Term 5 Courthouse

[Emp.Napoleon]

He overstepped his authority by appointing Rik Melet as the new ambassador to CDZ, something which is the authority of only the CoFA.

Has Rik even done anything with CDZ yet?

Does it matter? According to our current rules, the JoTC has no power whatsoever to act upon his findings, so we need to change the rules.

For this crime against the constitution, I seek a simple reversal of all the threats to the citizenry made by the accussed.

I will second this complaint. Nothing against Rik, but I will have to agree with Goonie, it is unlawful

 

[Hygro]

I would like to make this a class action suit. I too think that the rules have been a bit violating and I was ticked off to find out I had to reregister. The only positive thing was that I found out how many players/lurkers there are.

Rik, I like you, but you've overstepped your bounds. You aren't even an elected official.

 

[gert-janl]

The Term 5 Court believes the two Citizen Complaints have merit, and will now be considered by the Court.

The case of 'The People vs. Rik Meleet' will be marked CC#1.

The case of 'The People vs. Akots' will be marked CC#2.

Any future posting about these cases will be done in case-specific threads, and not in the general Court thread. Thank you.

 

[magnusmarcus]

Magnusmarcus, sorry you do not like me

Provo,

You imply I'm a mean, sour, and angry boogeyman....oooo scary.
Hows this for an exchange of ideas? I never said I don't like you. I just don't like wading through a pile of posts in no discernable order just to get to the meat of whats going on. I find it very counter-productive.
And I've posted my "exchange of ideas".....you just dismissed it out of hand as "embroyonic". I'm not a pacifist, I just think we need to make smart strategically sound decisions.
Now your choosing to ignore me? Whose close minded?

 

[Provolution]

Ignore those remarks yes. If you got some good points, different story.

 

[Goonie]

I believe the JoTC should still rule on my case against the CITIZEN rik melet. I have said this once and I have said it again, but clearly CT did not read it. This case is not about what Rik did as a Mod. I love his modding. I find it fair and justifiable.

If he wanted everyone to re-register with an email address, he could have simply made the poll required to ammend the constitution and none of this would be required.

Like I said in my open arguements. It is not about what the ammendement requires of us. AKA re-registering. It is about the way in which is it was implemented!.

I am PMing CT, for I fear she closed the complaint thread out of respect for Rik as a fellow MOD. I feel she did not read my statement where I stated this was not about Rik's actions as a mod, but rather a common citizen.

 

[Goonie]

@DoF
@Provo
@rcoutme(recruitme?)

You both posted in the other thread about the actions of Rik. What he was implementing. The very first thing I said in my arguement was to ignore that. What he was implementing was not the issue in this case, yet you all choose to make it the first thing you posted. What this case was about was the way in which he implemented the changes. The constitution clearly says he needed simply to post a poll and get a majority of the vote and the change would be legal. But Rik felt as a citizen he was above that and did not post a poll, even though there was already a discussion thread.

 

[Provolution]

Goonie,

It is easy, they make a temporary securtiy measure to close gaps, then we can poll it later. No big drama

 

[Goonie]

Your right. I am severly distraught it has come to this. Rik could have polled and by now it would be law. I am seriously confounded as to why he has not polled. I think it follows akots line of "this shouldn't be polled." Fear of failure? I am not sure...

Alas, even Bush had to get approval for the PATRIOT Act.

 

[gert-janl]

Goonie, consider CC#1 closed.

The mods consider it as questioning their authority. In order to maintain these forums properly everyone should adhere to the moderators. Therefore CC#1 is closed.

 

[Goonie]

Aye.

Rik, you know you will win the poll, so please just post it. Make it legal. Please.


akots, this sorta turned into a love in . Rwar!

 

[Yndy]

How can someone does not like you? We all like you! You are a very open and fun person and certainly have a tactical talent! May be just not enough PBEM and multiplayer experience. But this will come with time. Are you currently playing PBEMs? Or multiplayer games? Or Succession games? Or Game of the Month? This is very useful to develop your Civilization play skills and gain experience!

You are gifted akots, I give you that!

 

[Goonie]

Quite tactful!

