Suggestions for game

[Tusike]

Hi!

I'm playing as the Chinese on a huge map, Prince level, and was unfortunate enough to start out on a small continent with 4 other players. In the beginning I tried to get as much land as I could, and the had 3 civs sided with me and defeated the Japanese, so I could have more land. On my continent I'm the most advanced and powerful, although I only have 18 cities by 530 A.D. I checked all the coastlines and I won't be able to travel across until Magnetism. My main problem is that I'm advancing slowly and there's only 1 single luxury on the whole continent. After defeating Japan, I went to the next weakest civ, India, and started a war with them, with the other 2 by my side. I messed up a bit, as I moved all my soldiers to the east, and then discovered that the one Japanese city that I didn't get was actually conquered by the Indians, not the Zulu, so I was pleasantly surprised when a whole bunch of indian swordsmen appeared in the west... Also, I should've waited until Chivalry to start the war, and maybe not jump into it after the Japanese war.

Anyway, do you have any suggestions on what I should do? Defend myself until I get Chivalry and then go conquering or try to do it now? And how should I get advanced when I will probably need a few 10%'s on entertaining, since I don't have any luxuries?

Thanks for any suggestions!

-Tusike

Save: View attachment Mao of the Chinese, 530 AD.SAV

 

[capnvonbaron]

prince level? Sure you aren't confusing with CivIV?

And you can always cross ocean before magnetism; you'll just have to sacrifice galleys to do it. Use the numpad to move galleys against their will into treacherous waters. Again, you will lose most of them, but it only takes one successful galley to put you in business.

Also, what version of civ are you running?

 

[Tusike]

I'm using the normal one, no extensions.

I don't know what level it is, first I wrote Regent, then I checked and saw it as Prince and edited the post... anyway, it's the third easiest.

I'll try the galleys, although I'm pretty sure that my continent isn't near any other ones.

-Tusike

 

[Optional]

I just had a quick scan of your save, Tusike.
You really need to build more offensive units, not just spearmen. You have 26 spearmen, and just 1 swordsman. That's a real problem. Look at Osaka; there are 5 immortals around Osaka. What are you going to do when Persia attacks you? An immortal has an attack value of 4, while a spearmen only has a defense value of 2, so an immortal will win most of the time. Pikemen would fare a bit better of course, but the point is; you want to attack those immortals on your own turn instead of having to defend against them.
If you had swordsmen, then you can attack those immortals, which is attack 3 against defense 2, so that gives you a much better chance, especially if you have some artillery around for bombardment first.
I know you're at peace with Persia in this save, but Xerxes can easily declare on you when he sees an opportunity.

Another thing, quite important; build barracks, so that your units are veterans, not regulars. Veterans are stronger, because of their extra hitpoint, and your chance to generate a leader will be greatly increased, as the promotion path is shorter.

And maybe you should have been researching Monotheism > Theology > Education > Astronomy, as with Astronomy your ships can safely spend an interturn on sea tiles, which will increase your chance to meet other continents. And Navigation is only 1 tech after Astronomy, and that lets you go all the way. Especially the ability to trade for more luxuries will benefit your economy greatly here, as you had already realised yourself.
Oh, the chance of a ship sinking, if it spends an interturn in unsafe waters, is 2 in 3. So some luck is required.

 

[Tusike]

Over 1200 years have passed. I now rule the whole continent, after eliminating the persians, the zulu, the japanese, and the indians. I found all the other civilizations, and almost all of them were ahead of me technologically. After switching to democracy, and trading my monopolized wine to the others, I managed to get ahead of most, except maybe 1 or 2. In the histograph, America is still ahead of me by 200 points. All the others are behind. I think I will either go for space race victory or the diplomatic victory, although that may be harder. I don't know what I'm doing wrong, but if I manage to get a civilization Polite towards me, the next time we speak, he's annoyed again...
Thanks for the advice!

