Spain made. I start a massive trade fest. I get republic and currency and bought embassies with every civilization but Rome and now have more cash than I started with as well as world maps. The world is pretty much at tech parity and everyone knows each other. Start revolt and draw 8 turns of anarchy. Ouch!
590 BC: Entremont has the great library. Both the great library and the pyramids are on my continent. I certainly can't complain. Of course I don't have them yet. I connect up spices. I now have 3 luxuries.
550 BC: My galley sinks trying to get to unexplored isle near the Romans. I make peace with rome.
530 BC: I forget that the war with Rome raised happiness. Some cities go into disorder.
510 BC: Can't build embassy in Rome. I can't figure out why for a moment, but then realize it must be impossible to establish embassies in anarchy. Makes sense. Not sure I knew this before.
450 BC: Finally we are in republic. It appears I can go two ways from here. My research on Construction is 4 turns. I can go for a peaceful game, perhaps even try a "never declare war" game, which would mean racing up the tech tree from here. Or I can go for a bloody game. In this case I can set science to 0 and hope to capture the great library. This has the advantage of a better score. Hmmm... Since my last empire win was pretty darn peaceful with only a single middle age war and no leaders, and since civ scoring and therefore GOTM scoring emphasis is on effective early warfare (which I have already passed by), I guess I will try the war route. So I declare war on Celts. I upgrade warriors to swordsmen. I also invite Carthage to join me.

190 BC: Entremont falls to swordsman barrage. I take Great library. Get all ancient techs, monotheism, feudalism, and engineering.
110 BC: Mohos is taken.
70 BC: Lugdunum is taken.
10 BC: Camulodunum is taken.
30 AD: Build Alexmanika just SW of the north-most point (which will permanently end barbarian camps). Switch cities to market places as I think I have enough for the Celts and want these before further fights.
70 AD Gergovia is taken. Libraries rushed in the cities taken from the Celts for the border expansions.
110 AD I take Augustodurum and the Celts are no more. Hurry a courthouse in Entremont to see if I can build the forbidden palace there.
170 AD: First market built in Izmet and switches to a settler for the S border.
190 AD: Emanopidu built just south of the iron the Celts never got to. Aydin finishes a Market place and starts a temple
250 AD: I get Education. Great Library is obsolete. Raise science to 40% and start work on chivalry.
310 AD: I get Chivalry. Trade for Gunpowder. I seem to own all the Saltpeter on this island. I start heading for Mil Tradition and building up my infrastructure.
370 AD: I get Sistines chapel.
620 AD: I get Mil Tradition,
630 AD: I upgrade and start war with Carthage. Sabratha, Richborough, and Dacca captured.
640 AD: Veruliam and Hadrumetum captured.
650 AD: Leptis Magna captured.
660 AD: Oea captured.
680 AD: Theveste captured.
690 AD: Get a great leader. My plan is to rush a palace in Richborough, but first I need to build a forsaken palace near my current capitol in Uskadar. Carthage captured.
710 AD: Hippo captured.
720 AD: Utica captured. This is the approximate date I build the palace.
740 AD: Leptus Minor and Rusicade captured. Get Cadiz and Cirta as a peace agreement. Carthage is down to a single city and the war ends.
750 AD and later: As I am building up infrastructure after the war I decide to try for a diplomatic win. I can research pretty fast with my current setup. Besides I am not really going to compete with the war monger's fastest times as it is not my style and the date is probably already way past their domination win dates. So I plan to research at max This date is near the end of the Middle ages, so my success or lack thereof will wait for the next spoiler.

 

[Tex]

i didn't take careful notes, so i don't have accurate dates, but a few points:

found Spain ~400BC, traded around for big boosts in tech, full world map, brought my bank to 1k cash, cranked up the tech

alliance w/ Carthage wiped out Celts

was able to deny Carthage gunpowder, and boy o boy do Siphai cut through 2/3 mercenaries.

India is really dominating the other continent, they've taken out Spain and Egypt by the end of the spoiler time, but the score is neck and neck between Ottomans, India and Rome.

now the tough part: who's next? i'm thinking Rome

 

[Smirk]

I had two inner ring coastal cities so by 500BC I had built about 5-10. The east coast was safer since Rome and Carthage were also loitering around. I managed to get a galley with a settler over to Rome's island around 400BC, I then got a 20 turn deal with Caesar. He must have been really annoyed sitting on that island all alone for so long because next turn he declared war on me anyway. The single swordsman became elite pretty quick but died shortly there after when a stack of about 10 legions showed up. Lost that city.
I usually don't bother with that sort of thing but I had just completed most of my conquest of the Celts and had a spare settler and swordsman. I didn't lose much against Brennus maybe a couple swords, but I decided to wait until knights to take on Hannibal.

