The Advantage of an Elite Army and how to make one yourself!

[Alvin]

Most people believe in the advantage of mass warfare using raw tanks and bomber support(Blitszerg). But I tell myself that quanitity and Quality matters. Usually, in the mordern age, you can get yourself 20-40 Mordern Armors to play around with. Think of the potente of making them all Elite.
Although Blitzserig is the fastest way to make your units Elite, I have a better solution without the massed bombing and killing cities. You first pick on the little people. Use your Mordern Armors(Tanks) to attack mainly obselte units to make them Elite (You can attack twice and get a promotion in your units) Once, I had over 40 Elite Mordern armors razing and killing anything on its way, and I got over three leaders a turn and turn them into armys to kill the stronger defenders such MIs or other MAs.
Leaders also reduce War Wariness, so I almost had no War Wariness in wars, although most of my wars last only two or three turns. You can take over the world with 3 armies of Elite MAs and 30 Elite MAs supporting them.

 

[Frisian Warrior]

Leaders also reduce War Wariness

I never heard that before. Do you mean that less people are unhappy just because they have around, or does the effect vanish once you use them for an army?

 

[Alvin]

Yes

 

[Frisian Warrior]

Sorry, I should have been clearer, the word 'been' was missing between 'they have' and 'around'. It is not a yes-or-no question, but an invitation to elaborate on your experience. As I said, it's the first time I hear that leaders have an effect on war weariness. As far as I know, war weariness grows when you have units in enemy territory and most leaders start their lives as units in enemy territory.

 

[Roland Johansen]

Frisian asked: if the leader had to be available or if the effect is still there when you use it to create an army. Yes, does not answer this question.
Also I have never heard of this effect before and I have read a lot of posts here. Are you really sure about this? Could it just possibly be that you don't lose a lot of units and therefore don't get a lot of war weariness? Have you tested this using the editor in debug mode or is it a game observation?
Sorry if I sound a bit harsh, but I haven't read about GL's reducing war weariness anywhere.

 

[elpadrino87]

I'm a little uncertain about having 3 leaders in one turn. Unless you were very lucky, and assuming that you changed your leaders right away into armies, I guess you could theoretically have more than one leader per turn. But I'm not 100% sure about that.

Personally, I rarely place tanks or MA in armies because an army can't attack more than once per turn, which for me drastically reduces the effectiveness of a tank's ability to attack multiple times a turn. In all the ages before the Modern age, I place offensive units in armies. But once I'm in the modern age, I usually place defensive units in armies so that you can have almost invincible defenders for your cities. It might be possible to have a lot of armies to make up for the attack once per turn rule, but that would be pretty hard to accomplish since you need 4 cities to support one army.

 

[Frisian Warrior]

My record stands at four leaders in one turn. Yes, you need to use them up before the next can appear. But that is no problem if the continent is railroaded and you need to finish a harbour somewhere in Corruptopolis.

Roland, what 's debug mode?

 

[wilbill]

Debug is a PTW editor feature that allows you to see everything going on in the game (no fog, etc) while the game is played. It's useful for experimenting, testing things. Like seeing if GL's have an effect on war weariness, as Roland suggested.
Bamspeedy and othes did a pretty complete study of WW recently. I don't believe they tested GL's, though, but I'm with Roland on this issue - don't think I've ever read a suggestion that they were linked in any way.

 

[Frisian Warrior]

Ah thanks. Does vanilla 1.29f perhaps have something similar?
I think I know why Bamspeedy didn't include leaders in the test. My question was a polite way of suggesting it is nonsense that they have a direct effect on weariness, but I 'd still like to know what made Alvin think otherwise.

 

[tao]

Originally posted by elpadrino87
I'm a little uncertain about having 3 leaders in one turn. Unless you were very lucky, and assuming that you changed your leaders right away into armies, I guess you could theoretically have more than one leader per turn. But I'm not 100% sure about that.

You can't have more than one Leader at a time, but several per turn.

Personally, I rarely place tanks or MA in armies because an army can't attack more than once per turn

IIRC, an army can attack as often as the combined number of attacks of its units.

 

[Chieftess]

Originally posted by elpadrino87
I'm a little uncertain about having 3 leaders in one turn. Unless you were very lucky, and assuming that you changed your leaders right away into armies, I guess you could theoretically have more than one leader per turn. But I'm not 100% sure about that.

It's possible when your RNG goes beserk with a militaristic civ. I've had 4 on one turn, and 5 on another. Just use up your Great Leader quickly.

 

[stormbind]

The most GL I have ever had is 2 in one game!

 

[elpadrino87]

Chieftess, is what Tao said about the second quote in his reply right? In my experience, I've placed three MA in one army, and that army was allowed to only attack once. Was that fixed in a patch? That's the only way I can see that Tao's claim is right.

I'm not trying to say anything about you Tao, I just want to make sure, so that in future games I will put MA's in armies, which would be pretty sweet.

 

[reddragon381]

I must concur with Tao. You can attack at least three times a turn (if you have that much movement). I once had an army of legionary attack the a city three times. So I guess this works for modern armor as well.

 

[Grille]

Originally posted by elpadrino87
Chieftess, is what Tao said about the second quote in his reply right? In my experience, I've placed three MA in one army, and that army was allowed to only attack once. Was that fixed in a patch? That's the only way I can see that Tao's claim is right.

I'm not trying to say anything about you Tao, I just want to make sure, so that in future games I will put MA's in armies, which would be pretty sweet.

Yep, issue fixed by patch. To be more precise: An army can launch as much attacks as it got movement points left (a 4MA-army could attack three times per turn). And an army also provides "Blitz" ability, i.e. a 3cav-army could attack three times, while a single cav could only attack once per turn.
On a related topic, note that pure marine armies are not able to launch an attack from a transport ship (vanilla civ3).

 

[Alvin]

Good dicussions, I might add, that armies could be made into several units, forexample, you can put 1 MA, 1 MI and 1 marine into it.