-Tusike

 

[capnvonbaron]

yeah, they'll go back and forth. Most of the time they'll be polite if you are in a war with a mutual enemy. Regent is third most difficult in my version. Prince is Civ4 I think. Anyways, doesn't matter. Good job recovering. Keep an eye on the histograph... if you own enough turf, you may be closing in on America's score little by little. You can always try and bribe all of America's enemies into a war against Lincoln too, if you want to be a real bastard

 

[Tusike]

What do you mean by "turf"? Also, I don't think I will be able to build any more cities since my island is completely civilized, and having an over-sea war in democracy... well, I don't want to do it. I don't know what the civilopedia means by "over time they'll get tired of war", it should be "they get tired of war in the next turn." Almost everyone like the Americans, and they too are oversea, so having a war with them isn't the best option. America will probably get more allies than me.

-Tusike

PS: Yes, it's Regent.

 

[Tusike]

Well that was exciting.
The americans demanded ecology and I refused, and they declared war on me. I tried to side allies, but was only able to win the babilonians. The next round, almost everybody declares war on the USA, including Greece, but Greece declares war on everybody except me and the babilonians. Then the babilonians step onto one of my islands and take my city there... The russians side with the US. Then I vote for myself and win the elections

Managed to score 2300 points, the US went down to about 2000. The funny thing is that I didn't see any US soldiers or ships, so I have no idea what that war was about. I didn't attack anyone either. I would've needed 6 more turns to win the Space race.

-Tusike

 

[capnvonbaron]

Good show!

Probably the whole world got tired of the Americans jerking them around. The Babs probably got everyone else in on the action; I've had that happen before, where I've pulled one civ into an allied war as a blocker, and all of a sudden the whole world has allied with them against the aggressor. The right AI can have an immense sway on alliances. They might have had a web of mutual protection pacts over there, too.

By "turf" I meant overall land ownership. Why did the Babs take your city? Thought they were your friends??

 

[Tusike]

I thought so too. They were very polite towards me, especially when they landed 3 tanks and a few marines on the island where one of my least important cities were, which I captured from the Persians 400 years ago.

I still don't understand the AI. If I were them, and had the option to abstain or vote for two other rivals, I would definitely abstain. Why would I want any of them to win?

-Tusike

 

[capnvonbaron]

I still don't understand the AI. If I were them, and had the option to abstain or vote for two other rivals, I would definitely abstain. Why would I want any of them to win?

one must suspend 'logic' when dealing with AI

 

[Sharwood]

one must suspend 'logic' when dealing with AI

As when dealing with the real UN.

 

[Optional]

I thought so too. They were very polite towards me, especially when they landed 3 tanks and a few marines on the island where one of my least important cities were, which I captured from the Persians 400 years ago.

Well, that's the way they are! They can even be gracious towards you, but still stab you in the back when they see a chance. Everybody learns this the hard way.

I still don't understand the AI. If I were them, and had the option to abstain or vote for two other rivals, I would definitely abstain. Why would I want any of them to win?

The AI doesn't know anything about win conditions. I think if you would play with just human players, there could never be a secretary general!
How I think they've programmed it: the AI votes for one of the candidates, unless they're furious with all of them, then they abstain. But I haven't tested that, so I'm not sure. It's certainly a good strategy to be in alliances against your main rival(s), as the AI will not vote for someone they're at war with, but are quite likely to vote for someone they're allied with.

Congrats on your win, Tusike! Well played!

 

[TheOverseer714]

Even an alliance against the other candidate is no guarantee if your other voter(s) are furious or even annoyed with you. They will abstain.

 

[Calis]

I still don't understand the AI. If I were them, and had the option to abstain or vote for two other rivals, I would definitely abstain. Why would I want any of them to win?

In this case the diplomatic victory condition would be nonsense...

 

[Sharwood]

In this case the diplomatic victory condition would be nonsense...

If it were altered so one had to vote, and for someone other than yourself, it could work. Provide an interesting dynamic, at least.

 

[absolute zer0]

One rather cheap way to win a diplomatic victory is this:

Save the game a few turns before the UN election they happen every ten to twenty turns, I forget. Go through with the election. This way you will find out who your opponent is. If you lose, quit the game and start back at when you saved. Get a military alliance with more the half the civs against your opponent. Then you will win because the AI won't vote for someone it is at war with. Unless a lot of civs abstain, but I have used this method before and it works real good.