I cut thru the Celts pretty quick, they only had maybe 5-7 cities, most of them I kept some were too close to mine and I razed a couple. I refreshed me memory with the end game replay so the Celtic wars were in the time frame of 500BC-250AD. I got peace with them in there and let them sit with 2 cities that were down in Carthage terriroy. I planned to get a knight force before attacking Carthage. I also got sent out a few galleys to the other island and got contact with the rest of the civs around 600-500BC. India was building the lighthouse so I waited to trade contact until that was built.


I started my conquest of Carthage around 350AD, with about 20 knights and some left over swords (elites) and the rest upgraded Azaps, maybe 10 total. I had all 9 of my core cities building knights and I continued to do this for the next 400 years! Damn I hate Hannibal. Losses were so extensive. I lost at least 10 knights in my first attack on Carthage, only two survived from an entire stack, so I managed to kill 2 mercs with a stack of ~12 knights, 2-3 were elites. Carthage had both the Library and Pyramids so I wanted it intact. After taking it, it flipped at least 2 times since this war dragged on so long. I ended up not even caring about the resisters and just posting a knight (or 10) outside so when it flipped I could just retake it. All told I had at least 5 flips, once I got all the cities on the island I only had one more flip until I personally had to go and destroy his last city. I had an alliance with Caesar from the beginning of the war and all he managed to do was take a couple small cities that were on his big island and the small neighboring island.
In the beginning I pillaged every luxury and resource Hannibal had access to except horses which he settled on. All he built was archers and his UU, but that was more than enough since he made light work of (rough estimate) fifty of my knights during this war.

Hannibal was removed from my island around 740AD, and I completed MT research a few turns before but delayed upgrading so as to potentially make better use of my golden age. After a few turns upgrading the remaining small force of about 20 knights, I sent a galley full of Sipahi east to finish off Hannibal, and meanwhile I had about 3-4 full caravels heading west to attack Egypt. Egypt had a lot of land and cities but was one of the weakest civs. But I only targetting them because they were the closest civ by sea (other than Rome). After I got contact I picked sides in the wars I would create, and got Spain and China against India, which keep most of them in check on their island until the time when I could get there and take over. I also left Egypt alone hoping they wouldn't gear up their war machine and would then eventually be an easy conquest target. They were and at 890AD I removed them from the game. I had a bit of a culture problem starting with Hannibal and if you are interested in a Blinking Light show take a view of my replay, at least 2 cities changed hand per turn from 400AD on.

Once I had the landing force of Sipahi on the large island I declared war on Egypt and got a city and my golden age that same turn. I seemed to be making up for the major knight losses against Cleo and was taking at least 1 city a turn. Two or more when some flipped. I maintained the same strategy, just leaving the cities empty and taking them back with a single Sipahi. Compared to Hannibal, Cleo was a push over, she had at most 1 of her best defenders, the rest usually spearman. Cleo was destroyed in 890AD. I was also at war with India and had been since almost first contact, so I took a few of his cities along the way.
I also targeted Cleo's resources but I ignored some saltpeter that wasn't connected to Cleo's road system. But it *was* connected to someone elses, so she managed to get a musket whenever that city flipped. Although even with those few muskets and many flips, I only think I lost about 10. I had settled a city myself and rushed a barracks and had been rushing a Sipahi from there every other turn, and managed to sail over about 6 or so more caravels. The minimap below shows how many Sipahi I had during all of this, in this case there were 39 total. I doubt I had any more than 2-3 on the mainland although 6-9 were likely on-route elsewhere.

Once I knocked Cleo out I just continued to attack Gandhi's cities. I stayed at war with him and got Spain's help whenever the last one expired, just to keep her busy. China I let alone, they seemed to be taking heavy loses and I cut off their attack route and didn't want them running thru my territory of a ROP. I had also been sending some troops east to land on India's west coast so I was attacking them on each end. Their large cities took a toll, and they had a few cavalry and their elephants hanging around, but I expect most of their forces were in combat with Spain. One of the last cities on the India-Spain border had a horde of Spanish troops attacking it so India also was a piece of cake to conquer. I finished him off in 990AD with light losses.

