Stepping up from King

[Adooombray]

Never really played beyond King in previous Civ's, but, I just really like Civ 6 and it is the game I am looking to take it to the next level. I recently tried my first post king game and I was so badly beaten that most of my opponents were rocking mechanized infantry when I was lucky to have muskets up. On a game I set to 10 player but deleted the 2 slots under me specifically so I could have room to grow (I played as Rome).

So I am wondering, what is the key to going harder at the later levels of difficulty? The best I have is to remain hyper focused and to fight early wars but I gave myself a ton of space and it still didnt help. maybe that's part of the problem? maybe I need to spend my cogs elsewhere? Maybe conquest, not space, is the point? I also tried builder > slinger > slinger > slinger > warrior but slingers are so bad I didn't really understand the strat. Seems an expensive upgrade to archer from slinger as well.

Help me put it together ya'll, I enjoyed Germany before the December patch but I have no loyalty to any particular Civ. If I can step up and conquer new Civ territory I am willing to play whoever. For the sake of a good post I'd have to say America with its early game boost is probably the one I feel most comfortable with ; open to recommendations for good civs to get me used to higher diff.

 

[ezzlar]

Infinite City Sprawl (ICS) and early zerg rush seems the way to go on higher difficulties.

 

[Kataklysm]

I play on Emperor most of the time and win maybe 1 out of 4-5 games... so I'm not a top player because I enjoy multi-faceted games and tend to build too much facultative stuff.
Still, my advice would be to focus on your victory condition early on, but don't neglect early defense or aggression. Also don't bother too much about being way behind the AI until late Industrial/Modern era. Slower game speeds will also make it easier.

The big difference I found starting at Emperor level is that you'll have to start doing some more serious calculations and micro management to stay in the race. Counting turns, make things 'fit' (example: time one perticular policy unlock with what you intend to do 5-10 turns in the future). You won't have much room for empty turns, everything has to be optimized and interlock. Also do not neglect diplomatic visibility (if going for Wonders) and spying. Try not to build too much useless stuff and buildings (not easy, I like to have rich cities). City projects are worth it to catch back on culture and science.

You'll have to get quite a few games to find your zone.

 

[ShinigamiKenji]

I've been playing Emperor and consistently winning, so I might drop my 2 cents as well.

Much of the secret lies in the early game. The earlier you get an edge, the harder it'll snowball later.

• Micromanage food tiles early on, so you have more worked tiles and some more science and culture. 0.7 Science per pop might not seem much, but you'll shave off a good number of turns from the first techs with that alone.
• My usual build order is 3x Slinger > Builder/Warrior. By the time Archery hits, I usually have enough to upgrade at least those first 3 (sometimes I build another Slinger before Archery).
• Tech wisely. District costs rise with the number of civics/techs (whatever is more advanced), not by era, so you might want to beeline techs and leave some 1 turn before completion. A good tech beeline early on is worker techs > Currency > Apprenticeship (later techs depends on victory condition). For civics, I almost always go for Political Philosophy > Feudalism > 6-slot government.
• Speaking of techs, Eurekas/Inspirations lets you catch up with the AI, so try to actively get them. But if it's an important civic/tech, research it fully even if you can't get the Eureka in the short term. Also, don't hinder your progress just because of one Eureka.
• Take out barb camps as soon as you spot them. They give precious early gold and experience.
• Don't be afraid of war. I usually have 2 Warriors and 3-4 Archers when I first declare war, and it's usually enough to take down capitals before walls. Put cities under siege so they don't heal for better efficiency. If possible, conquest your entire continent, including CS (of course, spare the useful ones).
• If your enemy built walls, switch to Heavy Chariots/Horsemen/UUs and Battering Rams/Siege Towers/Catapults.
• Time unit upgrades for your next attack. A very powerful one is Chariots > Knights, for example. There's a thread discussing them for Deity, but I found it very insightful and greatly improved my gameplay.
• Don't try to build everything. Focus on your victory condition and plan accordingly. You need a much broader vision and foresight.

If you're feeling overwhelmed, I recommend challenging yourself on King to have very low win times for all victory conditions. I think the following milestones are good starters (Standard speed, Continents/Pangaea, Small map):

• 190 turns for a Domination Victory
• 230 turns for a Science Victory
• 175 turns for a Religious Victory
• 230 turns for a Cultural Victory

Of course, you're free to pick up a suitable civ and reroll your start. I recommend Rome, because their uniques are useful for almost all those conditions, but you might feel better to use Russia for religion, for example. I already did all those milestones on King before moving on, so it's not impossible.

 

[greygamer]

I find the larger the map the longer those turn times (for DV/RV) will be

 

[ShinigamiKenji]

Yeah, maybe some 20 more turns per additional Civ. I mostly play with those configurations, though.