 

[Provolution]

I still think it is in place to propose ones own ideas and work around these, or the game eould quickly die away in a cult worship of some senior players. Besides, there are other types of experience that are as applicable as any to any computer game or strategy game in general, and human psychology remains the same.
I prefer a game where people talk strategy and present tangible plans, not putting someone down to look good. I also prefer creative thinking and constructive inputs to destructive criticism.

 

[Emp.Napoleon]

The Embassy to Civ3Brasil would like to file charges against Citizen Goonie for causing unnecessary turmoil and problems in diplomacy with C3B.

[20:26] <TheCat> First of all, I must say the image C3B has of the average CFC citizen is based on GOONIE
[20:26] <akots> lol
[20:26] <TheCat> I know we might and we probably are wrong, but it was the very first contact we had with a CFC citizen, as per say
[20:27] <TheCat> I think the average C3B citizen couldn't be blamed for thinking they are radical
[20:28] <TheCat> and offensinve :/
[20:28] <TheCat> anyways, I'm saying this so you can better understand the things I'm going to put
[20:29] <TheCat> First of all, we really looked with distrust at the approaching of the warrior. We never lost sight that the alliance expired and if we didn't really move to renew it, neither did you.
[20:30] <TheCat> We blocked the warrior as a means to preserve our territory, and we never intended to attack it, disrespecting the UN.
[20:30] <TheCat> We sent you a letter asking for it to retreat
[20:30] <TheCat> What we got back was another letter which stated we failed on fulfilling the treaty and also that we wanted priviledges without giving them back
[20:31] <TheCat> I'm not even going to discuss those statements, they are not worth it. But it really didn't make C3B happy
[20:32] *** Saturno has quit IRC (Quit: Bye everyone, hope to see u again!)
[20:32] <TheCat> My wish as an ambassador has always been peace
[20:32] <TheCat> and good agreements to both side
[20:32] <TheCat> so I fight for them
[20:32] <@EMP> hoow does the letter relate to goonie?
[20:32] <akots> Same we can say about Emp
[20:32] <TheCat> But I want you to know that it might be more difficult than before, to get the agreements settled, after those happenings.
[20:33] <TheCat> It doesn't directly, Emp, I tried to explain. He just left C3B with a bad taste in mouth after the accusations
[20:33] <TheCat> Anyways, the only diplomatic point I want to put on behalf of C3B now is
[20:33] <TheCat> we have some credits left from tech trade.
[20:34] <@EMP> now I ahve a question on that
[20:34] <@EMP> about goonie
[20:34] <@EMP> if he had not said some of those things, would it had made CFC-C3B relations better?
[20:34] <TheCat> I don't think there's a lot to be explained about it. What he posted was there for everyone to read.
[20:34] <@EMP> as in did it make a substansal amount
[20:34] <TheCat> yes it definitely would, that is my belief.
[20:35] <TheCat> We don't like being offended.. as I believe no one does.
[20:35] <@EMP> ok well, we will deal with him
[20:35] <TheCat> It was a tense situation to both sides and it could have been better... if that hadn't happened.

When a case thread is opeaned up the embassy will post it's entire argument.

 

[Emp.Napoleon]

Ambassador Emp. Napoleon would like to file charges against Citizen Goonie in the basis that he violated Artical M by representing Fanatica in an unauthorized maner.

The evidence is in the UN forum Group #2, however it seams like I can not get to it now.

I will most my full argument once a case thread has been made.

 

[Goonie]

I specifically stated that I was speaking of personal opinions.

When did I offend them?

Since when is the word of a C3B citizen considered solid evidence Napoleon? Why don't you use some of my quotes as evidence. Then you will see I stated personal opinion and I was not rude at all. C3B also misunderstood other people at the UN. Their lack of proper english speaking has led them to misunderstand others aswell - not just Goonie.

Secondly Here is Article M :

Article M
The Consul of Foreign Affairs, the Foreign Affairs Deputy and the
Consul of Internal Affairs are de-facto ambassadors to all nations.
Regular Ambassadors are elected each term.
§1. Ambassadors shall only be chosen when Fanatikou has made
in-game contact with a rival civilization.

As you can see, Article M makes no mention to postings on the UN forum. The constitution does not say anywhere that a citizen is not allowed to post his or her own views on those forums.