Earlier I had begun to station the extra Sipahi on both Spain and China borders intending to attack them at the same time. I had more than enough troops over there and with the many elites I didn't expect much problem. China looked like they might declare war on me before I finished up with India and they had a lot of their Riders running around, but it seemed that it was the many barb camps popping up that were drawing their interest. This did later allow them an easy capture since I left all my captured cities undefended. India also built Sun Tzu's so after taking India out I waited two turns to heal all my units (which I hadn't been doing in cities so I wouldn't lose any) and then began my conquest of Spain and China. Up to this point I still hadn't broken any peace or trade deals. And this remained the case until I conquered the large island in 1070AD. Spain had 2 small cities in farflung spaces so I got the one on the Roman island in the treaty, abandoned it, then took their last city breaking my first deal. I got my first leader in 1020 and built my FP in Delhi in 1040. I got my second and last leader in 1040 and built Smith's around 1100.

After securing the large island I rounded up the troops and got the caravels in order to ship them over to Rome and finish the game. I had also been prepared for this on the mainland and had a settler and some troops ready to ship. I moved the troops from the mainland over and landed, then broke peace and settled my city and defended it with about 12 Sipahi. I had been ignoring tech since I got MT and only did minimum research for Smith's, which I got a while ago, due to the wars Rome was the only one who got into IA. And this was a massacre, Caesar was even attacking me with muskets and riflemen and *killing* my Sipahi. My city lasted two turns. The troops on the west a total of 16 Sipahi, all but 2 elites got massacred as well. After one turn I had 2 redlined elites, I managed to pillage two roads and then left them for dead and decided on a different route to victory. I had enough cities so I used the remaining troops on the large island to beat down the resistance and rush libraries, it didn't take much. I reached domination limit at 1200AD. I saved got a screenshot and then advanced the turn. Caesar had landed some troops on my island the last turn so in a bit of miscalculation of mine I was unable to kill them all. He took a city that turn and delayed the victory, the bastard. I was 3 tiles short, so after taking the city back I got the domination victory in 1220AD, with a score of 71xx or so. I should have just gotten peace with him, I didn't expect him to take a city, nor that a single city would prevent the win.


My research was pretty uneventful, I got Monotheism free which was ok since I only wanted to research up to MT, this way I was able to trade for Chivalry earlier and start the conquest of Carthage. I tunneled directly to MT and didn't get any help along the way. Caesar seemed to be the main researcher and stuck to the other path having Astronomy and Democracy available for trade once I reached MT. I didn't bother trading and at the end of the game I was still researching Physics (one scientist). As I was researching to MT I had been giving my techs to Spain and China both to help them do better against India and also as barter for the alliances against India. It didn't seem to matter much even with that help India seemed to be the winner, although only taking a few cities.


After watching the replay it seems all the Leaders were being made on the other island. India got two before I even made it to their island. It also appears Caesar had at least 3 bonus/hut settlers, and India looked to have an extra themselves, or a hut.

 

[BigBrother]

Things started to look pretty bleak for me there for a while. From about 200BC-600AD it seemed like I wasn't able to do anything. I was in a stalemate with myself. I was just getting gunpowder and was realizing shortly after that most of the AI civs had Military Tradition. (saw cavalry running amock in Carthage) So, I started to rethink my situation. I thought it best to stop even thinking about learning science on my own. So I cranked the lux slider to give me large amounts of gold.
Luckily, this is what saved me. I made a B-line straight for Military tradition with trading civs money for techs. Shortly after I did achieve MT. ANd boy should I say...

I LOVE THE SIPAHI!!!

Well, luckily, as I got my first Sipahi built, China declare war on me with a tribute demand of silks that I refused. They crept onto my continent and were ousted as soon as they took one step onto the continent. This obviously start a GA for me. Yay, my first one @ 1100AD...ugh. Through the GA I managed some 150-300 gpt income and quickly caught back up in the tech race. Going from 6-7 techs behind to maybe 1. I entered the Industrious age around 1200AD I believe, took a couple Chinese cities (gonna take Beijing when i get home this evening to capture Leonardo's, still need to make appropriate Sipahis though.)

So now, as the Inudstrious Age starts and my GA has ended I feel like I am falling behind again since techs are now costing 1000+ gold to buy...I'm gonna go back to researching on my own. Looks like it will take about 7-10 turns for most techs with my lux slider one % away from losing money (2.6.2 i believe). Carthage has artillery and Infantry now so my Sipahis attack prowess has been lessened but never-the-less, the AI is slow to upgrade its units.

