The Unwashed Crusade: A Bannor Story
- Thread starter Shatner
- Start date
cyther
Lord of the Dance
Very amazing, looking forward to the next one.
Shatner
Warlord
I fired off the world spell in the same turn that the Crusade-induced anarchy ended (getting me an extra 11 or so demagogues). I had three uninspiring cities vs the Clan's eleven so it seemed like a double dose of demagogue was in order to get the crusade started on the right foot. It did have a significant impact in that I survived. I have noticed that each conflict has four phases and I wouldn't have made it through phase two without the extra troops:
1) Surprise! You run over the border and cry TAG! while looting and/or pillaging. The enemy swears and defenestrates the ambassador of your nation. Hopefully they were on the first floor at the time.
2) Counter-Surge. Sure you had all your best and brightest lined up for the blitzkrieg, but your enemy was not so Machiavellian. Now his highly promoted force of butt-kickers are here to really test your mettle. Brace for impact!
3) Grind. This is potentially the shortest or the longest phase of the entire conflict. It could be that the 1st line of defense was also the last and now it's just a foot race to the enemy capital; proceed to step 4 and collect 200gp. Or it could be a bitter trial of which empire can fire mooks at each other the fastest.
4) Mop up. You have crushed them under your sandaled feet and it is now time to take as much spoils as you can carry. Maybe it's just a city. Maybe it's only to convince them to become your vassal in perpetuity. Or maybe its to use their entire kingdom as your summer empire... you know, when it gets cold back at your Winter Palace.
Os Gabella was one long, loooong Grind.
I am glad you all enjoyed this. I have been playing FfH a long time but this particular game amused me so much that I had to write a little ode to it. I enjoyed relaying the tale of how some filthy fightin' fundies conquered the world. However, this represented an exceptional game which made for a particularly good tale; not something I am guaranteed to reproduce again soon. I am going to try playing another game or two (ferreting away screen shots as they come up) and seeing if they turn into something I can make another thread about. We'll see if they pan out...
orangelex44
Partisan
This thread deserves a boot.
cIV_khanh93
Prince
- Joined
- Nov 8, 2008
- Messages
- 528
wow. when you were talking about the economic uptrun Iwas like HOly crap, hes actually going to make it....
Atnanor
+2 Beer Affinity
Hes gone and joined the legends of olde...
Tielby
Prince
Wow. Just wow. That is some quality storytelling, and truly epic gaming. Thank you orangelex for bumping it. I overlooked it the first time around. 
sylvanllewelyn
Perma-newb
- Joined
- Oct 19, 2006
- Messages
- 1,702
Your game report raised a question: how does the "x number of free units" from civics apply to demagogs? I would have demagogs and other units, but would the "x number"
a) apply to demagogs, in which case the benefit is wasted and I still have to pay for my other units? OR
b) "x number of free units for units that do not require upkeep"? I am guessing if that's the case, the actual implementation would be "total army upkeep minus number of units that you can support for free".
If it's a), I'm better off playing Clan of Embers or Doviello, but if it's b), then I can see the benefit of an eternal crusade. It's like the Doviello really: if you conquer enough land, you will have enough health and hapiness resources to forget about aqueducts and festivals.
a) apply to demagogs, in which case the benefit is wasted and I still have to pay for my other units? OR
b) "x number of free units for units that do not require upkeep"? I am guessing if that's the case, the actual implementation would be "total army upkeep minus number of units that you can support for free".
If it's a), I'm better off playing Clan of Embers or Doviello, but if it's b), then I can see the benefit of an eternal crusade. It's like the Doviello really: if you conquer enough land, you will have enough health and hapiness resources to forget about aqueducts and festivals.
Indeed, it is the army size u can field in battle for absolutely free. Only crusade has such a justified ridiculous number. The only times I have had such a crusading force was when I already won. I must try this awesomely stupid tactic of GLORY 
Shatner
Warlord
I'm not sure I completely understand your post. What I think you are saying, and correct me if I'm wrong, is this:
The Crusade civic gives you a lot of free unit support but then gives you a lot of free units (demagogs), meaning that all the extra support is eaten up by the demagogs and eventually you'll have to pay support for your normal units (champions, confessors, etc.).