I ask Napoleon to find a real law that I broke, not just a ficticious one that he wished existed. If he cannot find an actually law that has been broken, I suggest that this case - or lack thereof - not go before the courts. The people's of Fanatica (myself included) have better things to do then worry about non-existant laws being broken.

Adieu.

EDIT : Boy is CAT ever good at playing you guys. She was able to so easily manipulate our own ambassador into publically showing internal division. She was clearly using my comments as leverage . She used what I said as an excuse for cancelling all our previous treaties.Regardless of whether or not I had gone on the UN to publically disagree with the first ruling by the admins, they would have still found a scapegoat. Lets not forget how we have been treated by this Brazillian farce of a nation.

 

[Emp.Napoleon]

I specifically stated that I was speaking of personal opinions.

When did I offend them?

Since when is the word of a C3B citizen considered solid evidence Napoleon?

It was not a C3B citizen, it was the ambassador representing C3B, and it was a formal complaint from them too. It is solid evidence becuase C3B says that to them they were offended to an extent that it hampered our relationship.

Why don't you use some of my quotes as evidence. Then you will see I stated personal opinion and I was not rude at all. C3B also misunderstood other people at the UN. Their lack of proper english speaking has led them to misunderstand others aswell - not just Goonie.

I would love to use your quotes, but for some reason the forum with them is not there. Maybe I was taken off the list of people who can see it. If so, Ankka, can you add me?

Even if it was your personal opinion, it did hurt our relationship. IIRC it was offencive. As soon as I can get a quote, I will.

As you can see, Article M makes no mention to postings on the UN forum. The constitution does not say anywhere that a citizen is not allowed to post his or her own views on those forums.

It shown to C3B, and therefore they can take offence to it. In this way you were representing Fanatica and causing problem, becuase we already have an ambassador. It is like if at a chat a Fantican said: "IMHO I think we should declare war on C3B." Bad things would happen, and here it has.

 

[Goonie]

I never once insulted anyone. Get some quotes. My posts were related to the punishment handed down by 40J. Period. Throughout that whole thread, CAT grossly misunderstood me. I think my english is simply a little too sophisticated or she was looking to create a misunderstanding on purpose.

EDIT : Upon re-reading the whole thread again, I realize that CAT made personal comments about me. I never made personal comments. Perhaps EMP. you could convey to CAT that I feel her words have hampered our relationship. Since when are our ambassadors the lap dogs for foreigners? You will deal with me? Is that truly something you say to a foreigner? No, you show unity.

I think you should have done your research before you filed this CC Emp. Even you yourself admit that you cannot read the thread. Your whole accusation is based on nothing more than the word of a Brazillian team member, and we have all seen how good their word is.

EDIT 2: And you have yet to provide me with the law I broke - or didn't for that matter.

G'night.

 

[akots]

Not sure if there are any laws which might govern the posts of citizen Goonie at the UN or might imply some lawsuit upon the said citizen. But, I would like to note that we all, including specifically Emp, our honorable Ambassador to C3B, were working hard to build a decent relationship with C3B on the basis of mutual respect and benefit in this game. Well, now we have Ambassador complaining that the C3B citizens were offended by the said citizen Goonie and the citizens of C3B find the posts of the citizen Goonie inappropriate. It does not matter then are they right or wrong. It means the the said CFC citizen Goonie has messed up a lot in our policy without understanding it and has done direct harm to the CFC team may be even without violating any laws. This does not diminish the impact the said citizen had had on the game. It might be that the actions of citizen Goonie could have been more deleterious to our position in the game than the actions of the infamous JokerDF.

All citizens certainly have an immanent right to express their opinion including that at the UN forum as well. However, the citizens should with all due respect and diplomacy treat the members of the other teams, UN admins, and the UN forum. We might consider that if citizen Goonie will post the official apology to the C3B team in the UN forum as a clear indication of the good will of the said citizen and his desire to participate in restoration of the good and fair relationship with the C3B team. However, by no means we are able to enforce these actions on citizen Goonie. But this is my personal opinion.

Whatever is the opinion of the honorable JotC, we will know soon.