My plans for this age will be to catch up and stay caught up in the tech race to Fission. (i want that dang UN! i think i still have a chance at diplo victory) Another plan would be to critically wound China and/or eliminate them)

Charthage has destroyed remaining Keltoi and India swept through Egypt like the plague. Took out 6 cities in one turn! But that left room for me to bring over a settler real quick to place a foothold on the large continent on my way to take over 2 china cities.

Anyways, I have some restored hope in my game again. I'll keep ya updated in the next spoiler if I survive. I know I can do it! (first ever game not on chieftain )

EDIT: Bleh, I can't remember the scoring table...i think it was

1-Carthage-----1442
2-India-----1440
3-Rome-----13xx
4-Spain-----12xx
5-Ottoman-----11xx
6-China-----9xx
7-Egypt-----4xx
8-Celts-----1xx

Ottoman and Spain might be swapped can't remember, but i have around 11xx points at the time i checked it last.

 

[Pikachu]

Here's the ancient history of the Ottomans. After they captured the Great Library from the Celts, the Ottoman people realized how backwards they had been because of the Emperors politics. He was immediately overthrown, and the Ottoman republic was founded.

The enormous treasury the Emperor had saved up for himself was now used to rush build lots of structures throughout the empire. When the money ran out the Senate suddenly realized that the leftover troops from the last war was a major drain on their economy.

They could of course have disbanded them, but figured out it would be better to use them to liberate the Celts. The rapid decline of the Celtic civilization over the last years proved that the Celtic government at that time was evil. (The Celtic decline could off course not have anything to do with the Ottoman invasions in the past.) Operation Celtic freedom was a success! Keltoi is now a part of the Ottoman Empire, and most off the Ottoman leftover troops was killed in the process.

Now the Ottoman economy was booming. New scientific advances were discovered faster than ever before and soon the Ottomans were ready to industrialize their empire.

 

[jack merchant]

After doing really poorly in the QSC (only 8 cities total) , I initially lost interest in this game and may not submit. I should really learn that having just one settler factory is not enough.

However, the bug hit me again and I did decide to play it out. The theme for this game, other than some pretty bad decisions, was pretty bad luck.
The tech pace was slow initially, mainly due to my early worker grab against the Celts which set back contact with Carthage for quite some time. I missed making first contact with Rome by one turn, and found myself behind by several ancient age techs. I did manage to get back to just-behind parity by researching ignored techs at max science, particularly maths, literature and currency. The free middle age tech recouped the brokering costs.

I was not able to get the republic until the early middle ages though, when one of my cities was empty due to the barb explosion and the Romans immediately dropped off a legion next to it. So I bought Republic from the Romans for 25gpt and they declared war straight after I was able to recapture the town with two horses nearby, and the phoney war continued.

My empire at this time consisted of the Ottoman lands and the Celt lands; I allied with the Carthaginians against them and destroyed them with swords. The Carthaginians didn't like me after that so they declared war too. They didn't seriously threaten me, so after inflicting some losses on them, we made peace. I did have to pay the Romans to make peace though so that I could revolt without getting into trouble.
After that, I went for an all-cash economy, buying and brokering techs where possible. My economy was rather bad because I had underestimated the corruption levels on a small map and so had built my cities too far apart. Also, I didn't get a leader for the FP so I had to handbuild it (next to the southern Iron hill), a process which took all of the Middle Ages. Keeping up became easier when the Spanish built the Lighthouse and discovered our continent (if the Romans had come before the Spanish in the turn order, I would have made first contact. As it was, all the contacts were spread around before my turn came up).

My capital had started on TGL late, and by the time I might have built it, it was too late to be useful. So I switched to Sun Tzu's instead, and at the end came into the enviable position of being able to choose between Sun Tzu, Leo's and Sistine. I went with Sun after some consideration. I had enough native luxuries to not need Sistine and too few troops tto require Leo's. The cascade ended before Bach's, fortunately, so I was able to build that too with an inadvertent bank prebuild.

While building Bach''s a suspiciously large number of Carthage troops entered my territory, so I bought metallurgy of them for 45gpt and ordered them out. War again They came in near Entremont, where I had been building up some knights already. However, the combat luck was throughout this war, rather horrible. In one turn, I lost two vet knights attacking against two regular swords on grassland; in another, I lost a 3hpknight, an elite sword and a vet Azap against a vet Numidian on grassland. Finally, after I had captured Gergovia ( with the horse and saltpeter), the Carthaginians snuck in with a lone vet knight and beat the fortified vet musket in size-7 Entremont, attacking across a river, and burned the city to the ground
I did capture their jungle city near the spices after that and then made peace because my forces weren't up to a prolonged war yet.

