[vanilla] The Mechanics of Combat (vanilla)

[weregamer]

I've not seen more than 4, but perhaps I've not let any AIs get Arsenals built.

 

[Xiabed]

Thank you for this great article !

What about land ranged attacking naval and naval attacking land ranged ?
Does the "landed ranged vs ranged" rule applies in any case ?

 

[vexing]

Thank you for this great article !

What about land ranged attacking naval and naval attacking land ranged ?
Does the "landed ranged vs ranged" rule applies in any case ?

i haven't verified but i think land based ranged units will get their 25% defense vs ranged attacks bonus against all ranged attacks (including naval), and naval units will be at their base defense; the naval vs naval penalty 60% penalty will not apply.

 

[weregamer]

(Gah, not logged in for some reason and saw an old message as new.)

You also can never bombard civilian units or embarked military units except with a city or air strike, that's the thing I still sometimes forget - usually leading to the death of the unit that was supposed to be shooting, not attempting to capture.

 

[vexing]

You also can never bombard civilian units or embarked military units except with a city or air strike, that's the thing I still sometimes forget - usually leading to the death of the unit that was supposed to be shooting, not attempting to capture.

false.
rather than using the shortcut right mouse button attack (which defaults to move for ranged vs civilian), click the bombard button then click the civilian unit.

 

[The Pilgrim]

false.
rather than using the shortcut right mouse button attack (which defaults to move for ranged vs civilian), click the bombard button then click the civilian unit.

When you declare war by right mouse button clicking civilian unit the attack is ranged. I accidentally shoot CS workers all the time.

 

[Piousflea]

Are there updated versions of the equations for G&K, and does anyone have an idea of how air combat works? The formulae seem to be very different from either normal ranged or normal melee combat.

 

[vintagemagic]

combat calculations aside, there is a strategy that works every time in combat.

1. Take a city over of another civ with resources or luxuries.

2. Make sure you take the city over with a horse or move after attack.

3. Move the unit out of the city.

4. sell the luxuries and resources in that city.

5. the civ will literally get all its units to attack that city or multiple ones if you have a larger map. on diety, which I play every time, this will always be the case.

6. have ranged units ready to take it back and the horse or unit that can move after turn ready to take it back.

7. repeat, until the melee units of the enemy are gone.

this strategy is a glitch in the AI when playing diety is really the only way you can win on a huge or large map.

When it comes to air, some thing applies, as they will use their air units to basically bombard the city only generally. to make it easier to take the city back, have anti air in multiple hexes so you can intercept any attacks on your units that will try to get the city back (aka a tank).

But the truth is on diety, if you actually survive to industrial era, you probably are doing really well to win.

 

[Ichabod]

I'm asking regarding G&K, though I don't think BNW changed anything in that regard.

The thread says that attacking a 1 HP city with a Unit will always result in the Unit capturing the City, even if there was a massive difference in the Unit/City strenght. Is that still true or was this changed at some point?

 

[Alzadar]

I'm asking regarding G&K, though I don't think BNW changed anything in that regard.

The thread says that attacking a 1 HP city with a Unit will always result in the Unit capturing the City, even if there was a massive difference in the Unit/City strenght. Is that still true or was this changed at some point?

Well I'm not sure about cities with 1 HP, but a city with 0 hp will fall to any attacker, and the attacker will survive (often with 1 HP himself).

 

[Ichabod]

Well I'm not sure about cities with 1 HP, but a city with 0 hp will fall to any attacker, and the attacker will survive (often with 1 HP himself).

Yeah, I think it says 1 hp due to old mechanics, what I'm interested to know is the 0 hp case (like when you bombarded the city with ranged attacks). Thanks a lot for the info!

 

[Lord Yanaek]

You can capture an industrial era city with a scout after you bomb it to 0 health.
Did it once as i had a 3 move scout (scouting 3 is great, too bad you have to fight against a civ with your scout to get it) and my cavalries were dead

 

[Amarr Emperor]

would someone PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE make a BNW version of this

 

[Minor Annoyance]

Is there an updates version of this for the newer combat model?

 

[Tiramisu]

Is there an updates version of this for the newer combat model?

Yes, you can read it in the source code of the CvGameCoreDLL. You can also read my post, but it is written in German: http://www.civforum.de/showthread.php?89963-Wie-berechnet-sich-der-Schaden-bei-K%E4mpfen&p=6520494&viewfull=1#post6520494

If you want to get access to the Code, then you have to follow this guide: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=479374

 

[beetle]

Is there an updates version of this for the newer combat model?

Aside from unit health being 100 points instead of 10, what has changed?

 

[Tiramisu]

In my (German) post I wrote down the values for BNW:

GC.getWOUNDED_DAMAGE_MULTIPLIER() = 33
GC.getMAX_HIT_POINTS() = 100
GC.getATTACK_SAME_STRENGTH_MIN_DAMAGE() = 2400
GC.getATTACK_SAME_STRENGTH_POSSIBLE_EXTRA_DAMAGE() = 1200
GC.getCITY_ATTACKING_DAMAGE_MOD() = 100
GC.getATTACKING_CITY_MELEE_DAMAGE_MOD() = 100

 

[JiteshShadow]

Thanks much for this. I actually enjoyed reading the entire thing and taking down some notes. Did the same with the ZOC formulas

 

[joncnunn]

Aside from unit health being 100 points instead of 10, what has changed?

In my (German) post I wrote down the values for BNW:

GC.getWOUNDED_DAMAGE_MULTIPLIER() = 33
GC.getMAX_HIT_POINTS() = 100
GC.getATTACK_SAME_STRENGTH_MIN_DAMAGE() = 2400
GC.getATTACK_SAME_STRENGTH_POSSIBLE_EXTRA_DAMAGE() = 1200
GC.getCITY_ATTACKING_DAMAGE_MOD() = 100
GC.getATTACKING_CITY_MELEE_DAMAGE_MOD() = 100

Scanning the article, the very first screenshot appears to be from a very early version of Vanilla, when Great Generals provided bigger bonuses and so isn't exactly right even for Vanilla.

All screenshots with units are likely to have the wrong base strength because those were greatly changed between Vanilla and G&K.

It's basically the same mechanics though, the biggest side effect (which was intended) between Vanilla's 10 and G&K / BNW 100 is that the randomness range was significantly reduced and that the first three "Rules of Thumb" need revised.

 

[cammcken]

I think I read somewhere that a city bombard attack uses the defender's combat strength ( ) and not the defender's ranged strength c5rangedstrength. Any confirmation?

And also, does the Siege promotion work when defending against city bombards? Someone said this as well. Does Cover work too, if this is so?