Stability Issues

[Pewp3w]

Hey, i started some games in RFC:Europe, i played with Norseman, Arabs and Portugal.

My stability was always somewhere between +15 and -5, never worse, and there was no unrest in any of my cities, still some of them declare independence. As Portugal i took Sevilla and Cordoba from the almohads. I gathered all of my troops in Cordova to attack Spain, but one round before my attack the city declared independence together with my colony in marocco, although i had +3 stability and 6 Knights, 4 Knights of Avis, 2 crossbowman, 2 pikes and 12 catapults in the city. They all were lost. In my colony in marrocco i had a crossbowman and a knight of avis.

What can i do against that? And i heard, that there is some modmodmod that gets rid of stability or something, because i seriously have no clue, how to get my stability even higher ( because thats what have to do, it seems), and what exactly influences stability..

 

[Morholt]

Secessions can happen rarely when your stability is below 0 and more often when it is below -5. Generally you want your stability to always be above 0. Norse is actually very difficult to keep stable, you basically have to spam stability buildings everywhere.

The most important ways of improving your stability is:
-Stability buildings: Manor houses, Courthouses, Castles, Night watches all give a permanent +1 to stability every time you build one.
-Cities: Provinces that are shown as Solid (ctrl-hover on the map to see provinces) give extra stability for every city you build or conquer there, and you lose stability if someone else has cities there. Building or conquering cities in Unstable provinces gives a large stability penalty. Also you get between -2 and -6 for unhappy cities.

 

[Pewp3w]

I never build in unstable provinces. So, if there is a city in a province that is stable for me, but the city is not mine, i do lose stability? Or only if i have a city in a stable province but there is still another city, that doesn't belong to me?

 

[3Miro]

I never build in unstable provinces. So, if there is a city in a province that is stable for me, but the city is not mine, i do lose stability? Or only if i have a city in a stable province but there is still another city, that doesn't belong to me?

If you have a city in a stable province and there is another player's city in that same province, you lose points.

If there is a stable province without a city of yours, then you don't lose points.

 

[Pewp3w]

If you have a city in a stable province and there is another player's city in that same province, you lose points.

If there is a stable province without a city of yours, then you don't lose points.

What about Religion? Does this give any boni? I guess if i have a non-state-religion in one of my cities this decreases stability, right?

 

[3Miro]

What about Religion? Does this give any boni? I guess if i have a non-state-religion in one of my cities this decreases stability, right?

Non-State religion decreases Stability. Only Orthodox as a State Religion boosts the stability.

 

[mluo2010]

Serbia (Beograd/Belgrad) seems to always secede from me - it's happened with Hungary and Bulgaria so far in all of the games I've played with them. With Solid stability, and choosing the biggest bribe to try and get them to stay. Thankfully I usually only need one unit in it so I can just run in and take it right back. But it does seem kinda odd that it happens every time.

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RFC UHVs on Monarch: Dutch, France, Carthage

RFC:E UHVs on Monarch: Portugal, Bulgaria, Burgundy, Hungary

 

[Mowque]

I saw way too much good stability in my last game.

 

[AbsintheRed]

I saw way too much good stability in my last game.

Or too few wars
More wars would overally mean much worse stability

 

[amrod]

I also had problems with Norse, as their UHV requires to capture very distant cities, lowering your stability. My problem is, there is very little time, so I had to practically build military units and ships most of the time. There is hardly time left for building stability buildings, and generally for any enjoying of gameplay (founding new cities, building up stuff, conquering more empires). This would probably be less of a problem in a marathon speed or such, but I understand it's a lot of work to do (Sword of Islam did though). (Also on my first game I didn't realize that building Vinland is not a city but a project, and I was looking on the map for new foundland )

 

[AbsintheRed]

I also had problems with Norse, as their UHV requires to capture very distant cities, lowering your stability. My problem is, there is very little time, so I had to practically build military units and ships most of the time. There is hardly time left for building stability buildings, and generally for any enjoying of gameplay (founding new cities, building up stuff, conquering more empires). This would probably be less of a problem in a marathon speed or such, but I understand it's a lot of work to do (Sword of Islam did though). (Also on my first game I didn't realize that building Vinland is not a city but a project, and I was looking on the map for new foundland )

It's a though question
The goal is to balance that the game is still enjoying - not just a rush everywhere - but all UHV are still challenging enough
Also, every person's preference (and game level) is different on what's the perfect amount of these two things
If the general opinion is that the Norse UHV deadlines should be lightened, then we will do it of course

 

[3Miro]

We should specify Vinland Colony in the Norse UHV.

The time for the various UHV conditions are tied to the European Timeline. All dates have to be related to important dates in European History. The Viking age officially ended in 1066AD with the Norman conquest of England, so it is unreasonable to have goals past that date.

 

[Sian]

something that would help Norse would be an ability to sail through Codorba without declaring, so they easier can get a small army to Sicily

 

[Science Rules]

How about starting the Norse earlier so they have time to build infrastructure before they go raping and pillaging? I know an earlier start date is ahistorical, but it might be better from a game-play perspective.

 

[amrod]

How about starting the Norse earlier so they have time to build infrastructure before they go raping and pillaging? I know an earlier start date is ahistorical, but it might be better from a game-play perspective.

Could be good. A game can't be too realistic and enjoyable at the same time. We have to consider that every game turn is in reality several years. IRL they produced a whole army in a year, while here a single ship is produced in 4-5 turns. There's nowhere the great viking armies.. I seem to need about two ships with 4 berserkers to capture most cities except early ones. And by the time Normandy is settled, the French have a larger army than I have (and it would be unhistorical to settle there myself, though gonna try that tactic too).

Otherwise I came near to completing the UHV, except for Normandy, which was taken back from me, and some cities rebel (I started building manors in my latest game, but it leaves less armies). Maybe something with stability enhancement?

Also, as far as I remember of history (not much of vikings though), the settlements the Vikings captured in far away places had become pretty much independent places (Normandy, Sicily, Iceland etc). You can't rule Sicily from Scandinavia, with hostile countries in between. So in Civ4 terms it could mean capturing those cities then clicking on the "grant independence" button. You could still house troops there to defend them, but wouldn't have to mind about stability and city management.

 

[amrod]

Ah, also: I haven't seen any ships outside of the Mediterranean, and even there only a few. (Just because of the Viking points). Also, the only good place for pillaging is in France (as in Britain I'd like to keep those cities producing more armies, though they are slow to get to it, they can build at least two berserkers)