At the end of the Middle Ages, my FP finally came online, adding 50 gpt to my 300gpt income. My economy was already prettty good now with me selling saltpeter and luxes around, so I now bought my way to the Industrial Age (790 AD). Thanks to being the only scientific civ around, the nationalism slingshot earned me 1400 gold and 450 gpt plus a lux

I haven't had my GA yet; I'm thinking of triggering it against Carthage for a jumpstart on factories and hospitals. I can finally outresearch the AIs now so I will do that and go for space or diplo. Domination would be too much work at this point.

 

[scubagtr]

Is is very interesting how the AI fights itself in this game. Some or most of these posts talk about how India was taking over the continent or how Egypt is moving ahead.

In my game, I never knew India existed until I saw a message that said their civilization has been destoyed. Oh well, too bad for them. And then Spain and China went to work on Egypt and took them out.

I did however, use thier wars to my advantage. They seemed to like razing the Indian and Eqyptian towns, so I keep moving settlers over to fill in the holes. I have taken over ~ 25% of that continent by simply sliding my settlers in whenever a spot opened up, with not a single shot being fired.

Now, as far as my continent, I was off to a very slow start (~5 cities by 1000BC) ,due to early wars (which only caused me heartburn) and losing several settlers and workers trying to get the luxes. So I settled back and attempted to build my empire and survive long enough to get a good score or at least have some fun before my empire collapases.

Well, patience paid off, upgraded all my horseman to Silphi and went on a rampage. MPP with all Civs and attacked Celts - Now they are dead. Then Carthage decides to attack me, just after we've had a wonderful successful war against the Celts, so I again team with Rome/Spain/China and take out Carthage - so sad - too bad - see ya!!!

So the continent is all mine, except for 2 pesky little Roman towns that they captured. That seemed OK for the moment, but turned out bad later on. Details in the next spoiler, but I'm sure you can guess.

So at this point, I have moved from last to 1st in score, but still woefully far behind in technology, but I have a lot of land (however - very unprotected on the Spain/China continent), and a lot of military, however very technolgically behind, but you would be surprised what my Silphi have cut down. It's out of this spoiler, but let's just say that there is no unit type that has not died at the hands of my Elite Siphi.

 

[Qitai]

Submitted my first game (previous attempts did not finish).

Finish the game already at 710AD by conquest.

Started with ICS with Capital 2 north after seeing the cattle. Had 12 Cities, 11warrior, 3 swordman, 16 workers and in Monarchy by 1000BC. Max research all the way after realising we are on island. The AI's pays for my research. I sold tech whenever they can pay me more than 20gpt and boast some of them if they have a chance to help me move the tech faster. In the end, they only help in Feudalism and Banking (and non-critical music).

Started war around 350BC and almost never stop since then. Keitol/Cath goes first. Followed by Rome, finally the other 4 civ on the other island were all killed in the last 2 turn of my victory. Left them alive as I am getting happy citizen from the war. Spain and Eygpt decided to war me on the same turn while my troop were on my way to India while having a RoP with me. You get happy citizen whenever war is declare on you and can keep it if losses are kept to a minimal.

Short Summary of timeline

~800BC FP build next to capital.
~500BC Middle Age
~430BC Contact with Spain and others with suicide Galley (3rd Attempt). Non-event since I have all the Tech. And they are still unable to provide gtp deals.
350BC War Keitol
210BC Peace Keitol for one city. Keitol has only one city left
10AD War Cath. 9 Sword, 21 horseman. Had chivary and 1000gc for upgrade but troop is in place and I need to rush a barrack at the frontline. Upgrade as the war progresses. Capture Pyramid.
90AD Switch to Replublic. 4 turn research ever since (was 6). Was researching Chemistry at this point.
110AD GL for Palace. Was going to do a Palace Jump on the same turn. But GL allow a better location.
230AD Peace Cath for 2 Cities. Cath has only one City left. Later expand to 3.
250AD Keitol Dead
320AD MT Researched. Convert 14 knight to Silphi.
380AD War Rome
470AD Rome Dead
530AD Spain/Eygpt sneak attack my silphi enroute to India. 32 Silphi at this time.
540AD MP with China/India/Cath
580AD Spain left with one city
590AD Start hitting Eygpt
650AD Eygpt left one city. Start hitting India on same turn since there was 14 healthy Silphi left after capturing 3 Eygpt cities on that turn. They capture 4 India city that turn.
670AD India left with one city with Cath on the same island
680AD War China
690AD China Dead
700AD Killed India/Cath/Spain/Eygpt on this turn for Conquest Victory. Had 57 Silphi by this time. Reason for the incredible speed of attack. Surprise myself as well.