If that is what you are saying, that is an accurate assessment of the situation. Demagogs cost support and DO use up their share of the free support Crusade gets you. Having established that, I was running Crusade and Military State for the bulk of the game and ended up EXCEEDING the +191 free units those civics were getting me. That meant I had 150+ demagogs running around conquering heretics (or, towards the end, slowly exhausting the heretics that dismembered them)... that I didn't spend a single hammer on... at all. Having a civic give you a free, bonus army and then cover the support expense of that bonus army is AWESOME! The fact that it doesn't also support my original army is me complaining my gift wasn't wrapped in $20 bills.
The Clan can build an enormous force faster and earlier in the tech-tree than the Bannor can, with or without crusade. However, they have to pay support for all those units AND they have to actually build half of them (apparently warrens are some sort of orcish cloning facility fueled by the perpetual flames of Bhall; I suspect steam-punk). By the end, Sabby was commanding an army that was 4/5ths demagogs meaning that 4/5ths of that force cost me nothing to build. That's the fun and power of crusade: all those towns that are netting you extra commerce are suddenly netting you off-brand champions every dozen or so turns. My only problem was getting all the new recruits to the front fast enough.
Marksman77
Aethernaut
Bumping the best read on these forums for the benefit and education of new forum members.
Read it for the nth time and rolled on the floor for the nth time...
Read it for the nth time and rolled on the floor for the nth time...
aimlessgun
King
- Joined
- Jan 4, 2010
- Messages
- 783
Bumping the best read on these forums for the benefit and education of new forum members.
Read it for the nth time and rolled on the floor for the nth time...
Thanks, I enjoyed it. Am a bit disappointed that it's old and I'm guessing the author is no longer around heh.
Marksman77
Aethernaut
You can also search for other stories by Shatner. There were four of them, all great, but I love this one the most. Maybe because this was the first one.
The author announced he'll cover the Sheiam next and then he dissapeared. I blame Hyborem.
The author announced he'll cover the Sheiam next and then he dissapeared. I blame Hyborem.
Its just really, really hard to RP ALL of the Shieams elements AND survive. imho there are two ways of going about it. One way is to be the arcane rulers ... with many, many sorcerors, and zombies to protect them (zombies with mobility 1 of course, they are just meatshields) ... collect death mana, and use death, chaos, and entropy magic.
The second course of action is to go (instead of a few great science cities) to go a larger number of production cities. In this version of the game your goal is to cause the appocalypse. You will have the riders of Perdition on your side, so its all ok. Found the AV relatively early, and make sure those early cities are all in good locations. Then, make sure your AV city is a powerhouse. Try to find horses if you can, and once you find horses, summon Hyborem, and begin to build your Hooved fleet of the Riders of Perdition. If you can, be running civics like Military State, Sacrifice the Weak, and Godking. Build the Heroic epic in your AV holy city, build the Form of the Titan somewhere else. Build the Prophecy of Ragnarok anywhere you like. let the hell-terrain spread to your cities (especially the one with horses) oh, and also grab marble if possible. Then, once you have nightmare and sheut stone, build up your invasion force of Perdition Riders. 8 str horsearcher stack of Doooom. hopefully at least half of these horsearchers have either the Stigmata promotion or the Prophecy Mark promotion. (or both)
Then bring about armageddon, first rising the AC to 70, (to build the Messhaber) and then all the way to 100 once you have him.
//nightmare promo "should" cause immune to fear, in order to help out ur horsearchers, but if its not possible, then perhaps get (should I dare say) spirit mana, in order to protect urself from those unruly Appocalypse Riders.
//once you have defeated Stephanos, Buboes, and Yersina ... start building planar gates, because by that time you might actually have enough AC to make them worthwhile. Always make sure u have a real army before building up the gates though.
Then, using the power of Armageddon ... strike fear into your opponents by using the Worldspell once it reaches 100 AC (although keep in mind that ull need to use it before Armageddon itself triggers, or the AC will lower due to prophecy mark units dying) ... otherwise youll need to wait until it reaches 100 once more.
Either way, once Armageddon hits, roll them over with the Messhaber one by one.