 

[KmDubya]

Never really played beyond King in previous Civ's, but, I just really like Civ 6 and it is the game I am looking to take it to the next level. I recently tried my first post king game and I was so badly beaten that most of my opponents were rocking mechanized infantry when I was lucky to have muskets up. On a game I set to 10 player but deleted the 2 slots under me specifically so I could have room to grow (I played as Rome).

So I am wondering, what is the key to going harder at the later levels of difficulty? The best I have is to remain hyper focused and to fight early wars but I gave myself a ton of space and it still didnt help. maybe that's part of the problem? maybe I need to spend my cogs elsewhere? Maybe conquest, not space, is the point? I also tried builder > slinger > slinger > slinger > warrior but slingers are so bad I didn't really understand the strat. Seems an expensive upgrade to archer from slinger as well.

Help me put it together ya'll, I enjoyed Germany before the December patch but I have no loyalty to any particular Civ. If I can step up and conquer new Civ territory I am willing to play whoever. For the sake of a good post I'd have to say America with its early game boost is probably the one I feel most comfortable with ; open to recommendations for good civs to get me used to higher diff.

I'd go slinger x3 then builder. The benefit of slingers is that they get you the eureka for archery with a kill, are really cheap in cogs to build and are really cheap to upgrade to archers which are a dominant force for a long time. Getting slingers first will help in the case of a super early barbarian invasion while a builder will either get captured or just have everything pillaged. Pretty much any civ you meet early will declare a war of aggression on you, including Ghandi, so you want to have some archers as soon as possible for defense. It is then really easy to go from a defensive force of three archers to a conquering force of five archers.

Tech wise I go Animal husbandry>Archery stopping short of the eureka. Then tech whatever worker techs you need for your terrain.

The more bonuses that the AI gets at higher levels, the more important it is for you to take their stuff and use it more efficiently. On Emperor they get two cities and a builder at start. Let them build another settler while you build slingers to upgrade to archers. Then you go get their two cities and a free settler, possibly with a wonder or some districts already built.

 

[Victoria]

On Emporer I never 3x slingers now.

I will seriously keep an eye on my position and where barb camps can spawn from also taking into account CS and other civs.
There is normally 1-2 camps near that really cause all the grief and so I send my lone barb that way and likely go builder first.
A single barb will take a single spear camp.
Naturally you do need 3 slingers but if you can delay building some of them until you can get 50% off, it all helps.
There is some risk involved but hey, part of the fun of the game.

I would rarely try this on immortal and just never on deity unless really boxed in.

I am not going to repeat the other advice given. The city state guide will be out soon but basically is here and worth a read https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/what-should-be-in-a-guide-to-city-states.607452/

 

[greygamer]

On Emporer I never 3x slingers now.

I will seriously keep an eye on my position and where barb camps can spawn from also taking into account CS and other civs.
There is normally 1-2 camps near that really cause all the grief and so I send my lone barb that way and likely go builder first.
A single barb will take a single spear camp.
Naturally you do need 3 slingers but if you can delay building some of them until you can get 50% off, it all helps.
There is some risk involved but hey, part of the fun of the game.

I would rarely try this on immortal and just never on deity unless really boxed in.

I am not going to repeat the other advice given. The city state guide will be out soon but basically is here and worth a read https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/what-should-be-in-a-guide-to-city-states.607452/

Your original warrior can also do this and I often send it to the nearest camp

 

[The Highwayman]

I play on Deity and the key to the game is securing your land ASAP.

I build an early scout for recon, followed by my army (~2 additional warriors, 4-6 slingers upgraded to archers), mixing in a builder where it makes sense. If the neighbor Firaxis has inevitably placed right on top of my regardless of map settings doesn't declare war on me, I'm declaring war on them and taking free cities, settlers, and builders. A builder before the army works if you're not under duress immediately, as your city will become better faster and you can take better advantage of the +50% melee/ranged card (Agoge) for your armies, because you'll get the inspiration for related Civic from the builder.

-Use Scout to find new continent, meet 3+ city states, recon the AI, find tribal villages, etc.
-Animal husbandry -> Archery is a good starting tech order. Slingers are terrible, and only good for their cheap production and cheap upgrade to archers. 30 gold isn't really much to spend on 2-3 Archer upgrades, and you can hammer out the rest.
-Be mindful of Inspirations and Eurekas when teching.
-Kill your neighbor ASAP with your army. They'll get walls quick and eventually better units with their ridiculous bonuses. take out one at least. Park your units on farms where applicable to insta heal upon pillaging their tiles. As you take more cities, your cap and first expand can send reinforcements as needed and then start on more expansion and/or infrastructure.
-City states that don't give good bonuses and won't help your desired victory condition should be killed.

Any civ can use the above strategy. America is hit or miss with the whole "is anybody going to be on my continent this roll". In my first experience their +5 was near useless, but I've been on maps where it would have been great too.