Typically 3 silphi can take down one city. Some cities has only one defender and one silphi is sufficient to take it down. Almost all troop are available for attack having setup the infrastruture for mobility. Minimal defensive troop is builded.

Did not remember if I encounter Gallass since my ironclads/privateers kills any ship on sight. And the FoG actually became a great help to limit my patrol area. I had 12 Galleons, 8 Ironclad and 3 Privateers at the end.

During my wars, I realise I could not upgrade swordmans and use them to fight several less ideal fights killing all except three ( I started with more than 20 before conentrating on horseman). Then I read in the forum I could upgrade using SHIFT-U!! But too late. Anyway, by that time, Silphi is out so those slow troops will not reach the attack site in time anyway.

For island hopping, I scan for the closes point between islands and build cities on both sides of the island and place some ship there, giving me the mobility I need. Troops are move around between islands in a turn without lossing the troops mobility at all (The reason for having a port city there).

China/India Barely got into IA before the game end. The rest never got into IA. So, my wars deals with a combination of musket/pikeman/spearman with roughly same distribution. Part of this maybe due to me keeping the AIs cash dry which prevents most upgrade. All are a walk through for the silphis except for musketman who sometimes kill a silphi or two. Also, enter into MP with China and India when Spain/Eygpt war me. So, that exhaust their troop as well.

For economy, I got 5 luxury easily after killing Cath and Kei. Had trade deals for the remianing 3 if I have not already conquer them. So, I have all the 8 luxury most of the time. And the war with Spain/Eygpt gives me another 2-6 happy citizen depending on size of cities. So, I had WLTKD at 0% luxury and without MP for size 6-7 cities. Had also plan the FP near the palace with palace jump intention right from the beginning. In the end, never did the Palace Jump since I got a GL. Disband the old Cap anyway when my civ grows, since I had it all plan out that all land it uses can be use by a neighbouring city. Did not build any Wonder except using GL for J.S. Bach and Sufferage since I had nothing else for the other two GL I got. I intentionally left the wonders to the AIs since this is a continental map and I need some of those wonders to be on specific island. Further, all wonders will be mine eventually. 4-8 more silphis can easily capture whichever city that builds the wonder I want ;>

 

[Rowain deWolf]

v1.21f


Part1


– The Middle Age or The Rise and Fall of Hannibal;

510 BC several things happened. A) We learned Construction and entered the Middle Age getting Engineering for free. B) he Palace expands and C) Our peaceful existence got in danger as Carthage declared War .

490 BC Since I was not really prepared for a war I signed a MA with the Celts for Construction. Additional I sell them Engineering and get Monarchy + 50 gold; I then bought an Embassy in Rome and tried to get an MA with them too but Caesar asked for too much.

470 BC
IT: One of the carthagian warriors suicide on Antalya but the other 4 turn to move towards the Celtic land. Till the end of this War I never encountered another carthagian Unit.

450 BCKafa as the last City founded;

350 BC second Galley finished. The first was lost to a 1hp Squid so I hope this one will last longer. Anyway that’s the last naval Unit I built for a long time.

330 BC Kill the first fog ;

310 BC Second fog removed; cyan-border spotted; move the Galley father East and Contact with Spain; Deal-time
Engineering to Spain for Republic + Contact with India + 20 gold + TM;
Construction to India for Contact with China + 1gold;
Construction to China for Contact with Egypt + TM + 19 gold;
Engineering to Egypt for WM + 15 gold;

Science to 80% Feud in 4 by –14gpt / 85 in treasury;
IT: The Galley sinks but has accomplished it’s task:

250 BC Feudalism learned; start Invention and hope that the AI will research the upper path;
230 BCRevolution started 6 turns;
190 BC Celts have 3 Workers for sale but for the moment I refrain from buying them.
170 BC Spain completes Lighthouse so they will have full contact soon;
130 BC We are now a Republic; For one turn I leave the Science at =% to gain some money;
90 BC Science up to 60%Invention in 10 at –10gpt;
Engineering to Rome for 57gold +Wm; Alliance with Celts ended. The Celts have now Monotheism but at Monopoly-prize it is too expensive.