The second course of action is to go (instead of a few great science cities) to go a larger number of production cities. In this version of the game your goal is to cause the appocalypse. You will have the riders of Perdition on your side, so its all ok. Found the AV relatively early, and make sure those early cities are all in good locations. Then, make sure your AV city is a powerhouse. Try to find horses if you can, and once you find horses, summon Hyborem, and begin to build your Hooved fleet of the Riders of Perdition. If you can, be running civics like Military State, Sacrifice the Weak, and Godking. Build the Heroic epic in your AV holy city, build the Form of the Titan somewhere else. Build the Prophecy of Ragnarok anywhere you like. let the hell-terrain spread to your cities (especially the one with horses) oh, and also grab marble if possible. Then, once you have nightmare and sheut stone, build up your invasion force of Perdition Riders. 8 str horsearcher stack of Doooom. hopefully at least half of these horsearchers have either the Stigmata promotion or the Prophecy Mark promotion. (or both)
Then bring about armageddon, first rising the AC to 70, (to build the Messhaber) and then all the way to 100 once you have him.
//nightmare promo "should" cause immune to fear, in order to help out ur horsearchers, but if its not possible, then perhaps get (should I dare say) spirit mana, in order to protect urself from those unruly Appocalypse Riders.
//once you have defeated Stephanos, Buboes, and Yersina ... start building planar gates, because by that time you might actually have enough AC to make them worthwhile. Always make sure u have a real army before building up the gates though.
Then, using the power of Armageddon ... strike fear into your opponents by using the Worldspell once it reaches 100 AC (although keep in mind that ull need to use it before Armageddon itself triggers, or the AC will lower due to prophecy mark units dying) ... otherwise youll need to wait until it reaches 100 once more.
Either way, once Armageddon hits, roll them over with the Messhaber one by one.
Personally I love Bannor's crusade mechanic. I don't think I could ever be as insanely single mindedly aggresive as Shatner role played in this scenerio since I am a builder type, but if you lay down some basics and build a decent economy and then go on a crusade, it almost seems like its just a a matter of time until you win unless the enemy is trying to do an Altar win or a tower win and they are close.
I don't think Shatner ever mentioned map size in his OP - I have played a couple of vast crusades on large maps, and the numbers of demagogues does really sort of get out of hand. In my last crusade I had at least 200 demagogues on hand and more were coming every turn, and this is even though I had lost 100 in battle, and this hasn't even been the biggest crusade I have fought. At that point, just getting them to where you need them is a hassle, but it is comforting to know that if you had a stack of 30 demagogues and they got crushed by some vast enemy force that there are another 30 just waiting to be thrown right in right after.
Someone mentioned going Kilmorph early to get the Mines of Baladur (or is it Galdur?), and I have to agree that that is a great strategy for Bannor, plus also saving a stonewarden or two to ensure that all your demagogues have shield of faith eventually. That plus enchanted sword gives each free unit a 30% boost. Add courage and they all have medic 1 and are immune to fear -if you are Sabathiel, all you have to do is have them survive a couple of battles and they quickly get to level 3. Give them shock 1 and 2 and morale from a Flag Bearer, and you get at least 80% extra power attacking cities, on top of the 30% boost of those two spells.
I don't think Shatner ever mentioned map size in his OP - I have played a couple of vast crusades on large maps, and the numbers of demagogues does really sort of get out of hand. In my last crusade I had at least 200 demagogues on hand and more were coming every turn, and this is even though I had lost 100 in battle, and this hasn't even been the biggest crusade I have fought. At that point, just getting them to where you need them is a hassle, but it is comforting to know that if you had a stack of 30 demagogues and they got crushed by some vast enemy force that there are another 30 just waiting to be thrown right in right after.
Someone mentioned going Kilmorph early to get the Mines of Baladur (or is it Galdur?), and I have to agree that that is a great strategy for Bannor, plus also saving a stonewarden or two to ensure that all your demagogues have shield of faith eventually. That plus enchanted sword gives each free unit a 30% boost. Add courage and they all have medic 1 and are immune to fear -if you are Sabathiel, all you have to do is have them survive a couple of battles and they quickly get to level 3. Give them shock 1 and 2 and morale from a Flag Bearer, and you get at least 80% extra power attacking cities, on top of the 30% boost of those two spells.