 

[KmDubya]

On Emporer I never 3x slingers now.

I had a bad experience where my initial scouting (like 12 hexes around city) showed just two city states. I thought I was semi isolated on an Inland Sea map and prepared to REX. Next thing there's a half dozen warcarts popping up around my city. Sumeria was just beyond where I scouted. His attack ultimately failed due to American continental bonus but the city was one hit away from being captured.

Since that I always take care of defenses first and go for 3xslingers and archery tech with eureka every time. It protects me from barbarians, other civs and lets me transition easily into a conquest mode if desired.

My next round of scouting will be done by horsemen as scouts tend to get wiped by barbs when they crest a hill and find a few.

 

[Victoria]

I had a bad experience where my initial scouting

I did say "There is some risk involved but hey, part of the fun of the game."

 

[diamond geezer]

I did say "There is some risk involved but hey, part of the fun of the game."

Ah, but surely a successful strategy is built around minimising those risks...

 

[Victoria]

Ah, but surely a successful strategy is built around minimising those risks...

Nope, not with Civ. Its not about winning. Winning is not a challenge and doing things the same old way is dull. Last night I had a great game. The extra rule above my normal limitations - like not declaring war - was only 2 cities before turn 100. Still an easy win and will be looking more at tall then wide

 

[diamond geezer]

Nope, not with Civ. Its not about winning.

Even setting your limitations you are still looking to win. It's difficult to see what other definition there can be of success...

 

[Victoria]

You misunderstand, my bad

My target last night was to get every country to declare war on me.... I failed. Rome just loved me regardless. I was too nice to my closest neighbour too early.

When I said I won, I was trying to say that even with a 2 city start you can do well. The game is fairly easy once you have a good map.

 

[Adooombray]

Alright well, I spent the last few days trying to apply all the stuff shared here on a Rome game with a Large Map (... I just really like large maps for some reason, but I also understand it would have been easier playing on a smaller board)

I got the fast conquer on a neighbor - scythia - which got me 4 cities after nothing produced besides slingers, and I tried to move on a second enemy but didn't bring enough melee screen so I had to take peace.

I wont do the whole play by play but I ended up getting to 2nd in science, but didnt leverage the fast start enough. I probably should have kept warring - the bad habit is to care if the world thinks you are a war monger, which, it really doesn't matter at all if other civs like you in civ 6, i think - and when I was warring I should have had units pumping out of everywhere until I had a large enough army. I also let unit atrition too much with the loose barbarian because I understand now upgrading units is far superior to building new ones. that whole "focus focus focus" thing ya'll were hammering home is easier said than done lol. I fell too much in love with hammers and gold and didnt switch off when necessary.

TLDR I got beat to space race but I was in second place and it was definitely the best showing I've had in Civ 6 so far, so thank you all, this forum is far and away the best place on the internet for Civ talk (I just... cant... when it comes to Reddit ;p )

 

[The Highwayman]

@Adooombray Sounds like you're on the right track. Keep refining the strategy and it will click. Constant war can be distracting from expanding and city building--maintaining focus is key to optimizing efficiency. 4 cities at the start may be all you need from the AI. The more the better of course but you can still get to 15-20 total cities only taking 4-5 from AI and city states. That's more than enough to win a science victory pre turn 250 on Immortal/Deity (standard speed). The Science compendium topic is a great place to visit. GP projects are huge for flying through the Great People in the latter half of the game to speed up victory.

 

[ShinigamiKenji]

Nice to hear from you again, seems your play has improved.

One advice (which you probably have felt, but it's nice to point out for those who read the thread seeking to improve) is that while Slingers are good to produce, you don't need to overproduce them. 5-7 Archers will mostly do for the first neighbour. Once walls are up, it's time for Chariots/Horsemen/UUs to take place as city-takers (backed up by Rams, Siege Towers or Catapults). Archers then take a unit-killer role, which they excel until, well, Crossbows.

After you build ~6 Archers and 2-3 Warriors, you can begin producing Settlers, only stopping if you need more troops, or get around turn 80-ish, when you should have ~16 cities.

I just had my first turn-200 Science Victory yesterday with Rome, where I had 20 cities by turn 90. I took out China, Japan, Jerusalem and Kandy, which earned me 8 cities (and 2 free Settlers). But I had very favorable terrain (plenty of flat land between Rome and the other civs, and Kyoto had enough plains hills, population, disticts and trade routes to build the Spaceport in 16 turns).

 

[diamond geezer]

Personally I'm not keen on Warriors, which are weak and slow; I tend to produce a Builder 4th (unless there is an AI Civ next door) and hope to get access to something better for my 5th, or if no AI Civ near I might take time out for a Settler to grab horses, say. I'll generally buy a 4th Slinger just before Archery.