70 BC India completes Great Wall; All AI switch to Sun-Tzu;
50 BC Spain has now Monotheism too so Feud + Rep to Celts (that may help them a bit vs Carthage)for Monotheism + 2gpt + Wm; Peace with Carthage for Contact with China; And a nice Contact-deal with Spain:

30 BC Istanbul starts FP;
90 AD Invention learned Gunpowder started
250 AD Gunpowder learned during the last IT; Deals:
Gunp to India for Chivalry + 60gold + 26 gpt (with this starts the ‘get the AI’s money phase)
Gunp to Spain for 20 gold + 19 gpt
Gunp to Celts for their 3 Workers (as they start now losing more and more cities;
Science to 80% Chem in 8 turns Lux to 20% income –10;
320 AD IT: Chem discovered Metallurgy started
330 AD India has Theology so : Chem to India for Theo + WM + 38gold + 12 gpt; Science at 80% Metallurgy in 8 –18gpt and 154 in treasury;
IT: During the last turns one lonely Carthagian Longbow has moved in Ottoman-territory. Now Hannibal demands Chemistry I decline and he declares War and captures one of the Celt-workers; This Wardeclaration allows me to lessen the Lux-tax Metallurgy now 1 turn sooner;
350 AD Spain demand and get 23 gold + TM; first Azap-Inf finished
370 AD FP finished;
390 AD IT: Metallurgy learned Mil Tradition started; Science for 1 turn to 0 to earn 242 gold;
410 AD The Celts are down to their Capital and the two Cities on the Roman-island; Peace between Carthage and Celts;
440 AD Mohacs flips back to the Celts;

450 AD Education is now known by several AI’s; Deals:
Chem to Egypt for Education + WM;
Metallurgy to India for Printing Press + 33 gpt;
Metallurgy to Spain for 31 gpt ;
Mil. Trad in 5 by +76gpt;
470 AD I decline a Demand for Silks from Brennus and he promises me:

490 AD Mil. Tradition learned; Banking started (in 7 at +78) 1 Knight upgraded 2 Sipahi rushed;
510 AD first Sipahi wins and we have now a Golden Age; Banking now a lot sooner;
530 AD IT: Banking learned Economy started;
550 AD Carthage completes Sun-Tzu and Spain Sistine Chapel;
Machiavelli lists the largest Nation; The ottomans are ranked third behind Carthage and India; Since now more and more Sipahi are built I guess this will change soon
560 AD capture Lugdunum;
570 AD IT: Economics learned Astronomy started due in 4turns; Science at 70% income +48gpt 739 in treasure; Aydin starts my first Wonder : Smith;
600 ADSign a RoP with Celts;
610 AD IT: Astro learned Physics started due in 4 turns; Science at 70% +41gpt;
620 AD Egypt completes Leo India completes Copernicus;
640 AD Camulodurum (another ex-Celtic-city) captured;
650 AD I have now 5 Luxuries and set the Lux-tax to 0%;
IT physics learned ToG started in 4 at 70% and +33gpt;
670 AD
Deals: Economics to India for 130gold + 52 gpt;
Economics to Spain for 56gold + 23 gpt;
Sogut uses a Sipahi as prebuild for Newton’s Uni;
680 AD Hannibal asks for peace but he won’t giva up any City so the War continues;
690 AD IT: ToG learned Magnetism started (in 4 at +109 gpt); Sogut switched to Newton’s;
710 AD End of Golden Age; Income drops to 67 gpt;
740 AD Sabratha and Gergovia are captured; Magnetism will be known during the upkeep-phase ;
End of Part2;
Land:

Rowain

The other continent has been peacefull till now.

 

[Checkmate13]

Some really impressive victories there.

I cant remember many details from my game off the top of my hed but I do know it was slow going. Wiping out the celts i my major achievement pretty much all game so far and unfortunately carthage got all the the good cities

By the time I entered the industrial age I was almost an AGE behind.. for some reason no-one wanted to trade techs with me and so I had to research everything by hand.. most techs took me ~5-6 turns because everyone else had them but by the time I had siphai - didnt even think about making a beeline for them[1] - lets just say they were obslete by then. So I attempted to take on carthage by sheer force but managed to just hold on to status quo (so sad, i know).

Honestly my target is to keep my civ alive by the end, every other civ has considerable power.
Spain got knocked early on and china has been living off one city for a LONG time. India is the superpower.

So yeah I guess its a case of live and learn. Ive got to do more stuff like mass upgrade warriors to swordsmen and trade smartly if I want to pick up my game - my problem is although I know the game rules inside out. I have no decent strategy that works (at least fairly) consistently at this level and don't I goal set.

Usually my strategy is get the closest,weakest civ and try and take them out and if that dont work wait until the next round of "hardware" and try again.

Still its fun being able to compare what I've done with other players

[1] Not thinking being a common theme in this game - yay for living for the moment!

 

[Mongo97]

v1.21f

Well, I don't have a detailed write up, so I'll just toss out random notes and thoughts from my game so far...

After having my spirits boosted by attempting to play on Monarch and winning recently, I figured I may have a chance of surviving and possibly thriving this time around.

The first main difference between my game and others I've seen is India is pretty much a non-factor, hanging out with only 5 cities. As far as I know, there were no major wars with them, so I'm dying to see the replay to see why they've been so crammed in there.

I've surprised myself by staying close with tech. I've been buying and trading for it all along, though I noticed most of the other civs made the jump to the next age while I was trying to build an army to hit the Celts with. Again, though, I can't seem to get ahead or close enough to be able to get the tech and build the wonder that comes with it before someone else nabs it, so I'm wonderless and culturally lacking, though I've lost only one city so far via a flip.

I'm currently around 1100 AD and am just a few turns in to my war with the Celts, who have been falling pretty fast. I'm 2nd to last in points, leading only India. But, I'm close tech-wise, and might be able to pull of domination before anyone can pull off a space race on me. I'm keeping my fingers crossed....

 

[Bolan Longpants]

I was lucky with one of my galleys. Becuse I already lost 2 galleys in the fog to the east I decided to send one ship to the west. Although it sank I watched a chinese worker building a road and I could make contact. During a huge trading round I was able to buy all contacts, a world map and lots of techs. After this trading round I was on tech parity with the Spain and India; the rest was lagging behind. I started building knights for my upcomig war with Carthago. As soon as I was able to buy military tradition I ugraded my knights to sipahi's and I declared war to start my golden age. I bought the Romans and the Chinese into the war but stupidly I made peace before our 20 turn deal expired. After the second declaration of war I was able to erase Carthage of the world map. Carthago just finished The Art Of War so at least I got a nice bonus . Did I tell you I love to own a continent?

At the end of this spoiler thread I'm still waiting for my first leader. And I really need one since I didn't build my Forbidden Palace yet. Somehow getting elites is harsh in this game and the ones I had were killed in 'easy battles'. I reach the end of this spoiler thead just before 800AD when I purchased ToG from Spain to enter the industrial age.

 

[Txurce]

I entered the Middle Ages by building the GL in 270BC. I continued to focus on infrastructure, intending to go to war only after I researched chivalry. (I blew away the AI in research throughout the medieval period with my 13 cities, and spent all my surplus gold on rushing libraries and universities.) Rome attacked me periodically from 150BC-370AD, until I upgraded enough swords to Azaps to scare them off for the rest of the era. I picked up the republic in 70AD, and became a republic in 170AD. This is later than some players, and was dictated by my conservative decision to leave research to the GL.

It took me until 420 to build six or so knights who, together with a handful of Azaps, attacked the Keltoi. My cities were all caught up, and only built more knights. My GA kicked in with the building of the Sistine Chapel in 600, and one turn later I gained my first GL, which gave me an optimally placed FP in 630. One turn later I made peace with the Keltoi, who were now reduced to one offshore city. (I wasn't able to trade for contact with the other AI until 320, but they were all behind me. Spain was eliminated early in the medieval era, and the remaining three civs on that continent remained fairly even, with China trailing.)

I researched MT in 680, and blitzed three Carthaginian cities with my Balkan Dragoons in 730. One of these gave me Copernicus. A fourth city on my next turn gave me a second GL, and now I had a choice: did I build Newton’s in this big resisting city, which was in the first ring around my FP? I decided to do so, which required quickly starving it down to size one, then irrigating like crazy to build it back up (as well as rushing every needed improvement). By 800, when my GA ended, Carthage was on life support, in existence only because I had quit building Sipahi, and had to wait for them to heal before attacking anew. The unconquered cities never proved to be very productive, so I don’t think purposely delaying hurt me.

My questions in the medieval era have to do with how to best accelerate the tech rate. I had a healthy dozen cities doing all the heavy listing until I built the FP in 630, and it took me a while to develop the cities around the FP. For comparison, Tao entered the industrial era at the same tiime as me, after building his FP at the same time as me, while Shillen jumped his palace in 270, and entered the industrial era in 550. There’s an obvious connection between the number of productive cities and tech rate… although I have no clue how Aeson (or Qitai) researched as fast as he did without an FP. Weren’t most of Aeson’s cities corrupt and relatively worthless? (Shillen also aggressively gifted techs in the medieval era, while I waited until the industrial era to do this, because I was mistakenly afraid of not getting the wonders I wanted.)